[Braekfast]

I agree, it sounds like you may need to move up to mid-tier or top-tier to get what you are wanting. There are those that charge a lot because they can, then there are the ones that really are worth their price (to me anyhow).

I don't think it is so much all over the place per se'. It is more like IEM pricing cut by 16 (or something like that). So really when you get to $150 + you are reaching flagship/TOTL level for earbuds. Having said that though, I have heard some that are cheaper and are just as good as what you would see priced as TOTL buds. That is where it gets confusing, I think.

Yeah, a lot of the cheaper buds DO indeed sacrifice something for something else. This is the reason I suggested the ones I did. They sacrifice very little in overall sound IMHO. Or what they DO sacrifice, you don't miss as much. Maybe you will have to wait for the new Smabat modular buds. They will be more reasonable in pricing (I think), but if they are anything like the M2s Pro (which I believe they use the same drivers possibly), then they will be fantastic. But even if they aren't OOTB, you can always switch drivers to get the sound you like. Just a thought.

Yeah, that is kinda what I figured. Buds in general seem like really good bang-for-your-buck, but I suspect there comes a point where there's only so much improvement you're likely to see within a price category.

True, the prices themselves are very reasonable. I more meant it in the sense that you can get a 20 euro bud that sounds just as good as a 40-50 euro bud sometimes, and (at least to me) it's not always easy to figure out wether the 20 euro one is just really good, or the 40-50 euro one is just worse than it should be. So it's not always spend more = get more. I don't really know how the prices compare to IEM's to be honest. I've got some sort of skin condition in my ear canals that makes them very sensitive and itchy, trying to wear IEM's for longer than 10-15 minutes is torturous so I've just sort of given up on the form factor.

On the subject of cheaper TOTL buds, it does seem like there's quite a bit of variance in prices for buds that have what is considered TOTL sound. I'm assuming that buds by DIY makers also have/approach TOTL sound for reasonable prices, it's just a shame that I can't really consider the ones that are based in the US. Unless the lads in the customs office ignore packages between individuals for VAT, but I doubt they'll be so kind.

The SMABAT modular bud lineups have always intrigued me with their modular design. Though I've not yet looked into exactly how modular they are. If they're only a small step below just soldering your own drivers, it might not be worth the premium.

 

[mt877]

Yeah, that is kinda what I figured. Buds in general seem like really good bang-for-your-buck, but I suspect there comes a point where there's only so much improvement you're likely to see within a price category.

True, the prices themselves are very reasonable. I more meant it in the sense that you can get a 20 euro bud that sounds just as good as a 40-50 euro bud sometimes, and (at least to me) it's not always easy to figure out wether the 20 euro one is just really good, or the 40-50 euro one is just worse than it should be. So it's not always spend more = get more. I don't really know how the prices compare to IEM's to be honest. I've got some sort of skin condition in my ear canals that makes them very sensitive and itchy, trying to wear IEM's for longer than 10-15 minutes is torturous so I've just sort of given up on the form factor.

On the subject of cheaper TOTL buds, it does seem like there's quite a bit of variance in prices for buds that have what is considered TOTL sound. I'm assuming that buds by DIY makers also have/approach TOTL sound for reasonable prices, it's just a shame that I can't really consider the ones that are based in the US. Unless the lads in the customs office ignore packages between individuals for VAT, but I doubt they'll be so kind.

The SMABAT modular bud lineups have always intrigued me with their modular design. Though I've not yet looked into exactly how modular they are. If they're only a small step below just soldering your own drivers, it might not be worth the premium.

Here's another forum thread for your reading enjoyment "Absolute best budget earbuds?". I've not read through that thread, but you might find some recommended budget buds mentioned. Some may not be available anymore, but you might find something.

 

[baskingshark]

Yeah, that is kinda what I figured. Buds in general seem like really good bang-for-your-buck, but I suspect there comes a point where there's only so much improvement you're likely to see within a price category.

