[BIG POPPA]

Honestly in my experience you don’t truly experience the true potential of the HD 800 or the HD 600/650 unless you try them on a nice OTL amp which I was able to listen to for a while thanks to a friend, I finally understood the Senns praise then, good otl amps work some weird magic on many Senns. You hear people say get good OTL’s for the Senns and there is a reason for that. A big reason I never got an HD 800 and why I never kept the HD 600/650 long term is because I’m not a big fan of them otherwise. If I ever get a nice OTL I’m getting an HD 600/650 ASAP maybe even an HD 800/S. Once reason I went the Beyer route because I found them to play with SS and hybrid amps better than high impedance Senns in general even the 600 Ohm variants and I’m more familiar with how Beyers react to gear changes than Senns. The HD 660 S sounds great on SS gear though and I personally suggest it over the HD 600/650 for most SS amps. Though I can say Beyers adore multibit/R2R dacs maybe moreso than Senns even. Kinda interesting experiencing how different headphones react to different gear.

HD660's are 150ohms, yes they work better mostly with Solid State.

You guys are overstating how much headphones change by your snake oil cables and dac/amps. Even off an entry level amp/dac you get the gist out of any headphone that doesn't require a power plant.

You wanna dismiss my review because I didn't review them to your specifications, that's great, but hyperbolic statements like OMG YOU DIDN'T EVEN HEAR THE 800S WITH YOUR GEAR YOU HAVE TO USE X amp or Y dac, is ridiculous, and justification bias.

The gear didn't give me a fair idea? Give me a break. I'm reviewing the headphone, not the combination of what you think is the best possible synergistic combo for them.

Lets just discredit every review out there that doesn't use what you think they should use, because of sone magical drastic transformation that headphones go through.

I get your point, also have to understand that you have to have revealing gear to get cables benefit. 2, understand the technology behind the cables, the mettalurgy, the dielectric, the processes like cryoing and burning in with a cooker or tesla coil. If you are going to stay in the entry market of gear, stay where you are at. The HD8xx do not deserve such humiliation. It deserves better gear to shine.

 

[kman1211]

HD660's are 150ohms, yes they work better mostly with Solid State.

Yet the T1.2 which is 600 Ohm with a big impedance bump in the bass of near 1400 Ohm and the DT 880/990 600 Ohm work better than the HD 600/650 and HD 800 with SS gear imho. Some of my favorite systems on the 600 Ohm Beyers were SS whereas it wasn’t quite the case on the 300 Ohm Senns. But Beyers behave differently on amplification for whatever reason. It’s more than just the impedance, some reason high impedance Senns in particular love OTL amps moreso than just about any other dynamic headphone.

 

[BIG POPPA]

Yet the T1.2 which is 600 Ohm with a big impedance bump in the bass of near 1400 Ohm and the DT 880/990 600 Ohm work better than the HD 600/650 and HD 800 with SS gear imho. Some of my favorite systems on the 600 Ohm Beyers were SS whereas it wasn’t quite the case on the 300 Ohm Senns. But Beyers behave differently on amplification for whatever reason. It’s more than just the impedance, some reason high impedance Senns in particular love OTL amps moreso than just about any other dynamic headphone.

Hell yeah, totally agree with the 600 ohm T1v2, Beyers are Engineer grade cans, different animal. But dig them !!!!!!

 

[Mad Lust Envy]

Revealing gear? The Modius is very neutral and accurate. Tell me you're gonna dismiss it because I need a $2000dac before anything I say is taken seriously.


The Jot 2 is SS. It's on the warmer side/more relaxed but SUBTLY so. Again, that should actually BENEFIT the 8XX which I found very revealing and open, and super clear. What do you want? More revealing amp that would make it even more open and clear and spacious? It's the same assessment I've already made.

Oh, you want an OTL amp that's gonna make them fuller, warmer, richer than how it sounds off a driven enough SS amp? Great, but then you're reviewing the amp's quality and not the Headphone.

Anyways, I'm done. It's this type of elitist nitpicking that makes me wanna stop reviewing again.

