[numon]

I think your question is either the ranking of sub-bass or which general overall sound is better?

Sub-bass with M5 Pro body: M4-ST10S > M4-SO > M5 Pro-Golden - M5 Pro Golden also has deep bass, but is also more mid forward, so the bass can be shaded.
Each Smabat driver has its own sound signature and all 3 drivers sound good in their own way. You would have to listen to them to choose the one you like the best. I liked the M5 Pro body + SO (Super One) driver, but ST10S and Golden are also good, it depends on what sound signature you are in the mood for and the music you listen to.

Sub-bass Smabat M5 Pro vs Yincrow RW-3000: M4-ST10S > RW-3000 - I still choose the RW-3000 over any of the M5 Pro body + Golden / ST10S / SO driver combinations.

thanks for detailed answer.
i also asked that is there any subbass impact increase between m4 body vs m5 pro body with same driver? i have m4 default driver ,st20p and st20 driver i cant hear subbass impact like in m2s pro black one driver (maybe different driver affects impact i dont know but seller says st20p has only high frequence difference from so driver)

 

[samandhi]

You guys know I enjoy DIY earbud building, so here's my latest creation.

Earbuds with Dual Dynamic drivers. You can't see the drivers, but trust me they're in there and sound great.

Those look amazing! Great job in (somehow) jamming both DD in that small shell. I AM glad you opted to not go with the MX500 shell (even though they are a bit easier to tune in that shell). Are those metal shells or plastic shells? Can you liken them to anything you own, or have you created something completely unique?

Just wait for @samandhi to give his impressions of the M5 Pro Golden.... Then you can make a better decision.

Looks like that might take a while. My order has yet to be even processed (as of this morning). Just as a reference point, I ordered them on the 6th. Though, I am not complaining; it isn't like I don't have anything to listen to while waiting for them....

thanks for detailed answer.
i also asked that is there any subbass impact increase between m4 body vs m5 pro body with same driver? i have m4 default driver ,st20p and st20 driver i cant hear subbass impact like in m2s pro black one driver (maybe different driver affects impact i dont know but seller says st20p has only high frequence difference from so driver)

Even though I don't have the M5 Pro yet, I am going to go out on a limb and say that there probably is a difference. If you look at the M4 shell, there IS a port hole in it, but there is just very little room even in the back of the shell where the port leads to. This will stifle the bass to an extent. Where as the M5 pro (and the M5 regular) shells have a "maze" type of configuration much like the ST10S and ST20 (and pro) did. Having said that, I would also guess that the M5 (either shell) should have a bit less bass impact than did the ST10S (and maybe the ST20 also) because of the modular design not leaving any room directly behind the driver.

For me, the ST10S B&G is one of their bassiest models (that I have heard). The reason is the same for your lack of hearing the same bass between the M2s Pro and the M4. Though they are both modular in design, the M2s Pro have lots of room directly behind the shell which creates more room to "breath" so to speak.

Having said all of that, even with the M2s Pro, the differing bass quantities is more subtle than it is "night and day" different. Don't forget that with the M5, they now have added 3 more drivers to play around with (150ohm LCP, and 50ohm LCP, and 32ohm BE) that they didn't have before. So, the list is added to, though I am not able to find all the drivers on their site that they previously had listed for the M4. I don't know if they have discontinued some of them, or they are just not listed (both their official site and Aliexpress sites are a bit of a mess at the moment). To my recollection, they have these available for use with the new M5 pro and M5 (though I may be wrong about the driver coating, they have so many differing ones):

• St20 100ohm Bio
• St20 40ohm
• SO 100ohm Bio
• ST10S 150ohm TI
• 40ohm LCP (stock M4 driver)
• 32ohm TI (I think this one was discontinued not long after the M4 came out)
• M5 Golden 150ohm LCP
• M5 50ohm LCP
• M5 32ohm BE

 

[wolfen68]

I had an almost hidden smile on my face at that point because his mouth was open (most likely unbeknownst to him) as well as his eyes being wide. He took them out and gave them a good once over and asked me "What the hell??? Where did you get these???"

Then I DID laugh.........

________________________________________________________________________________THE END_____________________________________________________________

I've always chuckled when this happens (with any type of headphone) especially after the person argues that their Beats, Bose or Air Pod headphones are the musical enjoyment endgame.