True, the prices themselves are very reasonable. I more meant it in the sense that you can get a 20 euro bud that sounds just as good as a 40-50 euro bud sometimes, and (at least to me) it's not always easy to figure out wether the 20 euro one is just really good, or the 40-50 euro one is just worse than it should be. So it's not always spend more = get more. I don't really know how the prices compare to IEM's to be honest. I've got some sort of skin condition in my ear canals that makes them very sensitive and itchy, trying to wear IEM's for longer than 10-15 minutes is torturous so I've just sort of given up on the form factor.

On the subject of cheaper TOTL buds, it does seem like there's quite a bit of variance in prices for buds that have what is considered TOTL sound. I'm assuming that buds by DIY makers also have/approach TOTL sound for reasonable prices, it's just a shame that I can't really consider the ones that are based in the US. Unless the lads in the customs office ignore packages between individuals for VAT, but I doubt they'll be so kind.

The SMABAT modular bud lineups have always intrigued me with their modular design. Though I've not yet looked into exactly how modular they are. If they're only a small step below just soldering your own drivers, it might not be worth the premium.

On your query of how earbuds compare to IEMs in pricing:

Budget buds start from $1. Yes $1 - case in point - Vido. And these sound decent for 1 buck. I would consider the $30ish and below range to still be a budget earbud. Whereas IEMs are generally considered budget IEMs if they cost sub $100 USD.

MidFI buds are perhaps the $50 - 100ish range. For IEMs the midFI bracket starts from $100 - 500? Some consider $300 to sub 1K to be midFI for IEMs too.

TOTL for buds are something beyond $100?. For TOTL IEMs, they can be like $1000 - 3000 or beyond.


So as you can see, earbuds are generally priced more affordable than IEMs (in general). And I would personally say the best sweet spot for price-performance ratio for earbuds and IEMs is at the MidFI region.

Budget gear is good for the coin, but you do get some improvement going from budget -> midFI. There are diminishing returns of course, but going from MidFI -> TOTL the diminishing returns are very bad. We are talking ballpark 10 - 20% improvement for 10 times the price differential. Even TOTL set have weaknesses and a new TOTL summitFI earbud or IEM comes out every few weeks to dethrone the current contender. Some folks wanna chase that last 10% price at any cost, but for most folks who can't sell their kidneys away, the budget/midFI bracket is where the gold is, IMHO.

 

[MelodyMood]

Any earbuds of JCALLY Series which has good Clear but Warm Sound with good Bass too? EP09 or EP98? How are they? Or JC 10? Should have clear sound but good bass too. With Mic pls.

Any other suggestion are welcome too. Thanks.

 

[Ronion]

Yeah, that is kinda what I figured. Buds in general seem like really good bang-for-your-buck, but I suspect there comes a point where there's only so much improvement you're likely to see within a price category.

True, the prices themselves are very reasonable. I more meant it in the sense that you can get a 20 euro bud that sounds just as good as a 40-50 euro bud sometimes, and (at least to me) it's not always easy to figure out wether the 20 euro one is just really good, or the 40-50 euro one is just worse than it should be. So it's not always spend more = get more. I don't really know how the prices compare to IEM's to be honest. I've got some sort of skin condition in my ear canals that makes them very sensitive and itchy, trying to wear IEM's for longer than 10-15 minutes is torturous so I've just sort of given up on the form factor.

On the subject of cheaper TOTL buds, it does seem like there's quite a bit of variance in prices for buds that have what is considered TOTL sound. I'm assuming that buds by DIY makers also have/approach TOTL sound for reasonable prices, it's just a shame that I can't really consider the ones that are based in the US. Unless the lads in the customs office ignore packages between individuals for VAT, but I doubt they'll be so kind.

The SMABAT modular bud lineups have always intrigued me with their modular design. Though I've not yet looked into exactly how modular they are. If they're only a small step below just soldering your own drivers, it might not be worth the premium.

I don’t know of any US based DIY salespersons. Do you?

 

[Setmagic]

On your query of how earbuds compare to IEMs in pricing:

Budget buds start from $1. Yes $1 - case in point - Vido. And these sound decent for 1 buck. I would consider the $30ish and below range to still be a budget earbud. Whereas IEMs are generally considered budget IEMs if they cost sub $100 USD.

