[ttorbic]

Wow thanks so much for the welcome!! Very much appreciate it.
Haha I’m as much Korean as if David Beckham decided to move to Seoul, that is, I am but a Brit abroad. Nevertheless thank you for the fabulous welcome!

Yes, from what you and others have said I think getting and trying a variety of pieces is my way forward! I’m looking forward to falling down this rabbit hole.

Thanks for all the advice so far!

Oh haha I missed that part! I'm based in the UK!

Btw, there's UCOTECH, a Korean audio company. They make earbuds too, but I think a little bright? @JAnonymous5150 you've tried a few of their sets right?

 

[Ace Bee]

A good question. For me I mean fatiguing not in the sense that I get actual discomfort so much as I get worn down mentally by something like sibilance distracting from my listening. Like a persistent mosquito at night leading to a poor nights sleep.
I’m not sure if that makes sense aha, it does to me at least…
I’m not such a loud listener. I used to be when I was younger but I trained myself to listen at quieter levels gradually.
I always blame playing in orchestras for my previously loud listening, as being a bassoonist I often had the bloody trombones right in my earhole…

I think Rikubuds will suit you in that case. His tunings are mostly inoffensive, with top-notch comfort. Really, no other buds are as comfortable as his and do not fit as securely as his. The custom-developed shells are on another level in terms of fit and comfort.

I am selling my Alter Rider 3 and Grand Rider 2, at $75 each, retail price $150. Please do let me know if you will be interested. Not using them at all.

 

[jeejack]

So i have three earbuds at the moment.

Moondrop chaconne
Tgxear Serratus
Tgxear Sunniva

Love all of them but would love another set that is sort of on the brighter/ more neutral side. The bass is just above where i want it to be on the Serratus. Any tips?

I would try two options in your case.
First, I would block the steam vent from the outside, and the second option I would block the holes of the shells until I get the desired sound

 

[mt877]

Earbuds come in a variety of shapes and sizes, and fit is a major issue as alluded to by boss @samandhi above. Bad fit = loss of bass and poor sound quality. Doesn't matter how well a earbud is praised, if it can't fit you, or you get discomfort, then it a moot point.

So personally, I wouldn't jump to a $400 USD earbud as the first step. Just my 2 cents, it may probably be worthwhile to consider some cheaper sub-$20 USD earbuds of various sizes.

@furyossa and @WoodyLuvr (credit to them) have compiled an interesting collection of earbud shapes in this hobby to peruse: https://www.head-fi.org/threads/earbuds-round-up.441400/page-3418#post-16078122

Once you like a certain shape, maybe then considering upgrading from there? BTW $400 for earbuds is easily considered top of the line (TOTL). Even $100 is TOTL in the earbud world. In contrast $400 for IEMs and headphones is probably just midFI, wherease $50 USD earbuds can be considered midFI.

But anyways, for classical, I personally like the Yincrow RW-2000 for that. It is a U-shaped balanced set, does most departments well. For cheaper, I like the DUNU Alpha 3 and NiceHCK EB2S (non pro) for classical.

Well, anything other than the Chaconne would be a sidegrade or downgrade comparatively for classical music IMHO..

You could always give a try to any of the three that are fairly neutral, but have more quantity of bass than the Chaconne. They are the FiiO FF5, DUNU Alpha 3, and the Yincrow RW3000.

@cottaudio, welcome to the Earbuds Round-up thread. Those are some great tips and suggestions from our fellow bud fiends. For your reference here's some measurements of the diameters (sans foams) of some commonly recommended earbuds. If you have some coins that are roughly the same size as the Yincrow X6's naked (sans foams) speaker cover diameter you can do a quick check for fit into the Concha of your ear. (Don't walk around with those coins in your ears... people might think you're really weird, or it's a new fashion statement. LOL) Earbuds are mainly held in place by placing the speaker into the Concha and held in place by wedging behind the Tragus and Antitragus. Typically the stem of a MX500 shell will mostly align with the Intertragal notch.

People that have smaller than average ears often have trouble with earbuds because the Concha / Tragus / Antitragus area is too small for a comfortable fit. You might even find that you have a good fit in one ear but not the other (too loose / too tight) due to natural asymmetry of your ears. If a MX500 type shell with foams fits comfortably, you can wear most earbuds without a problem.

Yincrow X6 (MX500 shell) - 16.80mm	Yincrow RW-3000 - 16.88mm	Yincrow RW-2000 - 16.88mm	FiiO FF3 - 16.50mm
FiiO FF5 - 16.50mm	Moondrop Chaconne - 16.48mm	Yincrow Rhino - 16.32mm	Shozy BK (PK shell) - 16.10mm

Earbuds are typically worn with foams on the earbuds, for comfort, better (snugger) fit. Foams also act as filters to reducing some upper mids and treble. Foams are available in several foam densities which affect both fit and overall tuning of the earbuds you're wearing. I made some density measurements of various foams and the foams with fewer density variations are recommended. Cheaper no-name foams might be ok, but the QC of densities is bad and the foams have a higher percentage of holes which are off center, so they don't fit your earbuds very well.