Recently a friend of mine (who is an IEM fan, but not nuts enough to be on Head-fi) was sharing strong opinions on why IEM's are the best portable listening experience. In response I shared a set of FF3's and after 1 minute saw a similar blooming of wonder on his face. His first words were, "These rock, they sound like big headphones!", and "Where did you get these?".

 

[Kordonrules]

You guys know I enjoy DIY earbud building, so here's my latest creation.

Earbuds with Dual Dynamic drivers. You can't see the drivers, but trust me they're in there and sound great.

Wow, MMCX and all.

 

[passie42]

*off topic*
Guys, sorry for posting this question here but I do not know how to get a answer otherwise.
How can I make a new post (have some questions about aftermarket MMCX cables)?

 

[Ace Bee]

*off topic*
Guys, sorry for posting this question here but I do not know how to get a answer otherwise.
How can I make a new post (have some questions about aftermarket MMCX cables)?

Probably make that post in The Discovery Thread, there are a lot of people there who can answer your query.

 

[candycane]

Have you ever heard a good over-ears open-back headphone? The better earbuds sound much more like them than budget IEMs. IEMs provide isolation, more like closed-back headphones, but with their own flavor and technicalities.

Never of the same caliber as chi-fi IEMs. I've only ever had closed-back and the technicalities were never that good. More "budget standard" than HiFi. But I'd love to hear what they sound like, although over-ears make my ears feel hot and so they're not as comfortable.

 

[ian91]

I've always chuckled when this happens (with any type of headphone) especially after the person argues that their Beats, Bose or Air Pod headphones are the musical enjoyment endgame.

Recently a friend of mine (who is an IEM fan, but not nuts enough to be on Head-fi) was sharing strong opinions on why IEM's are the best portable listening experience. In response I shared a set of FF3's and after 1 minute saw a similar blooming of wonder on his face. His first words were, "These rock, they sound like big headphones!", and "Where did you get these?".

I think it can be quite easy to taken in by the claims of IEM marketing and the mass market options. Mainstream sets (e.g. Air Pods) aren't inherently bad and there's some good out there but the Google algorithm will kick up heavily affiliated links for these brands and they are reviewed by people that are generally 'techies'. They are not selective from the audio perspective and those buying them don't tend to care that much anyway. It's a little different in the IEM sphere, where reviewers are more selective but new models are released every couple of days. The only way for releases to float in this vast sea of mediocrity/minute iteration (if any) is for sellers to have a vivacious appetite for influencers/reviewers to bring the spotlight to them. Making a 'safe' purchase is much more difficult.

I dismissed earbuds early on thinking newer audio tech would offer more, but after much outlay and disappointment, for my tastes, it doesn't. Planar IEMs when tuned well and supercharged with a lot of current are the most impressive thing to come out of IEM realm for me because they can throw a large stage, separate well and resolution is impressive. However, you really need that power for the low Hz & technicality to come out and even then you're still left with unusual timbral characteristics.

A good old earbud is just a much safer purchase in my eyes. Coherency is a non-issue, resolution can approach mid-fi IEM (where diminishing returns set in), staging can extend further than IEMs generally and, if they get the tonality right, you're almost guaranteed a better instrumental timbre thanks to the nature of a DD. Horses for courses I suppose.

 

[Kyonnie]

Recently a friend of mine (who is an IEM fan, but not nuts enough to be on Head-fi)

One of the reasons why it took me so long before joining in lol

His first words were, "These rock, they sound like big headphones!", and "Where did you get these?".

Same feeling when I first heard of the FF3S I was gonna write a detailed sound impression with em but I'm pretty busy with Uni and I almost fell asleep with them on lol they just sucked me in its staging, the holographic sound, it's resolution and details there's nothing much I can really say about them that isn't already been said in here considering the original FF3 is been out for about a year but hey they would make a great pair for gaming and listening to ASMRs (still prefer IEMs) I know it's not being discussed here that much that's for sure haha

over-ears make my ears feel hot and so they're not as comfortable.

