[mt877]

Could you explain me why not?

There's a lot of confusion in regards to how to wire and use plugs for adapters. 3.5mm to 4.4mm is dangerous which can cause shorts in a balanced source, but a 4.4mm to 3.5mm is perfectly safe.

Edit: wait do you want to go 3.5mm plug in then 4.4mm plug out? I am a little confused by your question above.

Thanks, bro!
I was thinking about plug-in a male 3.5 headphone into a female 3.5 adapter to a balanced 4.4 male that would be pluged onto a Moondrop Dawn Pro 4.4 balanced.

Think of it this way, if you can't remember:

• Source = any balanced connection (2.5mm, 3.5mm balanced not SE, or 4.4mm) out to any balanced cable = Good!
• Source = any balanced connection (2.5mm, 3.5mm balanced not SE, or 4.4mm) out to single ended cable = BAD!
• 
  
• Source = single ended connection out to any balanced cable (2.5mm, or 4.4mm, or 3.5 balanced) or single ended cable = GOOD!

Edit: OH! And there is a technical term that describes what can happen when you short the grounds (that are considered as hot) in any electronic component. It is known as "letting the smoke out".....

Just to drive this message home a little deeper, here's an excellent post that should be stickied.

ClieOS posted this: Simple Graphical Guide on Single-Ended vs. Balanced Audio with Headphones with excellent diagrams illustrating the electrical connections of good (figures 1 thru 4) and bad (figure 5).

 

[samandhi]

Just to drive this message home a little deeper, here's an excellent post that should be stickied.

ClieOS posted this: Simple Graphical Guide on Single-Ended vs. Balanced Audio with Headphones with excellent diagrams illustrating the electrical connections of good (figures 1 thru 4) and bad (figure 5).

I wish that I had known about this much much sooner, as many times as I have written about the differences, dangers, etc... It is SO much nicer having a picturesque description rather than words alone (which is pretty difficult to convey in such a way that beginners will understand). I should bookmark this to "regurgitate" it from time to time because I have tried to explain this MANY MANY times (not just on this thread mind you).

VERY GOOD FIND!

Addendum: Although I don't totally agree with figure 4 and its description. There is no special adapter needed to go from a SE source to a balanced cable or set of head gear, since the ground wire is already shorted internally. Rather, and because of the internal setup or nature of the SE circuit, the adaptation is done very much like the figure shows, but at the connection socket, rather than needing a special interconnect (in other words it does the same thing that he was describing, but not using a special adapter.

 

[anli]

Already having Yincrow RW-2000 and RW-3000, yesterday have got RW-1000 Bass Boost. It's interesting experience. The best way for my ears is to use them without foams at all. With filled foams there is a HF lacking (yes, HF lacking rather than LF exaggeration). Donuts or without-foams cases are close for me. Foam-less brings new kind of naturalness. See, I don't say "more" or "less", I say "new kind". Overall RW-1000 tonality (without any foams) is close to be balanced for me (as, say, with RW-2000) but RW-1000 are a little more peaceful at timbre (2-5 KHz) range in comparison with RW-2000 (and especially with RW-3000 where this range is a little exaggerated for me).

As a result, foam-less RW-1000 are very balanced for those avoiding exaggerated details and are very comfort for long music listening. And foam-less results in new kind of reality.

Later addition: after few days HFs have "opened", and normal density foams are Ok now. Never noticed similar burning evolution before. Have you met such magic? I mean I was sure ears burning (adaptation) is dominating in comparison with electromechanical processes in buds. Long-term storage?

Also, there is small peak around 10KHz in comparison with, say, 2000. I don't say it is a drawback. Probably it is an advantage. The peak isn't annoying at any case and doesn't result in sibilants exaggerating or such. Bass edition still isn't more bassy than, say 2000 or 3000 (or is is just subjective feeling if we take into account that HF accent).

 

[samandhi]

Already having Yincrow RW-2000 and RW-3000, yesterday have got RW-1000 Bass Boost. It's interesting experience. The best way for my ears is to use them without foams at all. With filled foams there is a HF lacking (yes, HF lacking rather than LF exaggeration). Donuts or without-foams cases are close for me. Foam-less brings new kind of naturalness. See, I don't say "more" or "less", I say "new kind". Overall RW-1000 tonality (without any foams) is close to be balanced for me (as, say, with RW-2000) but RW-1000 are a little more peaceful at timbre (2-5 KHz) range in comparison with RW-2000 (and especially with RW-3000 where this range is a little exaggerated for me).

