[boromcom]

Folks at VE are funny. I guess I should try a Monk.

Haha funny. You should try Asura 3.0 FE. Quite good.

 

[o0genesis0o]

Haha funny. You should try Asura 3.0 FE. Quite good.

Funny that you mentioned. I was planning the same. Though I might wait for Fiio FF5 first.

Btw, I just realised what F in FF3 means: Fiio Flat head.

FDx = Fiio Dynamic Driver
FAx = Fiio Balance Armature
FHx = Fiio Hybrid

 

[boromcom]

Funny that you mentioned. I was planning the same. Though I might wait for Fiio FF5 first.

Btw, I just realised what F in FF3 means: Fiio Flat head.

FDx = Fiio Dynamic Driver
FAx = Fiio Balance Armature
FHx = Fiio Hybrid

I have FH9 and FD7. But I really love my FF3 haha. VE sun copper is good choice as well. But need Amplifier to drive. And don’t think it is good for bass lover.

 

[Ronion]

Funny that you mentioned. I was planning the same. Though I might wait for Fiio FF5 first.

Btw, I just realised what F in FF3 means: Fiio Flat head.

FDx = Fiio Dynamic Driver
FAx = Fiio Balance Armature
FHx = Fiio Hybrid

I want the FF5 already even though I’m completely happy with the FF3. I’m hoping they add a little treble and resolution even if it means high impedance. I’ll be bummed if it’s an FF3 with an mmcx. This port they have works really well.

 

[o0genesis0o]

I want the FF5 already even though I’m completely happy with the FF3. I’m hoping they add a little treble and resolution even if it means high impedance. I’ll be bummed if it’s an FF3 with an mmcx. This port they have works really well.

Perhaps they will make it a cable up earbud, so that they can use the existing interchangeable plug cable with ear hooks rather than making a new cable. Knowing Fiio, maybe they will up the treble and bass as well to make the sound more "exciting"? I think whatever they make, they need to ensure that it is drivable by their KA1 dongle at least, so it's unlikely that we see a high impedance pair.

Who knows, maybe they are crazy enough to stick a BA driver in it like something from Smabat

Edit: just realised that Smabat ST20pro is a disaster

 

[fooltoque]

Hi everyone. I am somewhat new to the pursuit of good sound, and a returnee to earbuds. I've tried many iems, all with varying levels of discomfort, and never found any that I can stand to wear for more than 20 minutes even though I really like some of them. So many headphones are focused on isolation, but outside of the most noisy environments (trains/planes), I don't actually like the feeling of being isolated sonically. I prefer to have my music seamlessly meshed in with the environment. I'm sure it is not uncommon in this thread. I recently found this thread, and I found a used pair of FiiO EM5s, and I'm really enjoying them! Thanks to all of you for letting me know that earbuds are still alive.

Anyways, that is my intro, but I have a question too. While my EM5's are comfortable all day, I am kinda sensitive to materials, and the foam just gives an annoying feeling in m my ears. I'd actually prefer them without foam entirely despite slight pain after a while, but they sound better with foam in my opinion. Are there other options than foam for earbud covers that might be a bit more comfortable and have a similar affect on the sound?

 

[WoodyLuvr]

I have been made aware of some rumblings and misgivings about the sound signature chart and would like to clear the air, as well as to open it up to you all for full discussion and critique. This chart is most definitely open to any/all constructive criticism.

A WORK-IN-PROGRESS
Please know that @ian91 and I both do consider this chart to be a work-in-progress, a truly living document currently only in it's infancy. We fully accept that it will undergo many radical changes along the way to reach a final useable state. Really, such a chart is like the mythical "golden goose" that so many have searched for and failed to capture... mostly because they were too determined to make it absolutely perfect and/or stubbornly wanting it to fit every known transducer signature type across all transducer mediums. Most likely an impossibility for a number of audiological reasons there simply will always be a few exceptions and those special cases where the chart will fail and/or not completely work. As long as we all understand and accept that we can get pretty damn close to perfecting it through our continued collective determination and thoughtful patience.

So honestly, any/all suggestions, varying perspectives, and difference in opinions are welcome and will be fully heard out and considered without defensive reaction from our part as we truly want to perfect this chart for the benefit of the entire earbud (and headphone) community.

