The Hardest hitting Headphones are.. ( "The EXTREME BASS Club")
Jul 15, 2014 at 6:34 PM Post #1,261 of 12,991
thanks so so much for everyone and u specifically

i rally wish if someone can tell me , i have sms 50 cent bluetooth and i can use it wired too it has quite some bass, its veiled in mids and highs, is getting the sz2000 or vmoda an upgrade to sms

its strange sms by 50 cent is not hailed at all here 

also can i fit alpha dog pads on vmoda


You are very welcome and I hope you understand my comment was meant in jest, though I removed it in case it was misinterpreted, but not in time for you to quote me - lol :D

I understand that you don't want to be disappointed with whichever basshead headphone you decide upon after being disappointed with your LCD-2 headphones.

The SMS cans albeit not your exact model do get some love by HBB - he owns a model of that brand and appears to appreciate them for what they are and believe he has made a review.

I think perhaps SMS headphones as a brand is thought of here on head-fi by the majority in the same way as beats is regarded - which is with contempt, something I disagree with strongly, but know I am in a small minority and is a shame as beats and no doubt SMS are more than credible headphone brands, but it would seem within the audio world that old prejudices die hard.
 
Jul 15, 2014 at 6:45 PM Post #1,262 of 12,991
To anyone still on the fence about getting the JVC HA-SZ2000/HA-SZ1000, first ask yourself if you truly want the loudest bass reproduction currently possible in headphones:
 
   
I measured both the SZ and the 77X for bass SPL and the SZ reached 125dB with no distortion, while the 77X reached 109dB before distortion (the 77X was able to touch 110dB in the measurement video, but I wasn't paying attention lol). You can see the posts here and here. My RadioShack digital sound meter maxes out at 126dB, and in my subsequent measurement the SZ was able to touch 126dB easily, so I bought a new SPL meter that can read up to 130dB.
 
How loud is 125dB-126dB bass? A quick YouTube search for "125dB bass SPL" yields the following videos:
 

 

 

 
The subwoofers above don't even reach 124dB, even after placing the meter just inches away. So, do you have portable bluetooth speakers in mind that are better than the above subwoofers?
 
 
JVC HA-SZ2000 maximum bass SPL before distortion:
 

 
 
JVC HA-MR77X maximum bass SPL before distortion:
 

 
 
Read the original post for the measurement details.


 
If not, you're better off with something cheaper. Or something already designed with your favored frequency response so you won't have to EQ (but seriously, I recommend EQing anyway since you're kinda doing it already with your volume control). Personally, 126dB bass is enough for my normal crazy listening--in fact it's enough to make me seriously fear for my hearing lol. But I am certain that I would be much, much happier if I had headphones that could make the bass go ... louder. And that is the point of this thread.
 
As for not using an amp: I don't believe the SZ performs worse than headphones with a similar headphone sensitivity (measured in dB/mW; headphones with similar size drivers usually have similar sensitivities). For example, the SZ2000 has a sensitivity of 108dB/mW, while the V-Moda M-100 has 103dB/mW--this suggests that the SZ would sound louder than the M-100 with the same power. The Sennheiser CX500 in-ears has 113dB/mW. The problem is that you can't hear its full potential, making the purchase pointless unless you plan to get an amp later. Another problem with not using an amp or not using a sufficient one (you don't want an amp with a very high output impedance, a very low input voltage capacity, and a very low output power) is that you might mistake source distortion as driver distortion (your headphones are very capable of accurately reproducing the sound of distortion lol).
 
Jul 15, 2014 at 7:06 PM Post #1,264 of 12,991
Hawaiibadboy


imagejpg1-79.jpg
 
Jul 15, 2014 at 7:29 PM Post #1,265 of 12,991
as i mentioned i am using the following setup, iPod touch 5 amped by chord hugo

the whole reason why i keep asking so many questions between both the vmoda and sz2000 is because the chord hugo has no bass boost but its considered one of the best portable dac/amps and its kinda neutral in sound sig

so i have only to rely on the eq i can get from apps in app store of my iPod touch this is why i am concerned if i order the sz2000 it will not be the bass headphone i wish for 


I don't think the chord hugo with your iPod is going to give you the bass you want on any headphone TBH.

What I would recommend to you is this option - the SZ1000 not the SZ2000, because the sound signature is less veiled with the SZ1000 but bass is nearly but not quite as strong when bass EQ is applied - in addition to the Fiio E17 portable headphone amp/dac.

I suggest this option for the SZ1000 as described above already, but the Fiio E17 because unlike your chord hugo, the E17 has bass and treble increase and decrease controls which would enable you to turn up the bass to a head vibrating level should you want to go that far whilst also increase the treble which may give you the detailing you don't want to lose.

