[koniotaur]

Guess after some time with them I agree with what you've said... The EMX lacks body @Danneq. Wouldn't recommend them either

 

[samandhi]

While 7Hz did have a big hit with the Timeless, they had two DD IEMs before that which were not hits at all. And it also appears to be much the same with the Dioko (another planar), even in collaboration with Crinacle. So far, they have been a one-trick pony where IEMs have been concerned. It is no surprise to me that they have an earbud line, but it is also no surprise that they aren't very popular.

Having said all of that, I don't want to say that 7Hz got lucky, but they sort of did. It goes back to what @Ronion said (IMO). And that is that you must start with a quality driver, and 7hz was basically first up to bat with a new driver. There is no real proof of this, but I suspect that Letshuoer would use the same driver, and also became a hit with the S12. Tinhifi P1 Max was next in line (also using this same driver, I suspect), followed by the Raptgo Hook-X (yep you guessed it, using the same driver). DUNU has gotten into the game now with the Talos, and for a fourth time, it is eerily similar to that 14.xx driver that has been in some hot ticket items. That brings us full circle back to 7Hz. Salnotes (a budget sister company of 7Hz) came out with the Dioko just recently, and while they aren't very popular, I suspect it is not so much because they sound bad, it is more because they look like grandma's jewelry. Though they DO sound bad according to some. I think it is using that same 14.xx driver that has fueled some very popular planar IEMs. Now of course they all say "custom 14.xx planar driver" but that really means nothing. Change anything about it and it can be called custom.

On the other hand, I could be totally wrong on this, and is only conjecture on my part (and others that have also taken note) from closely watching the planar IEMs that have been released in the last (whatever) time period.

Anyhow, I went way off course there and didn't mean to. The point is that I think, much like DUNU did with the Alpha 1 (which is also still not discontinued, and is priced similarly), 7Hz put out an earbud just to have one out there, and don't really care about the bud itself.

 

[mt877]

Here's a scan of the M4 damper with comparison to the type 3 damper. The damper shown installed in the M4 base is like a window screen with the mesh interwoven, so it might look like the mesh is rectangular, but it's really square. It just looks rectangular because the of the mesh weave. So it appears that the type 3 is the stock damper.

Spoiler: M4 stock damper type 3

I captured the tuning damper images with my slide scanner.

Spoiler: M4 tuning dampers type 1, 2 and 3 mesh

I'm pretty busy with work this week, but just wanted to revisit this M4 damper thing. I did a reflective scan of the type 3 damper so it would more closely match what the installed stock damper looks like. While it is not an exact match between the two, the mesh sizing is more visible and looks quite close. Still waiting for Smabat's reply to my email about the tuning dampers.

Spoiler: M4 stock damper type 3 redux

 

[baskingshark]

2020 - 7Hz Beatles; 32Ω (w/ nano ZnO crystal diaphragm)​

I would highly advise to avoid the Beatles... I wish I had taken @Alex.Grimm's sage advice and not buy it. A total train wreck of an earbud which is so surprising coming from the team that created the Timeless. It was so fatiguing and confusing that I gave up trying to understand it. So disappointing...

While 7Hz did have a big hit with the Timeless, they had two DD IEMs before that which were not hits at all. And it also appears to be much the same with the Dioko (another planar), even in collaboration with Crinacle. So far, they have been a one-trick pony where IEMs have been concerned. It is no surprise to me that they have an earbud line, but it is also no surprise that they aren't very popular.

Having said all of that, I don't want to say that 7Hz got lucky, but they sort of did. It goes back to what @Ronion said (IMO). And that is that you must start with a quality driver, and 7hz was basically first up to bat with a new driver. There is no real proof of this, but I suspect that Letshuoer would use the same driver, and also became a hit. Tinhifi P1 Max was next in line (also using this same driver, I suspect), followed by the Raptgo Hook-X (yep you guessed it, using the same driver). DUNU has gotten into the game now with the Talos, and for a fourth time, it is eerily similar to that 14.xx driver that has been in some hot ticket items. That brings us full circle back to 7Hz. Salnotes (a budget sister company of 7Hz) came out with the Dioko just recently, and while they aren't very popular, I suspect it is not so much because they sound bad, it is more because they look like grandma's jewelry. Though they DO sound bad according to some. I think it is using that same 14.xx driver that has fueled some very popular planar IEMs. Now of course they all say "custom 14.xx planar driver" but that really means nothing. Change anything about it and it can be called custom.

