[isquirrel]

Unbelievable, could it be the same full moon I saw last night? Sophia Electric tubes might not be the most revealing or detailed, but I think their strength is in the quality of their construction. The SE's do take awhile to loosen up though. My rig is sounding pretty good this morning. I've been getting more music instead of concentrating on audio gear lately. I really liked "Interstellar", will have to check out the soundtrack.

How many hours did you find the SERP's needed to be at their best?
 
If you liked the movie you will love the OST. Let us know how you like it.

 

[bpcans]

How many hours did you find the SERP's needed to be at their best?

If you liked the movie you will love the OST. Let us know how you like it.

I didn't have a clock running on the SERP's, but I'd say about 100hrs minimum.

 

[musicman59]

   
Everything I have heard about them seems to suggest they will be very good. I was surprised that the rectifiers cost more than the 300B's. We shall find out soon enough.
 
Put some decent isolation under the DaVinci and the Woo's this week - I was shocked at how much difference it made, the system went from being good to really involving emotionally.
 

 

Hi isquirrel,
What are those isolation platforms?

 

[Bonesy Jonesy]

   
Everything I have heard about them seems to suggest they will be very good. I was surprised that the rectifiers cost more than the 300B's. We shall find out soon enough.
 
Put some decent isolation under the DaVinci and the Woo's this week - I was shocked at how much difference it made, the system went from being good to really involving emotionally.
 

 

A+++   Awesome looking system isquirrel.    Would love to hear it as been wondering recently how they sound !     Have you tried the Chord QBD76 DAC with the 234's ?  (notice you have one in footnote listing)  

 

[TonyNewman]

WA234 vs WA5?
 
Wondering if any WooHeads have heard both the WA234 and WA5 with the same (or similar) tubes and can give some thoughts on the level of improvement in the jump from WA5 to WA234?
 
What's better with the WA234? What does it deliver that the WA5 doesn't?
 
Inquiring minds would like to know (well, at least one inquiring mind).

 
P.S> This is all feeding my fantasy of one day owning such a piece of kit. WA234 / BHSE+SR009 / Viva Egoista ... might as well be the moon.

 

[Badas]

   
Everything I have heard about them seems to suggest they will be very good. I was surprised that the rectifiers cost more than the 300B's. We shall find out soon enough.
 
Put some decent isolation under the DaVinci and the Woo's this week - I was shocked at how much difference it made, the system went from being good to really involving emotionally.
 

 

Is it me or does this whole rig look like something Darth Vader would lie back and listen to? After he has done some ass kicking.
 
Super cool rig. The best. Thanks for the pics.

 

[isquirrel]

  Hi isquirrel,
What are those isolation platforms?

It is a HRS MX3R,  the feet I had to swap over as the WOO's are so heavy (115 pounds) to a higher load rating, in a flash of uncommon brilliance I had the idea of using the old feet with some HRS couplers under the DaVInci, as they match the DaVinci's weight (60 pounds) as HRS don't make a base small enough to sit under the DaVinci triangular base (& hence would look odd) 
 
The feet have a rubber trampoline platform inside so they do the job perfectly much to my surprise, not often you get something for free in this game 

 
The sound improved A LOT, became nice and organic, involving. I was very surprised how much the DAC's SQ improved as a result of isolation.

 

[isquirrel]

  WA234 vs WA5?
 
Wondering if any WooHeads have heard both the WA234 and WA5 with the same (or similar) tubes and can give some thoughts on the level of improvement in the jump from WA5 to WA234?
 
What's better with the WA234? What does it deliver that the WA5 doesn't?
 
Inquiring minds would like to know (well, at least one inquiring mind).

 
P.S> This is all feeding my fantasy of one day owning such a piece of kit. WA234 / BHSE+SR009 / Viva Egoista ... might as well be the moon.