The Fiio E17 would be an extra outlay, but considerably cheaper than your chord hugo ($139), but the SZ1000 ($150-200) is lower cost than the SZ2000 ($250-295).

I have both the SZ1000 and E17 and can recommend this combination as an option for you to seriously consider in delivering what you are specifically looking for and in addition, the earpads on the SZ1000 are much better that the SZ2000 IMO, to the extent I am not looking to make any pad change with my SZ1000 headphones, but nonetheless the option is still there for you to change them if you so wish.

The Fiio E17 or similar device that has bass and treble EQ is, IMO, a crucial factor for you to get the sound you want as without, I think you will be disappointed in stock sound signature of the SZ1000 or the SZ2000 amped with your current cord hugo only.



 
Jul 15, 2014 at 8:38 PM Post #1,266 of 12,991
I will speak to what cb3723 is saying.  I agree with him.  I have an iPod classic, Fiio E17, and the SZ1000's.  It's a great combination to get the headshake it sounds like you're looking for.  The pads on the SZ1000 leak sound at high volume, so I'm looking to change pads to the MrSpeakers Alpha dog pads.  Should be a better seal, and when you get that seal, you get even better bass.  
 
Jul 15, 2014 at 9:00 PM Post #1,267 of 12,991
  I will speak to what cb3723 is saying.  I agree with him.  I have an iPod classic, Fiio E17, and the SZ1000's.  It's a great combination to get the headshake it sounds like you're looking for.  The pads on the SZ1000 leak sound at high volume, so I'm looking to change pads to the MrSpeakers Alpha dog pads.  Should be a better seal, and when you get that seal, you get even better bass.  

 

 
Jul 15, 2014 at 10:00 PM Post #1,268 of 12,991
  I have quite a few headphones mostly all bass orientated Iv uploaded some pics of my cans 
 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 
 
 
 
There you go the pro500's bass paper test.


 
 
  oh thats disappointing are you gonna send them back thanks for letting us know as I was going to buy these also might swap them for NAD Viso HP50 and the Pioneer - SE-MX9-K see how they fair as basshead cans, and thanks for your impressions as it really does help with buying decisions and this is exactly why this thread is awesome for us bassheads as we can learn and share our experiences and impression with headphones avoiding the ****ty ones and promoting the beastly headphones. Honestly the search for the more BASSHEAD can is forever ongoing even with the sz1000/2000, xb1000 and the pro500's im still looking for more cans that would make me poo myself lmao.

 
 
ati, I just had to reblog that collection. I think what makes me most jealous is your Alienware laptop. I mean, look at that. Thanks for the vid too! And yes to cans that'll make us poo ourselves!
 
Jul 15, 2014 at 10:14 PM Post #1,269 of 12,991

 
 
 
 
Thank you!!!
 
We been doing some righteous damage. Good damage. Some stuff needed fixin round planet bass and we been doin just that.
 
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The SMS guy...
everybody has set you right. 
 
 

 
 
2 kinds of bass in headphones.
The kind you hear
The kind you feel and hear
 
THE SMS sound nice. I also wonder why a set of cans that sound very much like the M100 but better IMO don't get more love but they were over pricepoint. and the build quality is not near V-Moda's. They isolate really well and sound awesome. The SMS DJ are another example of the Yamaha Pro 500 in that they get much less respect than they deserve when compared to what does get the respect/attention. Chalk that up to marketing and group think for a nice cold bowl of stupid soup.
 
 
 
The sz1000 + the 17 seem like a very good rec for you.
 
Jul 15, 2014 at 10:16 PM Post #1,270 of 12,991
I must start this post with a huge thank you to everyone that has posted vids and proof of the JVC SZ-1000 headphones. In the last month, I have purchased a Fiio E17 Amp\DAC for my iPod, and the 1000's. I now have what I've been searching for.

I have 2 12" subs in my truck running off a 1200w amp. I love the BASS! I now have that in my headphones. With the treble set to +4, and the bass set to +10 on the Fiio, at 40 on the volume, I get that headshake I've always wanted. It's FANTASTIC! To anyone still hesitating, just do it!

Thank you.

I will post a vid when I get my computer back from repair, right now I only have my tablet.

 
 
Well, I can honestly tell you that you didn't lead me astray in my purchase of the Fiio E17 and the SZ-1000's. I'm getting my laptop back from repair tomorrow, and I'll be sure to post a vid of my combo. But I must say this is exactly what I've been looking for in cans for a LONG time. The bass is fantastic, and the sound is clear. I'm the happiest I've ever been. My wife isn't, because you can't get them off my head! It's that great an experience.