 

[BIG POPPA]

Revealing gear? The Modius is very neutral and accurate. Tell me you're gonna dismiss it because I need a $2000dac before anything I say is taken seriously.


The Jot 2 is SS. It's on the warmer side/more relaxed but SUBTLY so. Again, that should actually BENEFIT the 8XX which I found very revealing and open, and super clear. What do you want? More revealing amp that would make it even more open and clear and spacious? It's the same assessment I've already made.

Oh, you want an OTL amp that's gonna make them fuller, warmer, richer than how it sounds off a driven enough SS amp? Great, but then you're reviewing the amp's quality and not the Headphone.

Anyways, I'm done. It's this type of elitist nitpicking that makes me wanna stop reviewing again.

Please get a few Head-fiers together a mini-meet , secret meet or what ever. Display your hypothesis with a crowd, see what happens. If you are in the Pacific NorthWest. I can set it up. You get a few Eddie Current amps, a few other Senn 300ohm centric amps, a few Yggys and Kitsune Dac's in the mix. Hear the difference, The Jot is still a toy amp in the scope of things. The HD-8xx's need some real gear. The last in-person meet I had on 3-7-2020 the HD-800's was hooked up to the Viva 845 headphone amp. Those were mine. Please understand my point on these cans.

 

[kman1211]

Revealing gear? The Modius is very neutral and accurate. Tell me you're gonna dismiss it because I need a $2000dac before anything I say is taken seriously.


The Jot 2 is SS. It's on the warmer side/more relaxed but SUBTLY so. Again, that should actually BENEFIT the 8XX which I found very revealing and open, and super clear. What do you want? More revealing amp that would make it even more open and clear and spacious? It's the same assessment I've already made.

Oh, you want an OTL amp that's gonna make them fuller, warmer, richer than how it sounds off a driven enough SS amp? Great, but then you're reviewing the amp's quality and not the Headphone.

Anyways, I'm done. It's this type of elitist nitpicking that makes me wanna stop reviewing again.

To be honest the difference on some of the gear was depressing as I know I wouldn’t ever be able to afford it. But on the other side a lot of gear is horribly overpriced gear whose performance doesn’t meet the price and are an elitist flaunting of wealth. There is also so much conflicting information and impressions it can make it hard to figure out what’s truly good for what you pay and what path to even take on gear.

 

[Mad Lust Envy]

Again I've owned various gear throughout the years including tube amplifiers. Regardless of whatever you want to improve a headphone, a headphone is still a headphone with an inherent quality to it. You're then peppering it with tweaks that can improve their inherent sound, but it's still unmistakably the same headphone, just with those tweaks done by the gear.

I'm reviewing a headphone and its INHERENT traits, not what you think will change it to suit your preference.

That's why I've gone back and stuck to SS amps. I don't have time to nitpick the gear that people think will magically alter the INHERENT traits to whatever they deem the "True Sound"

Anyways, this is a gaming headphone thread. You wanna discuss the intricacies on what you feel tube amps do, go do it on a tube amp thread. I don't really care. I've rated the 8XX as potentially one of the very best for certain aspects of gaming. Changing my amp or dac isn't gonna change that. I'm done with topic. You don't wanna accept my review, please go somewhere else to someone that will do it the way you want. I'll remain blissfully ignorant with my Modius and Jot 2

 

[trix3072]

And I've never really used that metric for my reviews.

The 8XX isn't intimate. Not to me. The 6XX, the LCD2 are intimate. The 8XX, nope. The soundstaging section would be b enough to let people know that. It's really open and spacious. That's the polar opposite of intimate to me. For someone else, sure whatever floats your boat.

Also, I was bound to miss some things. I was under a very strict time limit, so I did what I could.

Hey MLE, have you tried applying DSP processings on the 8XX? Could they enhance 8XX's soundstage or imaging from these? Or do they ruin the imaging?
Also, I want to know about your experience in "Crossfeed" of some DACs and AMPs like the Monolith THX DAC+AMP, the ADI 2...etc. or the 3D of ifi audio products. Looing forward to your review. Thanks

 

[BIG POPPA]

Again I've owned various gear throughout the years including tube amplifiers. Regardless of whatever you want to improve a headphone, a headphone is still a headphone with an inherent quality to it. You're then peppering it with tweaks that can improve their inherent sound, but it's still unmistakably the same headphone, just with those tweaks done by the gear.