On the other hand, I could be totally wrong on this, and is only conjecture on my part (and others that have also taken note) from closely watching the planar IEMs that have been released in the last (whatever) time period.

Anyhow, I went way off course there and didn't mean to. The point is that I think, much like DUNU did with the Alpha 1 (which is also still not discontinued, and is priced similarly), 7Hz put out an earbud just to have one out there, and don't really care about the bud itself.

Thanks for the headsup @WoodyLuvr ! I didn't even know 7Hz had a earbud released! Thanks for taking one for the team!



BTW, I know the current IEM planar hype in CHIFI-land for IEMs was started with the 7Hz Timeless, which I would rate at 3/5 (this may be an unpopular opinion). No doubt the Timeless is excellent technically, but the timbral accuracy is very off. Acoustic instruments sound plasticky. Lots of treble spikes and the soundstage has literally zero depth. The Timeless nevertheless was a kind of proof of concept that let the other companies latch on and push out their own planars.

Some of the other 7Hz stuff were hit or miss too. The 7Hz Eternal was a fail, I would rank it 1.5/5. Vastly overpriced and sounds no better than a budget single DD. Haven't heard the Dioko, but the Salnotes Zero (sister company of 7Hz) is quite decent for $20 USD (and is being hyped to the moon), though it ain't a giant killer. They are even trying to muscle in on the dongle DAC/amp pie with the release of the 71 Mobile DAC, but I didn't know they had earbuds!

Anyway speaking about planars, this year is literally the year where CHIFI companies have a FOMO (fear of missing out) on planars. Moondrop, DUNU, Shuoer, Kinera (seems Kinera's one may not be a true planar), Rapto Hook, TRI, TinHIFI et al are all pushing out planars and riding on this train.

I think some of our DIY friends are trying to develop a planar earbud, so here's hoping to their success!!! Planars are no doubt an exotic drivers compared to the run-of-the-mill BAs and DDs, and audiophiles are always itching to try new toys and gear, but planar earbuds are truly ambitious. If one can pull it off, that will be amazing and a game-changer!

 

[samandhi]

I'm pretty busy with work this week, but just wanted to revisit this M4 damper thing. I did a reflective scan of the type 3 damper so it would more closely match what the installed stock damper looks like. While it is not an exact match between the two, the mesh sizing is more visible and looks quite close. Still waiting for Smabat's reply to my email about the tuning dampers.

Spoiler: M4 stock damper type 3 redux

It does look (to me in this picture) that the hole sizing is a bit different, though it IS indeed much clearer. Of course, like you say, it might appear different because of (potential) zoom differences??? Anyhow thanks for taking the time to redo it. And I also eagerly await a reply from Smabat on the matter. Have a great week at work bro!

 

[samandhi]

BTW, I know the current IEM planar hype in CHIFI-land for IEMs was started with the 7Hz Timeless, which I would rate at 3/5 (this may be an unpopular opinion). No doubt the Timeless is excellent technically, but the timbral accuracy is very off. Acoustic instruments sound plasticky. Lots of treble spikes and the soundstage has literally zero depth. The Timeless nevertheless was a kind of proof of concept that let the other companies latch on and push out their own planars.

I would say that you are right on the money IMO, and I was also not very popular in the 7Hz thread for saying so (in the beginning). The Timeless never was able to bring down the grand daddy of planar IEMs anyhow (Tinhifi P1). The Hook-X (to me) is the first in this new wave that are actually really good IMO.

Anyway speaking about planars, this year is literally the year where CHIFI companies have a FOMO (fear of missing out) on planars. Moondrop, DUNU, Shuoer, Kinera (seems Kinera's one may not be a true planar), Rapto Hook, TRI, TinHIFI et al are all pushing out planars and riding on this train.