I know that the HA-MR55 pads are supposed to provide better impact, but I'm looking for pads that isolate better, and cut down on sound leakage. Are there any confirmed pads that do that?

 
 
I'm super happy for you Z! As long as you're clear about what you want, you won't get disappointed because you've been informed beforehand :) As for the pads, here is something hilariously clever that @Subere came up with.
 
Jul 15, 2014 at 10:21 PM Post #1,271 of 12,991
ati, I just had to reblog that collection. I think what makes me most jealous is your Alienware laptop. I mean, look at that. Thanks for the vid too! And yes to cans that'll make us poo ourselves!
OFF TOPIC:
my friend just made his own computer for 400$, and he has a quad core 3.8 GHz AMD, a 1 terabyte hard drive with a write speed of 4 GB per second, 8 GB of ram, and some nice graphics card... The only thing he doesn't have yet is a liquid cooling system. His computer is getting 140 fps on minecraft with tekkit installed on full graphics settings. He limits it to 60 though so he doesn't overheat it.
pm me if you want to talk about computers etc further. :)
 
Jul 15, 2014 at 11:05 PM Post #1,272 of 12,991
   
 
 
 
I'm super happy for you Z! As long as you're clear about what you want, you won't get disappointed because you've been informed beforehand :) As for the pads, here is something hilariously clever that @Subere came up with.

Well, off to grab some paper towel and roll it up.
L3000.gif
 
 
*edit*  Well, after some testing with some known bass heavy songs of mine, I'm still liking the stock pads without stuffing.  The stuffing moves the speakers farther from your head, giving the feeling of a wider soundstage, but at the loss of some of the headshake that I love so much about this setup.  I'm hoping the Alpha Dog pads I'm looking at will provide the best of both worlds, with better sealing.  That was one thing that didn't improve with stuffing the earpads.
 
Jul 15, 2014 at 11:41 PM Post #1,273 of 12,991
Congrats on your new headphone purchase
smily_headphones1.gif


V-MODA make some of the most beautiful and well engineered headphones with fun sound signatures with the new XS being one of their finest if not most portable and convenient sleek headphone currently available .

Excellent choice in general, though as you state - not exactly a basshead cannon
wink.gif


What colour did you choose?

 
Ohhhh those are sexy! I went with the all blacks, can't go wrong.
 
 
You are very welcome and I hope you understand my comment was meant in jest, though I removed it in case it was misinterpreted, but not in time for you to quote me - lol 
biggrin.gif


I understand that you don't want to be disappointed with whichever basshead headphone you decide upon after being disappointed with your LCD-2 headphones.

The SMS cans albeit not your exact model do get some love by HBB - he owns a model of that brand and appears to appreciate them for what they are and believe he has made a review.

I think perhaps SMS headphones as a brand is thought of here on head-fi by the majority in the same way as beats is regarded - which is with contempt, something I disagree with strongly, but know I am in a small minority and is a shame as beats and no doubt SMS are more than credible headphone brands, but it would seem within the audio world that old prejudices die hard.

 
I couldn't agree more! The default distaste of mainstream brands by the majority of head-fiers is disgusting. It's like little kids battling over which console is best. Give credit where it's due folks. 
 
On another note, just out of curiosity how would yous rate the Momentum On-Ears, Beats Solo 2s, and Beats Mixrs (all unamped)? 
 
Jul 15, 2014 at 11:56 PM Post #1,274 of 12,991
Ohhhh those are sexy! I went with the all blacks, can't go wrong.



I couldn't agree more! The default distaste of mainstream brands by the majority of head-fiers is disgusting. It's like little kids battling over which console is best. Give credit where it's due folks. 

On another note, just out of curiosity how would yous rate the Momentum On-Ears, Beats Solo 2s, and Beats Mixrs (all unamped)? 
lol. Sennheiser is mainstream, yet get lots o' love... Its just mainstream with another crowd of people. What's interesting though is beats by Dre studio 2.0's have sound quality about as good as the M-100's, but the m-100's get more love because they advertise directly at audiophiles... Even audiophiles will buy cans from hype and commercials alone, so its not just consumers. :)
 
Jul 16, 2014 at 1:14 AM Post #1,275 of 12,991
  First of all, thank you guys for this awesome thread, it is based on measurements and facts, not someone's "this are bass monsters, blah-blah, I can't hear you". I was lurking the thread for a month, finally ordered sz-2k, waiting for the tenso's shipment for now. I use Sony NWZ-e474 as DAP (me thinks Clear Bass will come in handy with sz-2k) and Fiio E07k as amp (it is a bit weaker than E17 in amp section), how do you think, is this enough for sz-2k to produce hard hit or I'll definitely need Fiio E17\E12\better amp? Saving for 77x right now, it's kinda hard for a student in my country to afford all this cans at once  (*crybaby mode on). I can record bass paper test with my NWZ\E07k when sz2k will arrive (if anyone needs this).