As a result, foam-less RW-1000 are very balanced for those avoiding exaggerated details and are very comfort for long music listening. And foam-less results in new kind of reality.

Congrats on your new shiny!

I am glad that you found something that is great for your ears.

 

[mt877]

I wish that I had known about this much much sooner, as many times as I have written about the differences, dangers, etc... It is SO much nicer having a picturesque description rather than words alone (which is pretty difficult to convey in such a way that beginners will understand). I should bookmark this to "regurgitate" it from time to time because I have tried to explain this MANY MANY times (not just on this thread mind you).

VERY GOOD FIND!

Addendum: Although I don't totally agree with figure 4 and its description. There is no special adapter needed to go from a SE source to a balanced cable or set of head gear, since the ground wire is already shorted internally. Rather, and because of the internal setup or nature of the SE circuit, the adaptation is done very much like the figure shows, but at the connection socket, rather than needing a special interconnect (in other words it does the same thing that he was describing, but not using a special adapter.

I actually think the diagram (fig 4) is correct, because going from source (DAP / amp) 3.5SE/6.5SE to either 2.5Bal or 4.4Bal headphone requires an adapter. He's just showing the internal wiring of the adapter where the SE common is split to the L- and R- connections of the balanced headphone plug.

 

[samandhi]

I actually think the diagram (fig 4) is correct, because going from source (DAP / amp) 3.5SE/6.5SE to either 2.5Bal or 4.4Bal headphone requires an adapter. He's just showing the internal wiring of the adapter where the SE common is split to the L- and R- connections of the balanced headphone plug.

OIC, and you are right... I guess I was thinking of some SPECIAL adapter, not just an adapter from 2.5mm or 4.5mm to 3.5mm (I use those so much that they are just standard to me )... Thanks for clearing that up.

 

[mt877]

OIC, and you are right... I guess I was thinking of some SPECIAL adapter, not just an adapter from 2.5mm or 4.5mm to 3.5mm (I use those so much that they are just standard to me )... Thanks for clearing that up.

We're both on the same page... it's all good!

 

[samandhi]

We're both on the same page... it's all good!

Sometimes my wife accuses me of being "the dumbest smart person" she has ever known.... LOL

 

[mt877]

Sometimes my wife accuses me of being "the dumbest smart person" she has ever known.... LOL

LOL! I know where you're coming from. Our wives must be related somehow....

 

[Brillig]

I wish that I had known about this much much sooner, as many times as I have written about the differences, dangers, etc... It is SO much nicer having a picturesque description rather than words alone (which is pretty difficult to convey in such a way that beginners will understand). I should bookmark this to "regurgitate" it from time to time because I have tried to explain this MANY MANY times (not just on this thread mind you).

VERY GOOD FIND!

Addendum: Although I don't totally agree with figure 4 and its description. There is no special adapter needed to go from a SE source to a balanced cable or set of head gear, since the ground wire is already shorted internally. Rather, and because of the internal setup or nature of the SE circuit, the adaptation is done very much like the figure shows, but at the connection socket, rather than needing a special interconnect (in other words it does the same thing that he was describing, but not using a special adapter.

Just to add mud to the fire, here's a picture of the adapter in question, made for me by Jim Park of TGXear, for $30. If you buy an earbud from him, ask him for a bundle deal.

 

[mt877]

Just to add mud to the fire, here's a picture of the adapter in question, made for me by Jim Park of TGXear, for $30. If you buy an earbud from him, ask him for a bundle deal.

Not mud on the fire at all, that's a 'good' normal 3.5SE male to 4.4.4Bal female adapter. Reference to figure 4 in the graphical guide post linked.

 

[samandhi]

Just to add mud to the fire, here's a picture of the adapter in question, made for me by Jim Park of TGXear, for $30. If you buy an earbud from him, ask him for a bundle deal.

This, I would trust. It is the cheap ones that are sold by (who really knows) sellers on AE that warrant much wariness. Good find sir!

Edit: again a brain f*rt... I thought that was one of the 4.4mm to 3.5mm adapters we were talking about being wary of...