DISCLOSURE
Also, for full disclosure, a very well-known senior recording engineer (who wishes to remain anonymous for the time being) has been assisting us with this chart and has been using it in a master recording classes that he has been conducting. So we been receiving some very valuable advice from him and his students whom have offered us a many brilliant suggestion and correction that have proven quite helpful.

ONE REQUEST
It is crucial that one does not interpret this chart two-dimensionally but rather views it three-dimensionally using all axes offered. Optimally, this would have been best presented as a sphere or better yet as a circular spiral but in-turn that would have made it extremely difficult to clearly see and to read all the section labels. Literally losing everyone in 3D space. Thus, we are limited to presenting it in two-dimensions for the sake of clarity and ease of presentation.

Please note that we tried our best to stick to the "classic" (more basic) sound signature & tuning characteristic definitions as used by recording professionals & audio engineers and tried our best to avoid ambiguous, hard to agree upon, and/or controversial audiophile terminologies. However, if a solid argument can be made and agreed upon by the majority to add certain terms to the chart it will be done without hesitation and the reverse is true, removing any agreed upon terms that are confusing or creating interpretation or plotting conflicts.

Spoiler: SOUND SIGNATURE CHARTS v9.1

https://docs.google.com/presentatio...ouid=112600326893555981613&rtpof=true&sd=true

 

[baskingshark]

Hi everyone. I am somewhat new to the pursuit of good sound, and a returnee to earbuds. I've tried many iems, all with varying levels of discomfort, and never found any that I can stand to wear for more than 20 minutes even though I really like some of them. So many headphones are focused on isolation, but outside of the most noisy environments (trains/planes), I don't actually like the feeling of being isolated sonically. I prefer to have my music seamlessly meshed in with the environment. I'm sure it is not uncommon in this thread. I recently found this thread, and I found a used pair of FiiO EM5s, and I'm really enjoying them! Thanks to all of you for letting me know that earbuds are still alive.

Anyways, that is my intro, but I have a question too. While my EM5's are comfortable all day, I am kinda sensitive to materials, and the foam just gives an annoying feeling in m my ears. I'd actually prefer them without foam entirely despite slight pain after a while, but they sound better with foam in my opinion. Are there other options than foam for earbud covers that might be a bit more comfortable and have a similar affect on the sound?

Yes there are silicone covers you can get to put over a earbud. See the photo below:



They however, will change the sound signature compared to full foams. Generally full foams give more bass and warmth and tame the higher frequencies.

 

[WoodyLuvr]

Here is an example of how the chart (just mentioned in my post above) can be used to help plot a transducer's sound signature and offer an accompanying perspective to the classic FR graph.

Ks Bell-LBBs Sound Signature Chart

Ks Bell-LBBs Sound Signature Plot

Primary = Mid-Centric - Neutral​

Secondary (Strong) = Warm (not muddy, nor muffled)​

Secondary (Weak) = Sharp & Detailed​

Tertiary (Complementing) = Hard-Harsh (enhanced female vocals; sometimes aggressive though)​

Tertiary (Alternative Complementing) = Forward Mids - W-Shaped (while others may only hear a slight "Inverted U-Shaped" instead)​

Tertiary (Opposing) = Hard-Harsh (not overly bright-sibilant it can get "too exciting" for those sensitive to highs)​

Tertiary (Opposing) = Thin & Tinny (prone to aggressiveness)​

​

Breakdown of Ks Bell-LBBs Sound Signature Plot

The primary sound signature (red dot and red-shaded oval) of the Ks Bell-LBBs is "mid-centric - neutral" that may offer an ever so slight "inverted u-shaped" type tuning with a very strong secondary sound signature (larger blue shaded balloon) that reaches out to "warm" but is far from being muddy, smeared, or muffled. A non-overpowering weak secondary sound signature (smaller blue shaded balloon) reaches out to "detailed" for greater resolution and more realistic, natural-sounding timbre. Prominent complementing tertiary sound characteristics (green shaded arrows) are exhibited in the upper mids and very lower treble that may/can come across as being rather "hard-harsh" but in-turn also provides enhanced female vocals and reproduction of bright-leaning instruments. Due to mildly recessed mid and upper highs a sneaky and quite "aggressive" ("thin & tinny") opposing tertiary sound characteristic (green shaded arrow) may rear it's ugly head occasionally with certain recordings and music genres. Some individuals may hear an alternative complementing tertiary sound characteristics (purple shaded arrow) which reaches down to forward mids ("w-shaped" type sound) while others may hear only a very slight "inverted u-shaped" type tuning (I sit in this camp).​

Why do I plot the Ks Bell-LBBs primary sound signature as "mid-centric - neutral"?