 
 
  Got my SZ-2000 today, they are really awesome! This headphones just made me laugh, and this was laughter of happiness ! Stock pads are meh (why in the world JVC would sell their "premium" model with this pads, i dunno), unfortunately Superlux HD669 pleather pads are not working with these - they just don't stay in fixated position, waiting for my 77x now.

 
 
Last year, I tested all of the hyped budget-fi in-ears to find something better than the Sennheiser CX500, and was disappointed by each one. I concentrated on in-ears because prior to that I was recommended the Grado SR60 and the Sennheiser PX100 for basshead full-size cans, which made me believe the skewed assumption that full-size headphones aren't efficient enough to drive low frequencies at high volumes like in-ears can (borrowing my cousin's Sennheiser HD598 and HD555 and immediately distorting them with my bass test strengthened that position).
 
When I tried to complain, I was met with derision. "You spent time at head-fi and this is what you learned from there?" "Bass quality is not the same as bass quantity." "Why would you even do this distortion test?" "Are you joking?" I, as a hardened debater, held my ground. I wanted something so simple and so straightforward--maximum bass SPL before distortion--and it was mind-bogglingly difficult to even discuss that without getting derailed by elitist logorrhea.
 
This year, after my ears started hurting after only an hour of listening with in-ears, I tried to look for non-canal alternatives and thought of giving full-size cans another chance. That's when I saw Hawaiibadboy being all confused at the Basshead Club, as if the whole world were lying to him lololol!
 
So, yeah.
 
So, do WE* only care about bass quantity and not quality? First of all, what is "bass quality"? There is a long list of adjectives in the audiophile glossary to describe bass. Science and engineering forums however argue that terms like "speed, depth, slam/impact/attack, detail, extension, tightness, presence, balance, realism, control," etc. are more easily explained by frequency response graphs, or "magnitude plots based on gain, Q, and frequency of each resonance." In other words, (and room reverberations aside,) "It sounds the same if EQ'd the same." As I said in here, while EQ seems like a magical tool, it can't correct room reverb. Imagine listening to your headphones through toilet paper tubes. The resulting echoes through the tubes are nonlinear, and EQ is only a linear filter. Closed headphones without damping material inside the cups are prone to room reverb that may be unfixable by EQ. The same EQ argument extends to overall sound quality. If you don't use EQ for any reason, that is completely fine. But you should at least be informed of how mechanical engineers achieve a certain frequency response through diaphragm shape (also see here). So, no, we don't just care about bass quantity, we also recommend the use of EQ to achieve your desired "sound quality." You will also need EQ to raise the bass volume to how loud YOU want it without being deafened by the more sensitive frequencies.
 
As for caring ONLY about quality and NOT quantity, I'll just quote myself: "In a signal reproduction perspective, it is important for transducers to be capable of accurate reproduction at high gain. Using the hearing loss argument is just an excuse. 'We didn't design the headphones to be able to reproduce a front row rock concert experience because it's bad for you.'--even if this was a sincere concern for my health, and not a lame rationalization of incompetent engineering, one should still respect the end user's agency."
 
 
Anyway, here is a troubleshooting guide if you think you're not getting enough bass from the SZ:
  • Is the SZ distorting? If not, EQ (we'll help you! It can be tricky, and we're still finding a general solution for Mac and Android. I think Hummel and Milk figured out a solution for Mac). If yes, go to next step.
  • Is the bass volume 127dB loud (the loudest recorded human scream is 129dB)? If yes, then you're most likely used to louder bass in car audio (we're hoping that headphones reach that level too). If not and it is already distorting, go to next step.
  • Is your source or/and amp distorting the signal? The easiest way to test this without measuring the signal directly with RMAA/REW is to use different sources, amps, and headphones. When I first got my SZ, I only had a Fiio E5 (max output 108mW at 15Ohm) and I thought the SZ could only go a bit louder (+5dB in rap tracks) than the 77X before distortion. After I got the Fiio E12, the SZ reached +16dB louder than the 77X. If the SZs are still distorting with a powerful, clean amp, you most likely got a defective pair.
 
*By WE I refer to all of us who love extreme bass.
 

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