Good morning Tony,
 
I have asked a friend of mine on here Fririce0003 to post on his observations re the difference between the 234's and the WA5 as I can't comment. I do know that his WA5 was maxed out and I have his extensive tube collection here so I can attest to the fact that he knows what he's on about.
 
He told me that the 234's were significantly better on stock $40 tubes than his WA5 was maxed out. Having heard mine on stock and you know of my tube rolling journey, the tubes have made an enormous difference to the SQ.  The amps scale very well, every improvement to isolation, power etc lifts their performance substantially. 
 
The reason I went with them was I grew weary of the upgrading cycle, buying something that I knew I would be selling for a loss didn't make sense, so now all I have to think about is playing with Tubes. Which is what I really enjoy.
 
I hope that makes sense.

 

[TonyNewman]

 
Good morning Tony,
 
I have asked a friend of mine on here Fririce0003 to post on his observations re the difference between the 234's and the WA5 as I can't comment. I do know that his WA5 was maxed out and I have his extensive tube collection here so I can attest to the fact that he knows what he's on about.
 
He told me that the 234's were significantly better on stock $40 tubes than his WA5 was maxed out. Having heard mine on stock and you know of my tube rolling journey, the tubes have made an enormous difference to the SQ.  The amps scale very well, every improvement to isolation, power etc lifts their performance substantially.
 
The reason I went with them was I grew weary of the upgrading cycle, buying something that I knew I would be selling for a loss didn't make sense, so now all I have to think about is playing with Tubes. Which is what I really enjoy.
 
I hope that makes sense.

 
Makes sense to me - and thank you. This all feeds my fantasies around "gear I will never own"

 

[isquirrel]

I read somewhere that its important to let Tubes settle during the bruin in process, in others words after an extended run time to turn the amps off and let the tubes cool overnight to bring out the best in them. Have you experienced this phenomenon? 

 

[isquirrel]

  A+++   Awesome looking system isquirrel.    Would love to hear it as been wondering recently how they sound !     Have you tried the Chord QBD76 DAC with the 234's ?  (notice you have one in footnote listing)  

You are correct I have a QBD76 HDSD, I played with it for a while with the 234's, I have just sold it as the updated model with Hugo tech in it will no doubt be launched at the CES so wanted to maximise resale value now.
 
It is a very good DAC, I notice you have one also, are you enjoying it?
 
Edit - the system has come along very well, been messing around with different combinations of valves, cables and power. Got a way to go yet with some stuff but very happy with the result so far. I have some good Shunyata gear on its way. The DaVinci received a new firmware file sent by Larry Ho himself, that optimised the digital buyers apparently, whatever it was, it stripped away another veil to the music and lifted its performance. Was nice to know LH are still in the business of looking after their customers as they are copping a pasting over on the Geek forums.

 

[TonyNewman]

  I read somewhere that its important to let Tubes settle during the bruin in process, in others words after an extended run time to turn the amps off and let the tubes cool overnight to bring out the best in them. Have you experienced this phenomenon?

 
Absolutely yes. I never run my tubes for more than about 12 hours straight, and they always get a cool down overnight.
 
I find the biggest changes occur overnight - at least that is how it appears to my ears - I typically get to hear the benefit of the previous day of burn in the next morning (if that makes sense).
 
Taking the Psvane rectifiers as an example - I would not expect running them straight for 300 hours to have anything close to the same level of burn in improvement as running for 300 hours @ 10 hours per day with rests overnight. That's why a 300 hour burn in takes weeks (or months).

 

[magiccabbage]

 
You are correct I have a QBD76 HDSD, I played with it for a while with the 234's, I have just sold it as the updated model with Hugo tech in it will no doubt be launched at the CES so wanted to maximise resale value now.
 

 
Do you think that the pricing of the new Chord DAC will be similar to the QBD76 or more expensive? 

 

[Fririce0003]

WA234 vs WA5?

Wondering if any WooHeads have heard both the WA234 and WA5 with the same (or similar) tubes and can give some thoughts on the level of improvement in the jump from WA5 to WA234?

