Mad Lust Envy's Headphone Gaming Guide: (8/18/2022: iFi GO Blu Review Added)

[Mad Lust Envy]

In any case, I've edited the second post with everything not headphone related. I'll update the guide to reflect this.

 

[Fegefeuer]

People often also forget that the sensation of sound perception in cinema and games does not only rely on visual cues. You have to be able to perceive audio also when you are not looking.

Standard Stereo gaming works because the brain compensates a lot for it with what it sees on the screen and how it attaches the sound information to it. If you close your eyes it's even more obvious that positional information and tracing it is far superior on VSS and proper geometry based binaural models than standard stereo.
This is how audio should be designed. Give you proper positional information, especially on elevation. That's the only way you will approximate "real life". It's why VR relies on 3D Audio/geometry based audio, fundamentally.

"3D Audio" > 7.1 VSS > standard stereo gaming

 

[mindbomb]

No, what I meant is more like saying there are more than one way of showing you a 3d movie.

So in the video, he says there are 3 ways to get good directional audio. Virtual surround sound, binaural recordings, and then he says traditional stereo is also capable of it. Let me break down the problems with this. First, he is correct that binaural recordings offer headphone users a way to have great directional audio. The problem is that, for the average person, probably 0% of the content they listen to in a given year is binaural recordings. The only example of it in gaming is Hellblade, and then only select parts of the game have it.

In the end of the day, I hear exactly where a sound is coming from in my DSS in both modes, but with bypass it sounds better in PUBG and in Apex Legends.

This brings me to the next part, which is the false equivalence between virtual surround sound/hrtf and plain stereo audio. The positional audio is going to be worse with plain stereo, and part of the reason people here are palpably frustrated is that it is demonstrably worse - like you can find videos of people comparing different virtual surround sound and plain stereo on youtube, like this old video featuring bf4:


It may shock you that I am making such a bold claim like this, but the reason I can is simple. In traditional stereo, only left and right is specified. This is what is causing problems with the directions of front and back, particularly noticeable when the mouse is not being moved from side to side. If we define virtual surround sound as the use of hrtf to artificially manipulate the perception of the direction of sounds on headphones, then the only way for the game to solve this problem is by incorporating virtual surround sound itself. This has actually happened in some instances, perhaps most notably with Overwatch, which has licenced dolby atmos for headphones from dolby. But this has also happened in PUBG, as the hrtf option is virtual surround sound, which was added to the game after demand from the community. In fact, look at this video comparing hrtf vs stereo in pubg, and keep in mind what I said earlier about front vs back on stereo.


Prior to the introduction of the hrtf option, the only way to avoid the problems with directional audio on stereo was for the end user to apply virtual surround sound processing himself. Now you may say, "well, then I guess I don't need virtual surround sound because the game can always do it for me, right?". Well no. The other game you mentioned, Apex Legends, one of the most popular games out right now, lacks any in game hrtf. However, you can avoid problems with directional audio on stereo in this game by utilizing virtual surround sound.

 

[Mad Lust Envy]

Ok, so I THINK I got most of the attachments moved, and images replaced, so I should have some free space available for the first post.

I had to get rid of a few outdated things like how to connect the DSS to old gen systems, etc. If someone wants to update the diagrams, and put them all in one big image file, I'll more than happily add that to the guide. Just not various images, but all in one so as to not waste images on it.

Currently listening to the Grado White. Very interesting change from what I have in the house, so I need some time. It is missing the sub bass quite noticeably when next to the EDXX. Expected of Grado, I suppose. It's very good in every other aspects so far.

 

[Fegefeuer]

Anyway. Project Accent aka the most likely X7 successor was targeted for Q3 2019. We might hear about it starting Friday@IFA 2019

to remind you: https://sg.creative.com/upgrade/

 

[dandiego]

Anyway. Project Accent aka the most likely X7 successor was targeted for Q3 2019. We might hear about it starting Friday@IFA 2019

to remind you: https://sg.creative.com/upgrade/

Unless the X3 is Project Accent. It appears to have the same physical shape and features listed on Creative's "upgrade" page.

 

[Mad Lust Envy]

Very interesting that they're releasing the SXFI Theater whiuch seems to be like the Air but with 2.4ghz wireless instead of Bluetooth. That would make it much better for gaming wirelessly, unlike the Air which is definitely not meant for wireless gaming, but usb instead.

Definitely looks like the SoundBlaster X3 is what Project Accent looks to be...

https://www.vortez.net/news_story/c..._blaster_x3_and_sxfi_theater_at_ifa_2019.html

 

[dakanao]

Even with my Chord Mojo connected to my xbox 360 running stereo with my 300 ohm Sennheiser HD 540 Gold (excellent headphone for positiong), I get a lot better 3D imaging with just the Turtle Beach DSS alone with the HD 540 Gold.