MidFI buds are perhaps the $50 - 100ish range. For IEMs the midFI bracket starts from $100 - 500? Some consider $300 to sub 1K to be midFI for IEMs too.

TOTL for buds are something beyond $100?. For TOTL IEMs, they can be like $1000 - 3000 or beyond.


So as you can see, earbuds are generally priced more affordable than IEMs (in general). And I would personally say the best sweet spot for price-performance ratio for earbuds and IEMs is at the MidFI region.

Budget gear is good for the coin, but you do get some improvement going from budget -> midFI. There are diminishing returns of course, but going from MidFI -> TOTL the diminishing returns are very bad. We are talking ballpark 10 - 20% improvement for 10 times the price differential. Even TOTL set have weaknesses and a new TOTL summitFI earbud or IEM comes out every few weeks to dethrone the current contender. Some folks wanna chase that last 10% price at any cost, but for most folks who can't sell their kidneys away, the budget/midFI bracket is where the gold is, IMHO.

In my holy opinion.
Budget Earbuds start from 1$ and for 10$ you can get really good ones.

 

[firesign]

...

TOTL for buds are something beyond $100?. For TOTL IEMs, they can be like $1000 - 3000 or beyond.

...

Nowadays a lot of people would say that $1000 IEMs are mid-fi or lower

 

[jao29]

Anyone got their hands on the new earbuds by Fiio? Any impressions?

 

[Setmagic]

Nowadays a lot of people would say that $1000 IEMs are mid-fi or lower

Setmagic Golden Buds Award

For all who spend 1000$ or more for craft IEMs

 

[McCol]

Anyone got their hands on the new earbuds by Fiio? Any impressions?

I received my FF3 yesterday, tried them initially with the balanced foams, really good depth to the sound from the 14.2mm driver but found them a bit too warm in the bass with those foams.
Switched to the crisp treble do-nut foams and much prefer the sound, still a nice bass depth but the warmth has gone to leave nice clear detail

Its my first earbud purchase for quite a while but very impressed by these buds from Fiio

 

[Ronion]

I received my FF3 yesterday, tried them initially with the balanced foams, really good depth to the sound from the 14.2mm driver but found them a bit too warm in the bass with those foams.
Switched to the crisp treble do-nut foams and much prefer the sound, still a nice bass depth but the warmth has gone to leave nice clear detail

Its my first earbud purchase for quite a while but very impressed by these buds from Fiio

One of the best things about buds is the ease of tweaking the sound with foams. It can be done with other types of headphones as well, but the results are less predictable, often not what you are looking for, and the cost is considerably higher than with buds. Even the “expensive” foams are cheap on the grand scheme of things. With the economy the way it is, it’s nice to tweak on the cheap.

 

[Setmagic]

One of the best things about buds is the ease of tweaking the sound with foams. It can be done with other types of headphones as well, but the results are less predictable, often not what you are looking for, and the cost is considerably higher than with buds. Even the “expensive” foams are cheap on the grand scheme of things. With the economy the way it is, it’s nice to tweak on the cheap.

In other headphones on and over ear You have pads who are working the same way
In IEMs there are also silicones or foams.

 

[Danneq]

Ah, so you got one of the coveted Black Editions... nice! Lucky dog you! The only thing rarer is Henry's CAX Gold, only two pair were made or perhaps his White CampFred which but only a few pair were made.

Yeah, if I recall correctly it was @Danneq who had confirmed with Henry the total amount of CAX Black Editions that he had made. I don't even think he sold them all either.