What's better with the WA234? What does it deliver that the WA5 doesn't?

Inquiring minds would like to know (well, at least one inquiring mind). :blink:

P.S> This is all feeding my fantasy of one day owning such a piece of kit. WA234 / BHSE+SR009 / Viva Egoista ... might as well be the moon.

Hi Tony,
I've had experience with both my WA5 (upgrade parts and tubes), WA234 (both with stock and my tubes) as well as a breif listen to a BHSE, SR009 combo.
Comparing the stock 234 with my maxed 5, the main improvements were mainly just a widening of the soundstage and more precision with imaging. Background noise, which I thought was already low on the 5, was now completely gone. The dynamics were noticeably better, loud passages shook your ears and silent passages had an inky deep blackness to them. The improvement was enough for me to concider the upgrade after only a quick 10 minute listen, if I had to quantify it I'd say about 10%. It may not seem like much but it was as much of a jump as going from stock tubes on the WA5 to a full upgrade complement or going from the GS-X to the WA5.
If you've heard the WA5, it's tonality and wide enveloping soundstage carry over seamlessly to the 234. With the WA5 I would switch between either the KR300B's or Royal Princess tubes depending on if I wanted more speed or more lushness. With the 234 the KR's retained all their speed but weren't dry in the mids it was as full and lush as the princesses were in the WA5.
Going in to audition the 234 with my tubes over stock sealed the coffin on the WA5. The WA5 improves a lot with tube upgrades but you still get the characteristics of the amp imposed on the tubes. With the 234 tube rolling can be summed up with a single word 'transparent'. You hear each change the tubes bring to the amp, I spent most of the time listening to the 234 with KR300b balloons, syl bad boys and full music 274b/+/n rectifiers. The amp was on high plate output. Driving the abyss on high plate was an easy task, the volume dial never made it past 10 o'clock and it only made it past 9 on very quiet pieces. Going from the stock tubes on the WA5 to better ones is a big leap, putting that same tube complement in the WA234 takes the tubes to a whole other level. With the Above tubes in the WA5 I really enjoyed the pacing, bass weight and immediacy of the sound. I thought that was the pinnacle. Switching to the 234 it showed what it was compromising, it had all the speed, weight and immediacy that was there in the 5. But it bought just an organic sense of musicality to it, with the 234 you get spade loads of detail over the 5, but that's not what you end up listening to. It's still so musical and involving that you get lost in the music as a whole. Sure you can still go into it and focus on the details but getting lost and enjoying it is soo much easier.
Another thing that is apparent is how revealing if other components the 234 is, I know the cable debate is a touchy subject, but going between one of the new cables they had to test at A2A, cardas clear light and cardas clear interconnects. The differences became readily apparent, tonality and sibilants being the main points the 234 would reveal between cables. I actually was hoping there wouldn't be a difference between the clear and clear light since they're essentially the same apart from the air tubes in the clear. But it was ever so less sibilant and the tonality was fuller and warmer, easier to get lost in and enjoy.
Comparing the SR009, BHSE and Abyss, 234 combo. The SR009 does everything right... But only on a technical note, comparatively it's very mechanical and it looses it's sense of involvment and enjoyment. That organic sound just isn't there, you listen to the music as each individual part instead of a cohesive whole. That's just not the type if listening I enjoy, so my views on it may be bias.
Just to add in purchasing the 234 was not easy financially for me, still being an apprentice, having a mortgage and planning a decent sized trip along with all the other associated costs with the WA234. I had to prioritise my spending to afford it, it wasn't just walk in, drop cash and walk out. Making the decision however was that easy, for me the improvements were worth every cent. I just had to find a way to gather the funds.
I will note I haven't listened to either the 234 or WA5 in about 2-3 weeks so it's all from mort at this point so I may be romanticising it a bit. But if you have any specific questions I'll do my best to answer them

 

[TonyNewman]

