[RXShadow]

  Hi Mad Lust Envy,
 
I am really new to the gaming headphone life. Being new and not knowing any better I originally went to Turtle Beach. But I just couldn't find a headphone that really struck my fancy. There was no way I was going to pay 300 dollars for a gaming headset that might break in 6 months. So I did a lot of research and a lot of reading. I eventually came across a site that swore by Sennheiser's. So I ventured into a realm of a true audiophile.
 
I have looked at the PC 350 SE, PC 323D. I wasn't really sold on the PC 363D.  So for quite some time I was pretty much focused on the PC 350 SE. Then I read some other sites and they swore by the Sennheiser HD 558. So then I was focused on that one. Until I read your forum post about headphones. I really liked the ATH-AD700 from what you had stated. It looked as though it might be one I might be interested in, I even found one that was well priced. But like a fool I passed on it and waited. And when I made my decision it was gone.
 
So now I am a bit perplexed by all the headphones I have looked at and read about. These headphones will be mainly for consoles. Xbox 360 and the PS4. I do some competitive gaming on the consoles, while I play some games on the PC I don't play anything competitive. A really nice soundstage like the ATH-AD700 would be great or something at least close to that. I would prefer to spend under $300.00. For just the head phones.
 
Also if you can recommend an decent amp/dac for the headphones that would be great. I had been looking at the Fiio E17 and the Astro 2013 Mixamp. And like I said I am new to this world. So which ever is going to produce the best sound would be beneficial. I will also be needing a mic for any headphones that doesn't have a mic. I already have a sound card for my computer.
 
Thanks all for helping me for my gaming immersion.

 
Hey there. I would say Welcome to Headfi, but I'm probably not the best person to say that. I'm not Mad Lust Envy, but I could give my opinion (which you should probably take it with a grain of salt)
 
Sennheiser's PC and GAME series are very equivalent to the 558/598 and are more expensive. If you want to go for Sennheisers, I would suggest the 598 since your budget is $300.
 
While the AD700 is great for its amazing soundstage, I would advice to go for something a little bit more "fun". Soundstage is great, but it's not everything, and certainly wouldn't suit you for non-competitive needs. I personally prefer even some fun on competitive, cause I do expect explosions and vehicle crashes to also sound amazing, but that's just me.
 
There's alot of options you can go for. An AKG Q701 is probably a better option, it's soundstage is more than enough and has good enough bass for your needs. They will need to be amped though. There's a lot of other nice options for you to choose, an HD598 or maybe even a Soundmagic HP200. I would suggest reading the reviews and see what suits you better.
 
For the mic, just get a modmic if you want something great, or a simple clip-on mic if you want something simple. I will let the other (more experienced people) help you on the DAC/AMP.
 
But like I said, take my advice with a grain salt. I'm not probably the best person to take from.
 

  Option 1: STX/ZXR + Modi Optical + Magni
If you're going for Optical Modi, go for something cheaper such as the DG/Z. The soundcard will be MAINLY for VSS only, there's no point in overspending. Like commented above, it's still a great option and there's nothing wrong with it.
Option 2: 2 setups depending on Surround: USB Modi/Magni or Xonar DX + Amp
If you don't want VSS, first idea is a great option. If you do want VSS, your other options are better imo.
Option 3: Xonar DX + Magni
If you're depending on the soundcard's DAC, I would use the STX/ZXR more than than DX. The DX (or even better, the DG) is great for giving you Dolby Headphone on a great Optical DAC/AMP. Although I'm not sure how the DX's DAC fares with the others.
Option 3.1: STX/ZXR + Magni
That looks fine. I'm not sure about STX's DAC, but I do know the ZXR's DAC is quite good enough for great general needs.
 
Questions which would help choose option:

1. How is STX/ZXR DAC compared to Modi DAC?

2. Let's say you use Optical Out into an External DAC (with an Optical In) to override the soundcard DAC. Does Optical Out degrade quality over the typical RCA Out? In other words is Optical or RCA better?
Not sure. It shouldn't, but I would let someone here say for certain.
 
 
Ty all!

 
I've commented on each opinion, based on my opinions. Probably would advice to get someone's more experience backing just to make sure I didn't say anything stupid. There's nothing wrong with getting Opti Modi and connecting to the sound card to achieve VSS, or getting an amp to connect through RCA.