1st foam density measurements.
2nd foam density measurements.

Reading the discussion around those measurement posts is helpful.

 

[Survivor]

That is one of the things that has irked me over time. Their designs are fantastic, and they look elegant and high-end. The sound (starting about around the ST20 & its variants) has been a bit of a let-down for me as well.

Having said that, with a good tube amp, and maybe even some EQ or analog tone control, they can indeed sound very good. I just hate having to depend on doing this to make them sound good. I am not against EQ, I just prefer them to not need any out of the box (at least not in the amount of sound shaping that needs to happen to make them listenable)...

Friends, don't forget about the magic of cables
if you're talking about excessive bass, think of Fiio FF3.

 

[samandhi]

Friends, don't forget about the magic of cables
if you're talking about excessive bass, think of Fiio FF3.

I wasn't. I was talking about the "ice pick" 20+ boost in the 2K-5K region, and a cable will NOT fix this.

Subsequently, I have never found the FF3 to have an excessive amount of bass, unless you are looking for diffuse field tuning, in which case they would at that point because they are a full rounded set. Thank you for the suggestion though.

 

[cottaudio]

@cottaudio, welcome to the Earbuds Round-up thread. Those are some great tips and suggestions from our fellow bud fiends. For your reference here's some measurements of the diameters (sans foams) of some commonly recommended earbuds. If you have some coins that are roughly the same size as the Yincrow X6's naked (sans foams) speaker cover diameter you can do a quick check for fit into the Concha of your ear. (Don't walk around with those coins in your ears... people might think you're really weird, or it's a new fashion statement. LOL) Earbuds are mainly held in place by placing the speaker into the Concha and held in place by wedging behind the Tragus and Antitragus. Typically the stem of a MX500 shell will mostly align with the Intertragal notch.

People that have smaller than average ears often have trouble with earbuds because the Concha / Tragus / Antitragus area is too small for a comfortable fit. You might even find that you have a good fit in one ear but not the other (too loose / too tight) due to natural asymmetry of your ears. If a MX500 type shell with foams fits comfortably, you can wear most earbuds without a problem.

Yincrow X6 (MX500 shell) - 16.80mm	Yincrow RW-3000 - 16.88mm	Yincrow RW-2000 - 16.88mm	FiiO FF3 - 16.50mm
FiiO FF5 - 16.50mm	Moondrop Chaconne - 16.48mm	Yincrow Rhino - 16.32mm	Shozy BK (PK shell) - 16.10mm

Earbuds are typically worn with foams on the earbuds, for comfort, better (snugger) fit. Foams also act as filters to reducing some upper mids and treble. Foams are available in several foam densities which affect both fit and overall tuning of the earbuds you're wearing. I made some density measurements of various foams and the foams with fewer density variations are recommended. Cheaper no-name foams might be ok, but the QC of densities is bad and the foams have a higher percentage of holes which are off center, so they don't fit your earbuds very well.

1st foam density measurements.
2nd foam density measurements.

Reading the discussion around those measurement posts is helpful.

Thank you so much for the detailed help. Once I’m home from work I’ll see if I can find a coin or three to determine size compatibility.

Oh haha I missed that part! I'm based in the UK!

Btw, there's UCOTECH, a Korean audio company. They make earbuds too, but I think a little bright? @JAnonymous5150 you've tried a few of their sets right?

Interesting, I’ll have a little search of these to see what’s up.

 

[omerad]

Thank you so much for the detailed help. Once I’m home from work I’ll see if I can find a coin or three to determine size compatibility.

Interesting, I’ll have a little search of these to see what’s up.

If you are in the Seoul area you might want to check out this shop which is a Ucotech reseller in the Dongdaemun-Hyehwa area: earphoneshop 15-11, Daehak-ro 10-gil, Jongno-gu, Seoul, Republic of Korea. The store is very similar to the e-Earphone shops in Japan with most products available to try and listen. A couple years ago I visited this store and was able to listen Ucotech ES-P1 which is a neutral-bright signature and probably well suited to classical. the website seems to show they sell the follow-on ES-P2 model which I was curious to try next time I visit Seoul. Anyway you would be able to get a feel for the fit and sound signature before buying.

