[Xymordos]

I would suggest the UM Pure Platform 6, UERM and ATH W2002

 

[MHOE]

Quote:

Maybe you can help me out, David. I am really looking into a pair of Beyerdynamics, whether it be the DT 770 PRO or the DT 880 is where I am stuck. I am leaning towards a closed set, are the 880s open enough to be in that category? Would you take the 770s at $198 or the 880s at $250, both at 250 ohms? Also amp needed to power either of them? Thanks!

 
880 for sure...

 

[MHOE]

Quote:

Did you hear Paradox? I have both Paradox and HE-500 and I would prefer them to HiFiMans any day. I don't want to say that HE-500 is a bad heaphone, they are actually great, but Paradox... WoW!

 
What do you find better about Paradox in comparison with HE-500? My view is only based on measurements which speaks for HE-500... It may sound strange but it's not - if you are after fidelity, you want to own headphones that measure the best in your price category along with passing other wanted aspects like level of neutrality across frequency spectrum, open vs closed design, amp requirements, build quality etc. For me, it's crucial to choose my pair using objective info... I am not after "better sound" but "truer to source".
 
http://www.innerfidelity.com/images/HiFiMANHE500.pdf
http://www.innerfidelity.com/images/FostexT50RPDIYModifiedLFFParadox.pdf
 
I am not trying to say Paradox are bad... Not really, I am still interested in opinions about how they sound!
I have also looked at this measurement:
 
http://www.innerfidelity.com/images/FostexT50RPDIYModifiedLFFnosocks.pdf
 
This looks better that the other two Paradox measurements available on innerfidelity, like it! Not flat in bass and mids like HE-500 along with peaky highs but most probably this version is worth the money (around 500USD, I guess?). I wonder why there is info missing about %THD+noise at 100dB...

 

[remilio]

Quote:

 
What do you find better about Paradox in comparison with HE-500? My view is only based on measurements which speaks for HE-500... It may sound strange but it's not - if you are after fidelity, you want to own headphones that measure the best in your price category along with passing other wanted aspects like level of neutrality across frequency spectrum, open vs closed design, amp requirements, build quality etc. For me, it's crucial to choose my pair using objective info... I am not after "better sound" but "truer to source".
 
http://www.innerfidelity.com/images/HiFiMANHE500.pdf
http://www.innerfidelity.com/images/FostexT50RPDIYModifiedLFFParadox.pdf
 
I am not trying to say Paradox are bad... Not really, I am still interested in opinions about how they sound!
I have also looked at this measurement:
 
http://www.innerfidelity.com/images/FostexT50RPDIYModifiedLFFnosocks.pdf
 
This looks better that the other two Paradox measurements available on innerfidelity, like it! Not flat in bass and mids like HE-500 along with peaky highs but most probably this version is worth the money (around 500USD, I guess?). I wonder why there is info missing about %THD+noise at 100dB...

Current version is the last one you mentioned There's a thread about them, for example, this post http://www.head-fi.org/t/633956/the-t50rp-paradox-review-mini-tour-impressions#post_8822845 contains links to some reviews, mine too.

 

[davewave]

Quote:

my first instinct is to suggest the ES5, but i do think the highs will sound more rolled off than maybe even the Westone 3.  However, the decay and midrange is wonderful.  It's lush and wonderful with rock music.  With classical, the upper register sometimes gets smeared.  The JH13 is much more neutral by comparison, but also, a bit more picky.  I don't think you'll be disappointed either way....
 
The JH13 is closer to an HD800, while the ES5 is closer to an LCD-2/3
 
When the JH13 is amped in a high-end setup, it begins to be able to do things that I don't feel the ES5 can.  But in a portable setup, I almost always opt for the ES5 (especially unamped)

I think I get what you're saying with the analogies to HD800 for JH13 and LCD-2/3 for ES5, but unfortunately I've never had the opportunity to audition those cans.
 
Which of the two, JH13 or ES5, would be the HD600?  That's something I can relate to.

 

[DavidMahler]

Quote:

Maybe you can help me out, David. I am really looking into a pair of Beyerdynamics, whether it be the DT 770 PRO or the DT 880 is where I am stuck. I am leaning towards a closed set, are the 880s open enough to be in that category? Would you take the 770s at $198 or the 880s at $250, both at 250 ohms? Also amp needed to power either of them? Thanks!

I'll try to help
 
The 880s are definitely considered "open back" but they are able to attenuate some sound.  Not nearly to the same degree as the 770.  However, the 880 really does sound better overall, at least to my ears.  The 770s have a bigger bass response, but ultimately less transparency.  If you go with the 250 ohm version, you will need an amp to get the best out of them.  The 32 Ohm version without an amp will sound much better than the 250 Ohm version without an amp.
 
Hope this helps.

 

[DavidMahler]

Quote:

I think I get what you're saying with the analogies to HD800 for JH13 and LCD-2/3 for ES5, but unfortunately I've never had the opportunity to audition those cans.
 
Which of the two, JH13 or ES5, would be the HD600?  That's something I can relate to.

That's a tough one.  I would say the ES5 sound closer to the HD650 than the JH13 does and ultimately I may find that the ES5 resembles the HD600 moreso than the JH13, HOWEVER (and this is important) only when unamped.  If you amp the JH13, it gains depth and starts to bloom.  

 

[Pianist]

Quote:

 
http://www.innerfidelity.com/images/FostexT50RPDIYModifiedLFFnosocks.pdf

 
These are fantastic results for closed headphones. Should sound pretty superb and worth the price.