 

[D126]

I'm super confused by what someone is telling me.
 
Can anyone confirm that the following setup is able to carry Dolby Virtual Headset Surround Sound (5.1/7.1) like any normal soundcard? 
 
STX Optical Out -> Optical Cable -> Modi External Optical In -> Modi External DAC RCA -> RCA Cable -> Magni Amp RCA -> Magni Headphone Jack (for Headphones)
 
I feel like this person telling me that it won't work due to Optical needing compression for 5.1 and RCA only being able to carry L/R is thinking I am talking about Physical Speaker Surround.

 

[jaysins]

Dolby, DTS etc are all compressed. It's not necessarily a bad thing though DTS and some other formats are of a little bit higher quality than Dolby. The STX DAC is pretty good but I did prefer the O2 for music as it was a bit more articulate and I enjoy the high and low end performance out of it. It's a pretty small difference but it was there. Is it worth the extra money? Only you can decide but I do think it would be redundant to get the best Sound Card for the DAC and purchase another DAC. The order you have listed with components is correct and would work. 

 

[D126]

  Dolby, DTS etc are all compressed. It's not necessarily a bad thing though DTS and some other formats are of a little bit higher quality than Dolby. The STX DAC is pretty good but I did prefer the O2 for music as it was a bit more articulate and I enjoy the high and low end performance out of it. It's a pretty small difference but it was there. Is it worth the extra money? Only you can decide but I do think it would be redundant to get the best Sound Card for the DAC and purchase another DAC. The order you have listed with components is correct and would work. 

Thanks for the confirmation. I currently have a Xonar DX. The microphone in and Optical Out are doubled in the same port. The main reason I'd upgrade to the STX/ZxR is for the seperate ports allowing me to use both Optical Out and microphone in. Would you just keep the DX and put the microphone on the front panel/onboard?
 
SBX Pro Studio would be compressed as well then, right? The Dolby Surround 7.1 I am using right now with my Xonar DX -> Headphone In is compressed as well, right? I'm not losing out on Headphone Surround by going to Optical?

 

[Stillhart]

  I'm super confused by what someone is telling me.
 
Can anyone confirm that the following setup is able to carry Dolby Virtual Headset Surround Sound (5.1/7.1) like any normal soundcard? 
 
STX Optical Out -> Optical Cable -> Modi External Optical In -> Modi External DAC RCA -> RCA Cable -> Magni Amp RCA -> Magni Headphone Jack (for Headphones)
 
I feel like this person telling me that it won't work due to Optical needing compression for 5.1 and RCA only being able to carry L/R is thinking I am talking about Physical Speaker Surround.

Sorry I'm late to this party.  Here's a few things you need to know:
 
1 - Yes, you can use your sound card just to process virtual surround and then send it to a separate DAC and Amp.  It's what I do.
 
2 - The Modi doesn't sound any different from the DAC in my Sound Blaster Omni.  It was a waste of money and I returned it.
 
3 - If switched on, your sound card will process 5.1/7.1 into virtual surround and output it as stereo.  It will send this stereo signal via optical to the DAC, etc.  This means you CAN get virtual surround over optical.  Again, it's what I do.
 
3b - Pro tip:  If you setup your music player to use WASPI exclusive mode, you can leave the surround processing on at all times and when you're listening to music, it'll just bypass it.
 
4 - I did a lot of testing with USB vs Optical on my DAC/Amp and I couldn't hear the difference.  Maybe if you're using hi-rez audio and $1000+ headphones, you can hear the difference.  But in my price range, they sound exactly the same.
 
I don't know anything about your Asus sound card so I can't comment on how well it will work with your intended setup.  I will say that unless the DAC is complete garbage (like onboard Realtek garbage), the Modi won't be worth the money.  I had to step up to the Audio-GD to hear an improvement in the DAC.  

 

[jaysins]

Hey stillhart, I just purchased a NFB-11.32 from Audio-GD directly to test it out against my O2 DAC/AMP. I'll be selling one shortly. On my Xonar when going from the headphone out to the O2 I could notice a slight difference and a very low hiss on mine. I'm very excited to test out AMPs as I've never owned two at the same time and had the opportunity to A/B them. 