Flathead earbuds' primary sound signature are generally mid-centric (please view the chart above as this area is quite large) as it is inherent of and intrinsic to this transducer medium's open-air (open-back like) design. That said many flathead earbuds can and do exhibit VERY strong secondary characteristics that pull their overall sound signature far away from the primary signature into other quadrants (other areas) on the chart (e.g. L-Shape (Basshead); V-Shape; Female Poison; etc.).​

 

[rprodrigues]

I have been made aware of some rumblings and misgivings about my sound signature chart and would like to clear the air, as well as to open it up to you all for full discussion and critique. This chart is most definitely open to any/all constructive criticism.

A WORK-IN-PROGRESS
Please know that @ian91 and I both do consider this chart (v9.0) to be a work-in-progress, a truly living document only in it's infancy. We fully accept that it will undergo many radical changes along the way to reach a final useable state. Really, such a chart is like the mythical "golden goose" that so many have chased and failed to capture... mostly because they were too determined to make it absolutely perfect and/or stubbornly wanting it to fit every known transducer signature type across all transducer mediums. Most likely an impossibility for a number of audiological reasons there simply will always be a few exceptions and cases where the chart will fail and/or not completely work. As long as we all understand and accept that we can get pretty damn close to perfecting it through our continued collective determination and thoughtful patience.

So honestly, any/all suggestions, varying perspectives, and difference in opinions are welcome and will be fully heard out and considered without defense reaction from our part as we truly want to perfect this chart for the benefit of the entire earbud (and headphone) community.

DISCLOSURE
Also, for full disclosure, a very well-known senior recording engineer (who wishes to remain anonymous for the time being) has been assisting us with this chart and has been using it the past year in master recording classes that he has been conducting. So we been receiving some very valuable advice from him and his students whom have offered us a many brilliant suggestion and correction that have proven quite helpful.

ONE REQUEST
It is crucial that one does not interpret this chart two-dimensionally but rather views it three-dimensionally using all axes offered. Optimally, this would have been best presented as a sphere or better yet as a circular spiral but in-turn that would have made it extremely difficult to clearly see and to read all the section labels. Literally losing everyone in 3D space. Thus, we are limited to presenting it in two-dimensions for the sake of clarity and ease of presentation.

Please note that we tried our best to stick to the "classic" (more basic) sound signature & tuning characteristic definitions as used by recording professionals & audio engineers and tried our best to avoid ambiguous, hard to agree upon, and/or controversial audiophile terminologies. However, if a solid argument can be made and agreed upon by the majority to add certain terms to the chart it will be done without hesitation and the reverse is true, removing any agreed upon terms that are confusing or creating interpretation or plotting conflicts.

Spoiler: SOUND SIGNATURE CHARTS

https://docs.google.com/presentatio...ouid=112600326893555981613&rtpof=true&sd=true

That's an amazing work!

 

[fooltoque]

Yes there are silicone covers you can get to put over a earbud. See the photo below:



They however, will change the sound signature compared to full foams. Generally full foams give more bass and warmth and tame the higher frequencies.

Hmmm... I wonder if I could slip one of those over the foams to get the sound benefit of the foams while having only the silicon touch my ears.

 

[iron2k]

Thanks @RikudouGoku

 

[Ronion]

Hmmm... I wonder if I could slip one of those over the foams to get the sound benefit of the foams while having only the silicon touch my ears.

Many have tried-or t lest I have LOL. No success no success.

 

[Eduardiofilo]

Did you try thin foams? I always find donut foams too hot in the upper mids and treble, but the thin foams are somewhere between the balanced and the donuts.

if you are still not happy with them, just get an e12 Monte Blanc LOL. I laugh, but I’m sort of serious.

27.17 MXN$ 32%de DESCUENTO | Repuesto de cubierta de almohadillas para auriculares, esponja negra, 100 unidades
https://a.aliexpress.com/_mOR2eLQ

Recently I bought that pack of thin foams. I really like them. It's more balanced and you can hear more details that get lost with thick or semithick foams

 

[WoodyLuvr]

Hmmm... I wonder if I could slip one of those over the foams to get the sound benefit of the foams while having only the silicon touch my ears.

All About Flathead Earbud Cushions