[matthewh133]

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Hi guys, I am looking for a pair of headphones which also sound good without an amp. I'm going to connect them to my X-Fi Champion Front Panel and Mixamp 5.8 wireless incl. voice audio.
I tried the PC360 but I miss the soundstage of the K701s, it's much wider and everything is clearer (Xonar Essence STX).
 
Which pair do you recommend from 100-250$?

HD598 or ATH-AD900.

 

[MohawkUS]

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HD598 or ATH-AD900.

 
I'm going to have to disagree with this, the HD598 needs an amp, and the AD900 does not have a clear soundstage IMO, it is big, but it sounds congested at the same time, although it is a good choice if you have to go without an amp.

 

[Eric_C]

Scytus: yes, but bear in mind I do not game with Dolby. So on stereo in single player games, eg when there is a chopper hovering at one location, the front positioning is clearly more realistic than rear.

JCDenton2052: wait I thought you already have the DT 880? and how were you planning to tame the bass of the 770 without EQ?

 

[matthewh133]

Quote:

 
I'm going to have to disagree with this, the HD598 needs an amp, and the AD900 does not have a clear soundstage IMO, it is big, but it sounds congested at the same time, although it is a good choice if you have to go without an amp.

Are you serious? The AD900 has an incredible sound stage.. never sounded congested to me. The HD598 can be run without an amp and still sound awesome. Sure, with an amp it will make it a little better, but it's not a HUGE improvement like amping a HD650.
 

 

[Scytus]

Quote:

Scytus: yes, but bear in mind I do not game with Dolby. So on stereo in single player games, eg when there is a chopper hovering at one location, the front positioning is clearly more realistic than rear.

I understand, thank you for your input. You stating the DT-880's having that issue in stereo, and MLE stating it is also present in dolby, discourages me from that purchase. Unfortunately (wallet-wise), the only headphone that leaves me is the T1, as I'm looking for a can that doesn't leak as much as open cans do, but does have a similar wide soundstage. I was considering the DT990's, but the painful highs/recessed mids people speak of discouraged me from that purchase as well. That, and it's fully open, leaking far more sound than I would like.

 

[Eric_C]

Glad to be of some help Scytus. I can understand how important that rear positioning cue is to you if you play competitively, even though I don't.
 
Beyer T1 is open though; surely it would leak? Maybe you could look into the T5p? It's closed and has been considered by some to be a portable, closed equivalent of the T1 (not my words, never tried T1). Plus if you can afford the T1, you can surely afford the T5p.

 

[Scytus]

Quote:

Glad to be of some help Scytus. I can understand how important that rear positioning cue is to you if you play competitively, even though I don't.
 
Beyer T1 is open though; surely it would leak? Maybe you could look into the T5p? It's closed and has been considered by some to be a portable, closed equivalent of the T1 (not my words, never tried T1). Plus if you can afford the T1, you can surely afford the T5p.

 
I've read horrid things of the T5p, and another user told me of its extremely odd "R" shape audio curve; which I wasn't even able to comprehend. From everything I've read, the T5p seems to be a disappointment.
 
The T1 itself is classified as "semi-open", which is just at that level of leaking that I'm willing to accept (I just don't want to bother others in the hallway/other rooms with the sound). I've also tested out the T1's for a while, and fell absolutely in love with its signature. I admit I can see myself wanting just a little more bass, but I'd sacrifice that desire for the rest of the tonality/soundstage it presented. 
 
I can't exactly afford the T1.. I'd have to save up a bit. That, and I plan to hopefully buy used x]

 

[Eric_C]

LOL at "R" shaped audio curve. Should've asked if he meant upper or lower case.
 
Anyway, the T1 being "semi-open" should be read as "open". Case in point: the DT 880 is "semi-open" but is effectively open; fortunately none of this means that you'll ever bother someone in the next room with your music/games, so don't worry about that.
 
Edit: Just dawned on me that there is a small chance you were thinking of T50p when I mentioned T5p. The T50p got plenty of flak for being subpar; the T5p is different: http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/499215/beyerdynamic-t5p-photos-and-first-impressions

 

[MohawkUS]

Quote:

Are you serious? The AD900 has an incredible sound stage.. never sounded congested to me. The HD598 can be run without an amp and still sound awesome. Sure, with an amp it will make it a little better, but it's not a HUGE improvement like amping a HD650.
 

 
Yes, the AD900 has an incredible sound stage, but when you start playing heavier music through it just blurs everything together, it is airy, but it lacks in seperation. The 598 I ran through onboard sound, maybe if you were using a DAC it could work ampless, but through onboard it was lacking in power: boomy bass, grainyness, and no energy at all, the soundstage was incredible though.

 

[Scytus]

Quote:

LOL at "R" shaped audio curve. Should've asked if he meant upper or lower case.
 
Anyway, the T1 being "semi-open" should be read as "open". Case in point: the DT 880 is "semi-open" but is effectively open; fortunately none of this means that you'll ever bother someone in the next room with your music/games, so don't worry about that.
 
Edit: Just dawned on me that there is a small chance you were thinking of T50p when I mentioned T5p. The T50p got plenty of flak for being subpar; the T5p is different: http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/499215/beyerdynamic-t5p-photos-and-first-impressions

...yep, he meant lower case. so "r" x]
 

 

[matthewh133]

Quote:

Yes, the AD900 has an incredible sound stage, but when you start playing heavier music through it just blurs everything together, it is airy, but it lacks in seperation. The 598 I ran through onboard sound, maybe if you were using a DAC it could work ampless, but through onboard it was lacking in power: boomy bass, grainyness, and no energy at all, the soundstage was incredible though.
 

 
Fair enough, from memory I don't remember experiencing the soundstage issues with heavier music that you say you have. Different ears obviously. I had nothing but praise for them at their range range, pretty hard to beat IMO. The HD598 I've never ran off onboard so I could not say. I have used it off a Auzentech Forte soundcard, which has a little amplification and it sounded great.
 
 

 

[Fegefeuer]

Thank you guys,
 
anything better than the HD598 that doesn't require an amp (like AKG K701) and has a huge soundstage (similar to the AKG/AD700)?

 

[MohawkUS]

Quote:

Thank you guys,
 
anything better than the HD598 that doesn't require an amp (like AKG K701) and has a huge soundstage (similar to the AKG/AD700)?

 
I would check out an open pair of Ultrasones, they don't have a huge soundstage, but the positioning is amazing, If you want the airy feel you won't get it, but for gaming positioning > air

 

[JCDenton2052]

 
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JCDenton2052: wait I thought you already have the DT 880? and how were you planning to tame the bass of the 770 without EQ?

Nope, don't have any headphones at the minute. I was looking at the DT 880 but I hadn't fully decided mainly due to how much they cost and what I have available funds wise. As it's going to be my first proper pair of headphones I may as well start out with something a bit cheaper. The DT 770's sound great for the price; I would love some 880's but maybe for another time. There is an EQ with the Audio Centre of the Essence STX. Like I said I won't be making major changes, it just depends how they sound to my ears. If I like them out of the box then I will leave them and enjoy them. If they need tweaking I will mess around with the settings until it sounds better.
 
Got to start somewhere and i think the 770's will suffice. I'm confident i will like them.

 

[Eric_C]

First headphone, and you want to use them for gaming? Sans mic?
Is the Senn PC 360 not being considered?