 

[Stillhart]

  Hey stillhart, I just purchased a NFB-11.32 from Audio-GD directly to test it out against my O2 DAC/AMP. I'll be selling one shortly. On my Xonar when going from the headphone out to the O2 I could notice a slight difference and a very low hiss on mine. I'm very excited to test out AMPs as I've never owned two at the same time and had the opportunity to A/B them. 

Oh cool!  I haven't heard of anyone doing that comparison yet so I'd be very curious to hear what you think.  If possible, try to separate out the comparisons (amp to amp with the same DAC, and DAC to DAC with the same Amp).  This will give you a much better idea of where the changes you're hearing (if any) are coming from.
 
Wait, just reread your quote.  Are you using an O2 amp or an O2/ODAC?  Doesn't sound like you're using the ODAC.  If that's the case, you should notice a major improvement in SQ.

 

[Godrazor]

After researching and reading parts of this thread I'm almost positive I want to move on from my Sony Gold Headset to something more fancy.  I'm pondering getting the Akg Pro Audio K712PRO paired with Astro Mixamp Pro 2013 edition.  I mean if I'm going to upgrade from the Golds, I should upgrade big, right?  Still, this would be a sizable financial commitment, so I have a few questions: 
 
1) Do I need some sort of extension cable to reach across the room? I plan on using this set up with a PS3 and PS4 that are separated from the couch by something like 15 feet.  Complete guesstimate.
 
2) Do I need an adapter for jack size difference between the set and the amp? Will the two merge like sweet lovers, or do I have to get something to join them?
 
3) Does the Astro Mixamp's 7.1 sound truly outshine the Gold's 7.1 VSS?  I'm hearing that the Gold's are like sounds around your head, while the Astor is like being submerged in the game's world.  Exaggeration?
 
4) Is the Astro enough amp to warrant the K712PRO as a purchase?  I'm not getting another amp on top of the Astro, so if I'm spending so much for nothing I'd rather down grade.  Although, 3-D sound stage is the most important factor for me.
 
5) Finally, would I need to constantly swap a wire between the PS3 and PS4?  Here is where the Sony Gold's just dominate in terms of convenience.

 

[Yethal]

  After researching and reading parts of this thread I'm almost positive I want to move on from my Sony Gold Headset to something more fancy.  I'm pondering getting the Akg Pro Audio K712PRO paired with Astro Mixamp Pro 2013 edition.  I mean if I'm going to upgrade from the Golds, I should upgrade big, right?  Still, this would be a sizable financial commitment, so I have a few questions: 
 
1) Do I need some sort of extension cable to reach across the room? I plan on using this set up with a PS3 and PS4 that are separated from the couch by something like 15 feet.  Complete guesstimate.
 
2) Do I need an adapter for jack size difference between the set and the amp? Will the two merge like sweet lovers, or do I have to get something to join them?
 
3) Does the Astro Mixamp's 7.1 sound truly outshine the Gold's 7.1 VSS?  I'm hearing that the Gold's are like sounds around your head, while the Astor is like being submerged in the game's world.  Exaggeration?
 
4) Is the Astro enough amp to warrant the K712PRO as a purchase?  I'm not getting another amp on top of the Astro, so if I'm spending so much for nothing I'd rather down grade.  Although, 3-D sound stage is the most important factor for me.
 
5) Finally, would I need to constantly swap a wire between the PS3 and PS4?  Here is where the Sony Gold's just dominate in terms of convenience.

1.) Mixamp ships with 5m (which is about 15ft) optical and ub cable so it is not a problem
 
2) Nope, 712 pro has 3.5mm input so it'll work
 
3) Sony headsets use their own virtual surround processing which is weaker than dolby headphones used by the mixamp
 
4) AKG scale with power so You can play off the mixamp alone but another a p would help
 
5) If Your TV has optical output then no, just plug the mixamp into the tv and setup both consoles to use hdmi for audio (enable dolby digital live 5.1 and disable dts 5.1) 

 

[Godrazor]

   
5) If Your TV has optical output then no, just plug the mixamp into the tv and setup both consoles to use hdmi for audio (enable dolby digital live 5.1 and disable dts 5.1) 

 

  I never thought of the TV out.  I'll need to check.  That would mean the 360 and Wii could be used as well.  Oh, happy figgin' day if this works out.  As for the 5.1, does the PS3 & PS4 use 7.1?  I'd like any and everything to default to that if possible.