 

[samandhi]

I have and use all sorts of interconnects with my system. All except the male 4.4mm balanced to female 3.5mm SE connector.

The two on the right are from iBasso (because a lot of their IEMs come with a 2.5mm balanced connector). I use them when I want to use 2.5mm balanced to 3.5mm SE, or I use the ones in the middle If I want to take it from 2.5mm balanced to 4.4mm balanced. The left ones are used to take it from 4.4mm balanced to 3.5mm SE.... I even have one (bottom) that will convert from OMTP to CTIA on such older pairs that have a mic and volume buttons built in. My iBasso DX160 comes with OMTP only (the more Chinese prevalent standard invented by Nokia) in the 2019 version. The re-release of the same device but in 2020 saw a different screen, and they also changed the jacks to CTIA (the international standard created by the Cellular Telecommunications and Internet Association). I have a whole box of "other" interconnects as well (3.5mm to coax, XLR to mini XLR TRRS, 4.4mm balanced to XLR balanced, etc...), but I found these to be the most relevant for the current conversation.

Spoiler: Some of my interconnects for use in portable

 

[samandhi]

Well, I mentioned I might do this much earlier, but until now I have not had the dough to throw at it. I have decided to pull the trigger on the iFi Pro iCan Signature amplifier. I am confident that I will now be able to drive my beloved Yinman 2.0 600 VERY well (considering it has 14W potential from balanced; heck it has 7.8W out of SE as well). It should also be able to push my HD800S as well (easily since they are so sensitive; 300ohms @102dB/mW).

I chose it for a few reasons. First, it has a built in bass boost (that is not DSP) for those days when I want "fun" listening. Then there is all the connections; both in and out. I have such a varied set of head gear that I need lots of choices here, and there really isn't much on the market that has this much choice. Also, and one of the most important, the numbers (THD, SNR, etc...) are at least the same or better than my DX300, combined with the power output is harder to find that you might think unless you are willing to shell out $5K or more. One more reason is I get the best of both worlds here with SS and valve tubes. It isn't a "hybrid", it is either one or the other at a time. And both are class A circuits... Again, this is not too common with all the other bells and whistles without going in at a higher price tag.

Something new I have not had the opportunity to look into is something called IEMatching where it will adjust the attenuation based on the sensed impedance of the IEMs so as to not have any hiss or distortion. To me, this means that the output resistance is adjusted based on load... This is fantastic because I have impedance sets ranging from 9ohms to 600ohms...

We shall see how good it is, but I have 30 days to return it (no questions asked), so it will be worth it IMHO. I just thought I would share with my earbuds family. I am really excited!

 

[ttorbic]

Well, I mentioned I might do this much earlier, but until now I have not had the dough to throw at it. I have decided to pull the trigger on the iFi Pro iCan Signature amplifier. I am confident that I will now be able to drive my beloved Yinman 2.0 600 VERY well (considering it has 14W potential from balanced; heck it has 7.8W out of SE as well). It should also be able to push my HD800S as well (easily since they are so sensitive; 300ohms @102dB/mW).

I chose it for a few reasons. First, it has a built in bass boost (that is not DSP) for those days when I want "fun" listening. Then there is all the connections; both in and out. I have such a varied set of head gear that I need lots of choices here, and there really isn't much on the market that has this much choice. Also, and one of the most important, the numbers (THD, SNR, etc...) are at least the same or better than my DX300, combined with the power output is harder to find that you might think unless you are willing to shell out $5K or more. One more reason is I get the best of both worlds here with SS and valve tubes. It isn't a "hybrid", it is either one or the other at a time. And both are class A circuits... Again, this is not too common with all the other bells and whistles without going in at a higher price tag.

Something new I have not had the opportunity to look into is something called IEMatching where it will adjust the attenuation based on the sensed impedance of the IEMs so as to not have any hiss or distortion. To me, this means that the output resistance is adjusted based on load... This is fantastic because I have impedance sets ranging from 9ohms to 600ohms...

We shall see how good it is, but I have 30 days to return it (no questions asked), so it will be worth it IMHO. I just thought I would share with my earbuds family. I am really excited!

Nice, congrats! That's the big big brother of the ifi ZEN CAN, right? I'm pretty happy with my ifi ZEN stack! I think some folks have issues with the Burr Brown DAC on ifi DACs, but i don't mind the combo. What's your dac going to be?