 

[fooltoque]

Smabat's new SL-10 dual diaphragm buds are in crowd funding status. They are only posted at Smabat's Chinese language website, not to their English site.

https://www.smabat.com/smabat2/products/55320201.html

Spoiler: English AI translated description

首发特惠：抢先体验SL-10 —— 全球创新的真双动圈耳机！

早鸟优惠：限时￥248！ (原价￥300)

立刻行动，率先加入音质革命！SL-10耳机，以其创新的双动圈设计，定义了听觉的新境界。

精心制作的设计图揭示了我们追求卓越的热忱，而实际产品在精细生产过程中，可能会有轻微的优化调整。

我们衷心感谢您的信任与支持，是您让我们的梦想成为可能！

抓住机会，享受前所未有的早鸟价格，未来零售价将恢复至￥300。

搭载了一个10mm高端动圈单元和一个14.2mm的低频动圈单元，后者采用了先进的碳纤维振膜技术。

这种同轴声学结构，结合了精密的分频器，确保了音质的纯净和丰富。

10mm的高端动圈单元为中高频段提供了清晰、细腻的音质，而14.2mm的低频动圈单元则确保了低频的深沉和力度。

碳纤维振膜的使用，不仅大幅度提升了音质的解析力和响应速度，

还赋予了耳机更好的耐用性和稳定性，让每一次听觉体验都变得格外震撼和动人

首次采用了双迷宫声学结构设计，这一独特创新确保了14.2mm单元能够发挥出极其惊人的低音能量，带来前所未有的震撼听觉体验。

仅优化了声音的这种精巧的声学设计不流动路径，还显著提高了声音的纯净度和动态范围，尤其是在低频部分。

通过精心设计的双迷宫结构，耳机能够捕捉并放大每一个细微的低音细节

无论是深沉的贝斯还是节奏感强烈的电子音乐，都能以更加丰满和力量感的形式呈现给听众。

Speaking of Smabat crowdfunding, I did buy an S2 Pro back in Feb https://www.smabat.cn/smabat/products/54845442.html###

I never got a confirmation of purchase. The only record I have is on my credit card statement. I have tried emailing them several times with the email they provide on that page, hoping to get a confirmation, but they never respond. I can see now that they have moved back shipping to May/June, "targeting 300-400 people", whatever that means.

It is pretty frustrating having them ignore my requests for some sort of purchase confirmation.

 

[jeejack]

Speaking of Smabat crowdfunding, I did buy an S2 Pro back in Feb https://www.smabat.cn/smabat/products/54845442.html###

I never got a confirmation of purchase. The only record I have is on my credit card statement. I have tried emailing them several times with the email they provide on that page, hoping to get a confirmation, but they never respond. I can see now that they have moved back shipping to May/June, "targeting 300-400 people", whatever that means.

It is pretty frustrating having them ignore my requests for some sort of purchase confirmation.

I will talk with him. I will let you know

 

[baskingshark]

Speaking of Smabat crowdfunding, I did buy an S2 Pro back in Feb https://www.smabat.cn/smabat/products/54845442.html###

I never got a confirmation of purchase. The only record I have is on my credit card statement. I have tried emailing them several times with the email they provide on that page, hoping to get a confirmation, but they never respond. I can see now that they have moved back shipping to May/June, "targeting 300-400 people", whatever that means.

It is pretty frustrating having them ignore my requests for some sort of purchase confirmation.

Hmm I guess if it doesn't come in, there's a last option to do a charge back on the credit card?

 

[mt877]

Speaking of Smabat crowdfunding, I did buy an S2 Pro back in Feb https://www.smabat.cn/smabat/products/54845442.html###

I never got a confirmation of purchase. The only record I have is on my credit card statement. I have tried emailing them several times with the email they provide on that page, hoping to get a confirmation, but they never respond. I can see now that they have moved back shipping to May/June, "targeting 300-400 people", whatever that means.

It is pretty frustrating having them ignore my requests for some sort of purchase confirmation.

Hmm I guess if it doesn't come in, there's a last option to do a charge back on the credit card?

From what I've read on the S2 Pro product page, if the crowd funding fails (less than 300 - 400 upfront sales), they will do a full refund. It may turn out that they will release it even if the crowdfunding fails. I don't think you'll lose your money, but it's understandable to be frustrated by the lack of communication.

Spoiler: contact info for Smabat's founder

Lin, Smabat Technology lh@smabat.com

 

[anli]

lack of communication

It is compensated with loud +20 dB shouting at timbre range.

 

[samandhi]

It is compensated with loud +20 dB shouting at timbre range.

Thanks bro. I was taking a drink when I read this. It JUST about came out through my nose.

 

[fooltoque]

I will talk with him. I will let you know

Thanks for this
They responded to my emails finally. I think part of the problem was that I had mistakenly put M2 Pro instead of S2 Pro in the subject line, so maybe when they got it, they just thought, "Whaaaa?" and put it away. Still, purchase confirmation and some kind of response to questions should be a given.