I'm reviewing a headphone and its INHERENT traits, not what you think will change it to suit your preference.

That's why I've gone back and stuck to SS amps. I don't have time to nitpick the gear that people think will magically alter the INHERENT traits to whatever they deem the "True Sound"

Anyways, this is a gaming headphone thread. You wanna discuss the intricacies on what you feel tube amps do, go do it on a tube amp thread. I don't really care. I've rated the 8XX as potentially one of the very best for certain aspects of gaming. Changing my amp or dac isn't gonna change that.

My bad on your gaming thread. Thought it was a straight up review. Did not notice the perimeters. Just a straight up Senn fan.

 

[Mad Lust Envy]

Hey MLE, have you tried applying DSP processings on the 8XX? Could they enhance 8XX's soundstage or imaging from these? Or do they ruin the imaging?
Also, I want to know about your experience in "Crossfeed" of some DACs and AMPs like the Monolith THX DAC+AMP, the ADI 2...etc. or the 3D of ifi audio products. Looing forward to your review. Thanks

I used virtual surround dsps with the 8XX. The very open, and highly detailed nature of them responded incredibly well with Redscape's surround algorithm and Creative's SBX. Sony's Tempest 3D audio (PS5) worked extremely well. I don't have my Dolby Headphone device, as I gave it to a friend, but I'm certain it'd do excellently with that as well. I'd expect the same for Sennheiser's GSX.

I've never used crossfade settings at length other than a long time ago, so I can't say.

 

[Trancefreak]

People need to understand that most recording studio's and certainly gaming studio's don't use high-end home use gear and cables.
They use professional high end gear, with different goals and design characteristics.

I fail to understand how Tubes and these high end cables can 'reveal' details in sound that never got trough the cable connecting the microphone to the recording equipment.
You're hearing things that were never there. They might change sound to your preference, and sound fantastic in unison with the playback gear you have, sure, but they simply cannot reveal 'details' that were never there since the whole sound source to driver chain isn't homogeneous.

We end up having better sound equipment than the recording equiment some recording studio's ever had...

 

[Qupie]

Damn that sidestep was completely unnecessary LMAO. Didn't know gate keeping was so bad in the audio world nowadays.
If only people understood physics they would know the effect of expensive cables is insignificant at best.

Back on topic, how are you liking the Hel MLE?

Does it have a workaround for the playstation audio bug? (aka input volume is at ~20%, so you need to set the volume a lot higher than expected / other source).
I am curious if this is going to drive hard to drive headphones. Ordered mine last week, but I am afraid it will take weeks / months before I get it to EU.

 

[Mad Lust Envy]

Damn that sidestep was completely unnecessary LMAO. Didn't know gate keeping was so bad in the audio world nowadays.
If only people understood physics they would know the effect of expensive cables is insignificant at best.

Back on topic, how are you liking the Hel MLE?

Does it have a workaround for the playstation audio bug? (aka input volume is at ~20%, so you need to set the volume a lot higher than expected / other source).
I am curious if this is going to drive hard to drive headphones. Ordered mine last week, but I am afraid it will take weeks / months before I get it to EU.

I'll have time to mess with it tomorrow and Tuesday. Haven't messed with it much yet.

Is that why dac/amps need so much volume? I didn't know it was a bug. Is there a potential fix for this outside of blasting amp volume?

 

[DenverW]

I have my thoughts on the Senn/tube debate, but since that's for a whole different thread I'll instead ask if there are plans to review the emu-teaks? I really enjoy them for gaming, curious where you'd place them !

 

[Mad Lust Envy]

I have my thoughts on the Senn/tube debate, but since that's for a whole different thread I'll instead ask if there are plans to review the emu-teaks? I really enjoy them for gaming, curious where you'd place them !

They're mine, and I'll likely get around to it at some point, sooner than later. First comes the Hel 2, then the Blackshark V2. After that, we'll see how I feel.