Oh, don't forget about CCA. Yep, they have one out too. And poor Tinhifi, they have not been able to match their own success since the OG P1 came out, though the P1 Max are (from what I have read) much better than the P1 Plus, and the P2. So a step (back) in the right direction... LOL

 

[mt877]

It does look (to me in this picture) that the hole sizing is a bit different, though it IS indeed much clearer. Of course, like you say, it might appear different because of (potential) zoom differences??? Anyhow thanks for taking the time to redo it. And I also eagerly await a reply from Smabat on the matter. Have a great week at work bro!

They were both scanned on my flatbed scanner at the same resolution. The difference is the damper from the kit was absolutely flat on the glass, while the M4 bud may not have been perfectly flat on the glass due to the spring loaded pins. I do note that the mesh thickness between the 2 are different. The damper from the kit has a thicker looking mesh while the M4 stock damper has a thinner looking mesh. The open areas of the mesh could be different due to this difference in mesh thickness. So it could very well be that Smabat named the damper in the kit as type 3, but it could be they misnamed it and it's actually the type 4. They should have had a damper kit with all 4 types of damper. That's a big mistake on their part, IMO.

 

[samandhi]

That's a big mistake on their part, IMO.

Agreed!

 

[ttorbic]

Thanks for the headsup @WoodyLuvr ! I didn't even know 7Hz had a earbud released! Thanks for taking one for the team!



BTW, I know the current IEM planar hype in CHIFI-land for IEMs was started with the 7Hz Timeless, which I would rate at 3/5 (this may be an unpopular opinion). No doubt the Timeless is excellent technically, but the timbral accuracy is very off. Acoustic instruments sound plasticky. Lots of treble spikes and the soundstage has literally zero depth. The Timeless nevertheless was a kind of proof of concept that let the other companies latch on and push out their own planars.

Some of the other 7Hz stuff were hit or miss too. The 7Hz Eternal was a fail, I would rank it 1.5/5. Vastly overpriced and sounds no better than a budget single DD. Haven't heard the Dioko, but the Salnotes Zero (sister company of 7Hz) is quite decent for $20 USD (and is being hyped to the moon), though it ain't a giant killer. They are even trying to muscle in on the dongle DAC/amp pie with the release of the 71 Mobile DAC, but I didn't know they had earbuds!

Anyway speaking about planars, this year is literally the year where CHIFI companies have a FOMO (fear of missing out) on planars. Moondrop, DUNU, Shuoer, Kinera (seems Kinera's one may not be a true planar), Rapto Hook, TRI, TinHIFI et al are all pushing out planars and riding on this train.

I think some of our DIY friends are trying to develop a planar earbud, so here's hoping to their success!!! Planars are no doubt an exotic drivers compared to the run-of-the-mill BAs and DDs, and audiophiles are always itching to try new toys and gear, but planar earbuds are truly ambitious. If one can pull it off, that will be amazing and a game-changer!

I agree that planar earbuds would be game-changing! I'd guess that the biggest challenge is getting the timbre right - I find planar IEMs to have a less natural timbre than DD IEMs and earbuds. I thought the timbre was ok on planar HP (Sundara), so I'm not sure what is causing the drop in timbre quality between IEM and HPs. Obviously there are a myriad of factors that can contribute to this, so I hope DIYers can find a solution

 

[WoodyLuvr]

When I started coming to Head fi there was only Yuin PK earbuds if you wanted earbuds. Audio Techica had the CM series but those were hard to come by. Then slowly smaller earbud makers like Blox started releasing earbuds. Then Sennheiser released MX980 and MX985. Later Chinese makers started to release more and more earbuds. Still a small market but a lot more options nowadays.

Yeah, the ole' rabbit hole as you knew it has become much, much deeper and extremely complicated...