That's the reason why I prefer IEMs and Earbuds also being able to lay on bed with them on comfortably is a plus

 

[Kyonnie]

I think it can be quite easy to taken in by the claims of IEM marketing and the mass market options. Mainstream sets aren't inherently bad and there's some good out there but the Google algorithm will kick up heavily affiliated links for these brands and they are reviewed by people that are generally technically minded. They are not selective from the audio perspective and those buying them don't tend to care that anyway. It's a little different in the IEM sphere, where reviewers are more selective but new models are released every couple of days. The only way for releases to float in this vast sea of mediocrity/minute iteration (if any) is for sellers to have a vivacious appetite for influencers/reviewers to bring the spotlight to them.

I dismissed earbuds early on thinking newer audio tech would offer more, but after much outlay and disappointment, for my tastes, it doesn't. Planar IEMs when tuned well and supercharged with a lot of current are the most impressive thing to come out of IEM realm for me because they can throw a large stage, separate well and resolution is impressive. However, you really need that power for the low Hz to come out and even then you're still left with unusual timbral characteristics.

A good old earbud is just a much safer purchase in my eyes. Coherency is a non-issue, resolution can approach mid-fi IEM (where diminishing returns set in), staging can extend further than IEMs generally and if they get the tonality right you're almost guaranteed a better instrumental timbre thanks to the DD. Horses for courses I suppose.

Same thoughts exactly!

Btw what do you guys have bought this 11.11 sale? I still haven't purchased any kinda spoiled by choices already lol

 

[ian91]

Same thoughts exactly!

Btw what do you guys have bought this 11.11 sale? I still haven't purchased any kinda spoiled by choices already lol

If I had the money I would get the Yinman but alas, I did not manage my finances well enough to join in on this 11.11.

 

[Kyonnie]

If I had the money I would get the Yinman but alas, I did not manage my finances well enough to join in on this 11.11.

I've been eyeing for it for quite awhile now but unfortunately I can't really get it in here both online and physical stores it seems like a lot of people in here is in the same boat as us ahaha

 

[InvisibleInk]

Never of the same caliber as chi-fi IEMs. I've only ever had closed-back and the technicalities were never that good. More "budget standard" than HiFi. But I'd love to hear what they sound like, although over-ears make my ears feel hot and so they're not as comfortable.

A generally accepted ultra budget standard ear bud is the Yincrow X6. That could be a good place for you to start. Yincrow as a brand scales up nicely as the price of their offerings get higher.

 

[mt877]

thanks for detailed answer.
i also asked that is there any subbass impact increase between m4 body vs m5 pro body with same driver? i have m4 default driver ,st20p and st20 driver i cant hear subbass impact like in m2s pro black one driver (maybe different driver affects impact i dont know but seller says st20p has only high frequence difference from so driver)

Hmm, your original question was not worded like how you wrote it now, it would have been much easier to answer your question if you wrote with such details before.

Anyway, I have the M4-ST20 and M4-ST20P drivers and did the testing. On M4 body, both ST20 (40 Ohm) and ST20P (100 Ohm) both have a decent amount of bass which can go relatively deep, also there is the 2~3k peak which can get fatiguing if you are sensitive in that area. On M5 Pro body, both ST20 and ST20P have much deeper bass overall which can rumble. Due to the M5 Pro bass effect, the high end sounds much smoother and easy to listen to.

If you're looking to get better deep bass and less fatiguing high end with any of the add-on drivers I can recommend the M5 Pro Golden set.

 

[trevdawg94]

Our hearing is so different (and I appreciate that), I don't get fatigued listening to the RW-3000 at all, they're almost my perfect set of buds. I also have the RW-2000 and while they sound great, I don't like them as much as the 3000's. The other Yincrow buds I like are the Rhino.

I finally revisited the DUNU Alpha 3 buds the other night and after giving them a good listen I can finally say that I'm not as disappointed in them as when I first got them. Maybe I got disappointed in them due to critical listening sessions where your ears get burned out trying to decipher the sound signature or something. When I just relaxed and just let the music flow through them the Alpha 3's actually sounded very good.

I was looking at getting the RW3000 during the 11/11 sale but after seeing the comments from samandhi and gylyf I'm second guessing whether I'll enjoy listening to them or if I'll have the same issues they both had. Since you're one of the few people I've seen here that also has the Rhino, how do they compare to the RW3000 and RW2000? Just don't want to be disappointed as a lot of the other earbuds I've tried have either been too sibilant or it has felt like there was something missing compared to the Calf but especially to the Rhino.