 

[Yethal]

   

  I never thought of the TV out.  I'll need to check.  That would mean the 360 and Wii could be used as well.  Oh, happy figgin' day if this works out.  As for the 5.1, does the PS3 & PS4 use 7.1?  I'd like any and everything to default to that if possible.

Xbox 360 can be used as well but the Wii U won't work, it doesn't support dilby digital live audio standard used by the mixamp, it will only output stereo. Yes, both the PS3 and PS4 can output 7.1 sound but not in the format that the Mixamp uses. For mixamp set all Your consoles to output Dolby Digital Live

 

[Godrazor]

  Xbox 360 can be used as well but the Wii U won't work, it doesn't support dilby digital live audio standard used by the mixamp, it will only output stereo. Yes, both the PS3 and PS4 can output 7.1 sound but not in the format that the Mixamp uses. For mixamp set all Your consoles to output Dolby Digital Live

 
Well, the Wii wasn't that important any how.  Interesting.  So, even at 5.1 setting the Mixamp will seem more 7.1 vs the Gold's 7.1 VSS, right?  I think I'll get the Astro Mixamp first, before I commit to the expensive headphones and let 7.1 shoot out commence.

 

[Stillhart]

   
Well, the Wii wasn't that important any how.  Interesting.  So, even at 5.1 setting the Mixamp will seem more 7.1 vs the Gold's 7.1 VSS, right?  I think I'll get the Astro Mixamp first, before I commit to the expensive headphones and let 7.1 shoot out commence.

You realize 7.1 only offers any improvement to 5.1 in very large rooms, right?  Don't get hung up on the difference between the two.  You'll notice FAR more difference from using good headphones than you will from any nominal changes mixing in two more channels will bring.

 

[AvroArrow]

  I'm super confused by what someone is telling me.
 
Can anyone confirm that the following setup is able to carry Dolby Virtual Headset Surround Sound (5.1/7.1) like any normal soundcard? 
 
STX Optical Out -> Optical Cable -> Modi External Optical In -> Modi External DAC RCA -> RCA Cable -> Magni Amp RCA -> Magni Headphone Jack (for Headphones)
 
I feel like this person telling me that it won't work due to Optical needing compression for 5.1 and RCA only being able to carry L/R is thinking I am talking about Physical Speaker Surround.

 
Like others have mention, yes, this will give you Dolby Headphone over optical, but if you're going to use a Modi as you DAC and Magni/Vali as the amp, then there is no reason to blow money on a STX.  Just get the much cheaper Asus U3 or DGX as you are only using the soundcard for the virtual surround processing, both will do Dolby Headphone over Optical out.
 

   
3b - Pro tip:  If you setup your music player to use WASPI exclusive mode, you can leave the surround processing on at all times and when you're listening to music, it'll just bypass it.

 
Be careful of this one.  Not all soundcards support WASAPI properly or they only work over certain output ports/jacks.  My X-Fi Titanium (non-HD) will freeze my Win7 box if I try to play music with a WASAPI driver over the SPDIF port (foobar2000 & MediaMonkey).  It will however work if I'm just using the standard headphone jack of the X-Fi (but the headphone jack is too weak for my AKG K702.65 and I don't want to double-amp).  Some other Creative cards will work with WASAPI over SPDIF but you will need to do your homework on which ones do and don't.

 

[Stillhart]

  Be careful of this one.  Not all soundcards support WASAPI properly or they only work over certain output ports/jacks.  My X-Fi Titanium (non-HD) will freeze my Win7 box if I try to play music with a WASAPI driver over the SPDIF port (foobar2000 & MediaMonkey).  It will however work if I'm just using the standard headphone jack of the X-Fi (but the headphone jack is too weak for my AKG K702.65 and I don't want to double-amp).  Some other Creative cards will work with WASAPI over SPDIF but you will need to do your homework on which ones do and don't.

 
Interesting, I didn't know that.  Well for the record, it works fine with my Sound Blaster Omni, Win 7, Winamp/Foobar (both work), over SPDIF.