After a little way the rabbit hole suddenly went down, deep into the ground. Alice could not stop herself falling, and down she went, too. It was a very strange hole. Alice was falling very slowly, and she had time to think and to look around her. She could see nothing below her because it was so dark. But when she looked at the sides of the hole, she could see cupboards and books and pictures on the walls. She had time to take things out of a cupboard, look at them, and then put them back in a cupboard lower down. “Well!” thought Alice. “After a fall like this, I can fall anywhere! I can fall downstairs at home, and I won’t cry or say a word about it!” Down, down, down. “How far have I fallen now?” Alice said aloud to herself. “Perhaps I’m near the centre of the earth. Let me think … That’s four thousand miles down.” (Alice was very good at her school lessons and could remember a lot of things like this.) Down, down, down. Would she ever stop falling? Alice was very nearly asleep when, suddenly, she was sitting on the ground.​

And most unfortunately we all have become a little madder in the process ... we are all absolute lunatics now!

“But I don’t want to go among mad people,” Alice remarked.​

“Oh, you can’t help that,” said the Cat: “we’re all mad here. I’m mad. You’re mad.”​

“How do you know I’m mad?” said Alice.​

“You must be,” said the Cat, “or you wouldn’t have come here.”​

 

[Into The Light5]

Hi, has anyone tried this before? One review said it is good im tempted, chitty store sells those

https://a.aliexpress.com/_msEwiLe

 

[JAnonymous5150]

Oh, and you were right... This is one of those "multi-listen" albums. There is no way to get it all in one take.

It most certainly is! And I should have put the Indy thing together from past comments. I was interested in the possible Notre Dame connection because I almost went there instead of UC Berkeley because of how much I liked the area and the school itself so I was curious.

 

[JAnonymous5150]

I’m still puzzled why sources sound different. Reviewing Shanling UP4 at the moment, and I feel like a fraud for saying that Andromeda sounds richer and more impactful on UP4 comparing to Apple dongle. I mean it’s Andromeda. It requires only peanut in power output to make sound.

Some times it can be as simple as the way different drivers react to various increases in current, power, or amplification. Different DACs have different filters applied by the chips' manufacturers and then by the device manufacturer implementing the chip and sometimes even DSP/post-signal processing. Then of course you can have even more processing done at the firmware and software levels, NOS/OS modes, so on and so forth.

People that insist that all sources sound the same often oversimplify. If you look into it yourself you can see that there are many reasons for sonic variations between sources. Even just visiting the websites of DAC chip and op amp manufacturers will show you that those manufacturers actively develop various technologies included in their hardware in the form of various signal processing techniques and filters that are explicitly meant to provide a specific sound. A good example of this would be AKM's Velvet Sound technology or Muses signal stabilizing envelope filters.

I'm not saying these things make huge differences as the differences cans be quite subtle, but they're noticeable with gear that is sufficiently revealing. I think too many people assume that if they can't hear a difference then the difference doesn't exist. And let's face it, disgruntled customers are often more vocal that happy ones so when someone buys a new expensive DAC combo and doesn't hear the changes they were expecting then they tend to be the people loudly proclaiming the snake oil line.

I also think a big part is played by the fact that hyperbolic descriptions of very subtle differences by reviewers/content creators and even unintentionally put out there by folks on forums and subreddits. People new to the hobby that don't know what to expect read reviews and posts describing all the amazing performance differences between two products which is sometimes just a reviewer's way of making a very small difference sound more exciting and they go into a purchase with unrealistically high expectations.

Another factor I have believe I have observed myself is when people new to the hobby don't understand that a 5% difference is likely a bigger deal to a dedicated audiophile pushing for uncompromising performance than it is to a guy just looking for something better than Beats or even just your average music lover and headphone user. People fail to take differences in perspective into account all the time.

Sorry for the essay. I'm also sure there are tons of other reasons I haven't even begun to contemplate or have left out. I'd also like to note that I don't think everyone can hear the differences whether because of differences in hearing, gear that doesn't reveal those differences, etc so many of the people saying all sources sound the same are likely people whose personal experience tells them that that's true and fail to consider that their personal experience may not be universally applicable.

 

[BCool]

Hi, has anyone tried this before? One review said it is good im tempted, chitty store sells those



https://a.aliexpress.com/_msEwiLe

Not quite the same but @ClieOS used that shell to build a planar earbud here.

 

[weexisttocease]

New earbuds from K's.

https://hifigo.com/blogs/news/intro...earbuds-with-titanium-alloy-acoustic-cavities