 

[Pianist]

Quote:

Originally Posted by hifimanrookie /img/forum/go_quote.gif
 
for ur info..the hm602 doesnt pair well with a westone..i dont know why...but it doesnt..

 
Actually, I auditioned HM-601 and Westone 4 recently and that combo sounded very impressive to my ears - very full, dynamic and balanced. I think UM3X has too much treble roll off though which is probably why it sounded bad with the Hifiman players - Westone 4 has more treble presence and extension.
 
 

My Fostex t50rp Paradox measures better than my hd800 and he-6, and it also measures better than lcd2/3's; it sounds really good, and is neutral as can be, versatile, etc. But again, it is no where near as resolving as those headphones. It also has more resonance. A few people who have tried it where not impressed because they could not appreciate the near perfect freq response of the headphones, and would chose stuff like HD25's, AKG k550 or even denon ah-d1100 over them! I would never, mainly because the sound tuning is fantastic on the paradox; but again, the fostex is 100$ headphone, the driver isn't the best out there for extracting details and dimension; albeit the great freq response.

 
Actually, T50RP driver has more going for it than just good frequency response - it also puts out clarity that most dynamic headphones can't match and it is capable of strikingly accurate timbre that most dynamics and even my HD650 and HE-500 can't do sometimes IMO.

 

[hifimanrookie]

Actually, I auditioned HM-601 and Westone 4 recently and that combo sounded very impressive to my ears - very full, dynamic and balanced. I think UM3X has too much treble roll off though which is probably why it sounded bad with the Hifiman players - Westone 4 has more treble presence and extension.

U maybe right about that..as the um3x sounded absolutely stunning on my cowon d2.. The original version..all metal..not the plastic rubbish one that came next. As the d2 happens to be a very neutral player in contrary to the hm602...in my ears anyway and if i didnt heard a hm602 by accident at a friend i probably still would choose him as my main source..its that good..its a mini goliath soundwise..and the um3x pairs welll as its extreme unforgiving nature..and ur also right..the westone 4 is a better pair with the warmer hm602.

By the way..its said the 601 has a more leaner sound then the more warmer 602 i have..but then again..i read that hifiman changed the soundsignature on the new 602slimline a bit..so maybe the westone would pair well with the newer version..

 

[Pianist]

David, I've been reading through your review again and while overall I find it almost flawless, I have an issue with your points about lack of euphony in certain headphones that you otherwise describe as technically brilliant, like HD800 for example (I haven't heard any of the Stax 'phones, so can't judged based on those). In particular you describe that euphony are certain distortions that add humaneness to the sound. I would agree that distortions present in recordings can do that, but when distortion is present in the gear, I think it actually makes the music sound less humane, because it adds things to recordings that weren't there originally and that would almost certainly not be added by the sound engineer. Thus, if a headphone is technically brilliant, then it should allow the listener to hear recordings the way they were meant to be heard (provided that the source is equally brilliant of course), and should allow whatever emotion was captured in the recording to be heard well. Personally, I found HD800 very fun sounding with with some music.

 

[KG Jag]

Thanks for putting this together.  It will probably sadden you to know that you have similar taste in headphones (at least the ones with which I am familiar) as a 60 year old!

 

[hifimanrookie]

Thanks for putting this together.  It will probably sadden you to know that you have similar taste in headphones (at least the ones with which I am familiar) as a 60 year old!

Really? But most 60 year olds have bad hearing aids.lolz..so they wont be using sennheiser,hifiman, audeze, stax or even beyerdynamic and the sorts..as they would sit right in front of full size loudspeakers on full power...hahaha

 

[DavidMahler]

Quote:

David, I've been reading through your review again and while overall I find it almost flawless, I have an issue with your points about lack of euphony in certain headphones that you otherwise describe as technically brilliant, like HD800 for example (I haven't heard any of the Stax 'phones, so can't judged based on those). In particular you describe that euphony are certain distortions that add humaneness to the sound. I would agree that distortions present in recordings can do that, but when distortion is present in the gear, I think it actually makes the music sound less humane, because it adds things to recordings that weren't there originally and that would almost certainly not be added by the sound engineer. Thus, if a headphone is technically brilliant, then it should allow the listener to hear recordings the way they were meant to be heard (provided that the source is equally brilliant of course), and should allow whatever emotion was captured in the recording to be heard well. Personally, I found HD800 very fun sounding with with some music.

believe it or not, we are both dancing around the same fence.  It's hard to explain, but if you can think of tubes as providing more harmonic distortion than solid state, then maybe that will be a good base point of where I'm coming from
Quote:

Thanks for putting this together.  It will probably sadden you to know that you have similar taste in headphones (at least the ones with which I am familiar) as a 60 year old!

I'm not really sure what this means haha
 
I would presume the average young person around 20 would be more familiar with Beats and Bose
 
Maybe as one climbs the ladder in age you become aware of Sennheiser, Grado, Shure etc
 
 
But I don't think I see where you're going with that statement.

Also, it would never sadden me to have shared taste in something with a 60 year old.  A lot of the music I listen to is 300 years old haha.

 

[MHOE]

Quote:

 
These are fantastic results for closed headphones. Should sound pretty superb and worth the price.

 
Agree. If that is the current measurement of Paradox, these are definitely the best closed phones in their price category from what I have seen so far...
 
Unfortunately, I am very sensitive to treble (e.g. IMHO D7000 are clearly bright-sounding phones, painful to my ears quite sometimes even though they are rather dark according to many headfiers (David also does not mention anything wrong about their treble) and measurements which show no emphasised treble in comparison to many other phones. Therefore only cans like Audeze or HD650 can impress me enough =/