2015​

Cypherus Audio X (CAX; Cy-Ax) CampFred; 32Ω (aka CF1; retuned Advanced Earbuds made by Henry Widjaya; Indonesia)​

​

2016​

Cypherus Audio (CAX) CAX Black Edition v1 v2; 32Ω (mid & late 2016 upgrades of CF1; only eight pairs were made by Henry Widjaya; Indonesia)​

Cypherus Audio (CAX) Cardas Golden Reference; 32Ω (an early 2016 model aka CAX Gold; only two pair were made by Henry Widjaya; Indonesia)​

Cypherus Audio (CAX) QFred; 70Ω (retuned Advanced Earbuds made by Henry Widjaya; Indonesia)​

​

2017​

Cypherus Audio (CAX) Blue Darth; 30Ω (retuned Advanced Earbuds made by Henry Widjaya; Indonesia)​

Cypherus Audio (CAX) Campfred v2; 32Ω (retuned Advanced Earbuds made by Henry Widjaya; Indonesia)​

Cypherus Audio (CAX) CAX Red Dragon; 32Ω (hand-made driver by Henry Widjaya; Indonesia)​

​

2018​

Cypherus Audio (CAX) Crescendo; 32Ω (made by Henry Widjaya; Indonesia)​

Cypherus Audio (CAX) White CampFred Limited Edition; 32Ω (hand-made driver; only a few pair were made by Henry Widjaya; Indonesia)​

Cypherus Audio (CAX) Zoomfred; 32Ω (aka Baby Red Dragon; hand-made driver by Henry Widjaya; Indonesia)​

Cypherus Audio (CAX) Zoomfred Pro; 32Ω (w/ cryo-copper cable; hand-made driver by Henry Widjaya; Indonesia)​

Great summary of the Cypherus earbuds!

I have not heard from Herry since before the corona pandemic. I hope he's okay. He used to send a short e-mail when he was working on something new. I last heard from him in 2019. In 2018 we met at e-earphone in Akihabara in Tokyo, Japan. That's when I bought my pair of Zoomfred and got to listen to the White Campfred.

I follow Cypherus in Facebook but nothing new has been posted there for over 2 years. Also a Head fier sent me a pm with questions this spring, since the Head fier did not get a reply from Herry.

Herry told me that he goes to Akihabara 1-2 times a year to buy parts for earbuds and other audio related projects. But Japan has not accepted tourists since the pandemic started and has not opened up yet. I'm here right now with my family but I had to apply for a VISA to get in (My wife's Japanese so I get to enter as a relative). If Herry cannot get good parts he might not be able to focus on his hobby right now. Anyway, I hope he's okay.

I have not bought a new pair of earbuds in over 1 year. Fiio EM5 were the last ones. I went to e-earphone the other day and they only have 4-5 pairs of earbuds. I listened to Moondrop Chaconne and Audio Technica CM2000 (?). The Audio Technica earbuds have a great soundstage but sound very tinny. Chaconne blew them away. If I find a second hand pair of Chaconne I might buy them. Otherwise I am happy with my collection. Haven't even logged into Head fi for a few months. Lately I have been focusing more on my other hobby which is movies and home projectors...

Glad to see some old names here.

 

[ttorbic]

One of the best things about buds is the ease of tweaking the sound with foams. It can be done with other types of headphones as well, but the results are less predictable, often not what you are looking for, and the cost is considerably higher than with buds. Even the “expensive” foams are cheap on the grand scheme of things. With the economy the way it is, it’s nice to tweak on the cheap.

I think I recall you or someone else saying this earlier on in this thread. I was excited to try out different foams to tune my two earbuds (Riku's Alter Rider 1 and Tgxear's Serratus), but I did not get the results I expected. I wanted to raise the bass on the Serratus, so I swapped out the stock for Hiegi foams, but the bass was weird, bloated, and the stage and tonality suffered. When I wanted to decrease the bass on Alter Rider 1 by switching the stock (dense) foam to Serratus stock foam, the sound became rather thin, and the treble too aggressive. In the end, I went back to stock foam on both sets (I really like them in stock anyway; just thought I'd experiment). And swapping foams is a pain! Ripped one just trying to get it on the earbud.

Anyway, I'm a newbie in the earbuds world so I may have had unrealistic expectations, but so far I haven't had much luck with fine-tuning my sets using foams

 

[Charlyro222]

Just another masterpiece from Ve arrived.

You will literally be inmersed by music that will come and go every where.
Must be made taken in mind Instrumental Smooth Jazz. One of the best products if not the best that never listen for this kind of music.
A must have.