Hi Tony,
I've had experience with both my WA5 (upgrade parts and tubes), WA234 (both with stock and my tubes) as well as a breif listen to a BHSE, SR009 combo.
Comparing the stock 234 with my maxed 5, the main improvements were mainly just a widening of the soundstage and more precision with imaging. Background noise, which I thought was already low on the 5, was now completely gone. The dynamics were noticeably better, loud passages shook your ears and silent passages had an inky deep blackness to them. The improvement was enough for me to concider the upgrade after only a quick 10 minute listen, if I had to quantify it I'd say about 10%. It may not seem like much but it was as much of a jump as going from stock tubes on the WA5 to a full upgrade complement or going from the GS-X to the WA5.
If you've heard the WA5, it's tonality and wide enveloping soundstage carry over seamlessly to the 234. With the WA5 I would switch between either the KR300B's or Royal Princess tubes depending on if I wanted more speed or more lushness. With the 234 the KR's retained all their speed but weren't dry in the mids it was as full and lush as the princesses were in the WA5.
Going in to audition the 234 with my tubes over stock sealed the coffin on the WA5. The WA5 improves a lot with tube upgrades but you still get the characteristics of the amp imposed on the tubes. With the 234 tube rolling can be summed up with a single word 'transparent'. You hear each change the tubes bring to the amp, I spent most of the time listening to the 234 with KR300b balloons, syl bad boys and full music 274b/+/n rectifiers. The amp was on high plate output. Driving the abyss on high plate was an easy task, the volume dial never made it past 10 o'clock and it only made it past 9 on very quiet pieces. Going from the stock tubes on the WA5 to better ones is a big leap, putting that same tube complement in the WA234 takes the tubes to a whole other level. With the Above tubes in the WA5 I really enjoyed the pacing, bass weight and immediacy of the sound. I thought that was the pinnacle. Switching to the 234 it showed what it was compromising, it had all the speed, weight and immediacy that was there in the 5. But it bought just an organic sense of musicality to it, with the 234 you get spade loads of detail over the 5, but that's not what you end up listening to. It's still so musical and involving that you get lost in the music as a whole. Sure you can still go into it and focus on the details but getting lost and enjoying it is soo much easier.
Another thing that is apparent is how revealing if other components the 234 is, I know the cable debate is a touchy subject, but going between one of the new cables they had to test at A2A, cardas clear light and cardas clear interconnects. The differences became readily apparent, tonality and sibilants being the main points the 234 would reveal between cables. I actually was hoping there wouldn't be a difference between the clear and clear light since they're essentially the same apart from the air tubes in the clear. But it was ever so less sibilant and the tonality was fuller and warmer, easier to get lost in and enjoy.
Comparing the SR009, BHSE and Abyss, 234 combo. The SR009 does everything right... But only on a technical note, comparatively it's very mechanical and it looses it's sense of involvment and enjoyment. That organic sound just isn't there, you listen to the music as each individual part instead of a cohesive whole. That's just not the type if listening I enjoy, so my views on it may be bias.
Just to add in purchasing the 234 was not easy financially for me, still being an apprentice, having a mortgage and planning a decent sized trip along with all the other associated costs with the WA234. I had to prioritise my spending to afford it, it wasn't just walk in, drop cash and walk out. Making the decision however was that easy, for me the improvements were worth every cent. I just had to find a way to gather the funds.
I will note I haven't listened to either the 234 or WA5 in about 2-3 weeks so it's all from mort at this point so I may be romanticising it a bit. But if you have any specific questions I'll do my best to answer them

 
Wow - thank you so very much for such a detailed response.
 
Really, really appreciate that - except for the fact that it makes me want the Wa234 even more than I did before 

 
I am 100% in agreement with you on the musical vs mechanical debate - I don't care much for how technically brilliant something is - it's all about the sound and how engaging it is.
 
I'm burning in a set of SERPs in my (stock) WA5 right now - and loving it. Very musical and engaging.