 

[SierraMadre]

So Project Auris I and II, specifically touted as being for PS4 and Switch, mention only USB and not virtual surround, let alone SXFI. I wonder whether they have given up on making SXFI work with Dolby Digital until the new consoles come out.

 

[debugman]

Did you watch the video? He doesn't say that VSS does not work. (And his title is click baity silliness.) The fact of the matter is if a game offers no VSS or HRTF-simulating audio option, and you are stuck with its straight left/right stereo audio, you are beholden to that game's audio engineers as to how well you are going to be able to discern surround cues. That's all this guy is saying. So what you are saying is if all stereo sounds better to you even for directionality, you are basically claiming that all stereo implementations in all the games you have ever played are better than the 5.1/7.1 surround mixes and all of the different virtual surround implementations you can use to try and get that surround sound awesomeness in your headphones. Which most people are going to be dubious of since usually, based on experience straight stereo isn't going to be very good versus a well implemented virtual surround solution. I don't know, maybe you only play a handful of games which for some reason have terrible surround implementations? Or maybe your current VSS solution is junk and you don't have an adequate comparison? I am not familiar with the Turtle Beach (and am too lazy to see for the purposes of this post if MLE reviewed it.)

But nothing in that video says VSS does not work, or is fake, its click bait title aside. My guess is you have for whatever reason succumbed to the echo chamber of misinformed online comments on this topic. "bUT yOu onLY hAVE tWO eARs!!!11" etc.

I never said VSS doesn't work, and I posted the video because he explained that there are more ways to make the listener to hear directional/"surround" sounds. I am sure you guys know more about all that.

I didn't say stereo sounds better for directionality, only the sound itself. But, I said maybe it depends on the game and/or VSS device

And I did mention that maybe because I only played with a handful of games and only used one VSS device, so I can't say that VSS is worse for sure.

I just didn't agree with MDE that with VSS he will hear directional and with stereo he will not.

 

[Lay.]

When the day comes that I can plug my proper DAC/AMP (Sorry Sound Blaster and other...) straight to my Playstation and have a good directional audio without any external VSS device, I will be among the first people to toss out the extra VSS hardware.

In the meanwhile I enjoy using my Sound BlasterX G6 (VSS optical out to my DAC/AMP).

 

[debugman]

So in the video, he says there are 3 ways to get good directional audio. Virtual surround sound, binaural recordings, and then he says traditional stereo is also capable of it. Let me break down the problems with this. First, he is correct that binaural recordings offer headphone users a way to have great directional audio. The problem is that, for the average person, probably 0% of the content they listen to in a given year is binaural recordings. The only example of it in gaming is Hellblade, and then only select parts of the game have it.



This brings me to the next part, which is the false equivalence between virtual surround sound/hrtf and plain stereo audio. The positional audio is going to be worse with plain stereo, and part of the reason people here are palpably frustrated is that it is demonstrably worse - like you can find videos of people comparing different virtual surround sound and plain stereo on youtube, like this old video featuring bf3:


It may shock you that I am making such a bold claim like this, but the reason I can is simple. In traditional stereo, only left and right is specified. This is what is causing problems with the directions of front and back, particularly noticeable when the mouse is not being moved from side to side. If we define virtual surround sound as the use of hrtf to artificially manipulate the perception of the direction of sounds on headphones, then the only way for the game to solve this problem is by incorporating virtual surround sound itself. This has actually happened in some instances, perhaps most notably with Overwatch, which has licenced dolby atmos for headphones from dolby. But this has also happened in PUBG, as the hrtf option is virtual surround sound, which was added to the game after demand from the community. In fact, look at this video comparing hrtf vs stereo in pubg, and keep in mind what I said earlier about front vs back on stereo.


Prior to the introduction of the hrtf option, the only way to avoid the problems with directional audio on stereo was for the end user to apply virtual surround sound processing himself. Now you may say, "well, then I guess I don't need virtual surround sound because the game can always do it for me, right?". Well no. The other game you mentioned, Apex Legends, one of the most popular games out right now, lacks any in game hrtf. However, you can avoid problems with directional audio on stereo in this game by utilizing virtual surround sound.

I play on PS4, so I am not sure if there is hrtf or not.

About Apex, I don't know for sure, but maybe the headphones I have, Philips SHP9500 with open backs and good sound stage help with the directional audio.

 

[Fegefeuer]

Unless the X3 is Project Accent. It appears to have the same physical shape and features listed on Creative's "upgrade" page.

Damn, I missed this. Could be true. Would be a damn shame. :[]

 

[stavros.m]

I know this is a gaming headset but has anyone tried the new Hyper X Orbit, and what are your thoughts, a cheaper option then the Mobius

thanks

 

[Zaphyre]

Has Creative not mentioned anything more about that HDMI TV box which would allow you to use the Super X-FI stuff with your TV?

That seemed kind of interesting from the stand point you'd maybe be able to get uncompressed 5.1 or 7.1 from HDMI devices unlike the current optical solutions.