Mad Lust Envy's Headphone Gaming Guide: (8/18/2022: iFi GO Blu Review Added)
Oct 29, 2015 at 5:22 PM Post #32,671 of 48,568
"Best" amp... There are SO many options now, at pretty much any price point, that you can even factor in personal preference.

For awhile, FiiO was super popular for great sound at a budget... and they've improved most of their lineup, the E11k (portable) and E09k (desktop) are good choices, I enjoyed my E12 with my AKG (see my review in my signature) until I decided to switch to desktop tube amps.

Then the Objective2 (O2) became the flavor of hype amp. I've never listened to it because the designer created it with no stated objective other than, basically, trashing other amp manufacturers and stating that he could design an amp sounding better and costing less. Even the "Objective" name was saying it was engineered by numbers versus "all" the other amps which were tuned subjectively by ear. By all accounts of people who owned an O2, the numbers didn't lie and offered a breakthrough price/performance ratio, described as an amp that didn't take away from the performance of headphones (with the exception of the most notoriously difficult to drive), but didn't add anything to the sound either. The fame of this amp blossomed even more as reviewers used it's transparent-to-the-native-performance nature as a reference baseline when making their reviews... Almost like as if you wanted to be a reviewer, you had to get used to FLAC files of Pink Floyd, ObjectiveDAC, Objective2 amp, and a Sennheiser HD600, and then base any product reviews off of changing one component of that audio chain and comparing to the control. Very scientific. Very clinical. But at the end of the day, the bigger picture of why we buy this stuff is to enjoy music/audio, and flat isn't going to be interesting for everyone. Besides the design compromises for sound quality (wiring layout is a mess... Is it a portable, or a desktop? Not ideal for either!), if you read user impressions you'll see a lot of people that love it, but after the honeymoon period ended there were also a fair number of people who found it too dry and bare, or boring and moved on. When I was on the AKG Q701 thread, the majority wanted a different amp because the Q701 highs were too bright and analytical, but some people stuck to their guns that the O2 was a good linear paring but eventually they'd want a different headphone. I got to borrow an ODAC once, but for some reason it wouldn't work with my computer (and probably was the fault of my computer, but that was the only DAC ever not to work), I'd like to hear an O2 someday but at this point I'm past needing it.

Throughout the past year, Schiit gear has been hailed as great value amps, the magni and modi in particular as similar-sounding but cheaper to the O2+ODAC combo. Mad Lust Envy raved about the M&M stack... I forget which few headphones he used with them, but he did use a few. They still stand as great values, though again on the revealing/analytical/possibly bright sounding side of sonic signatures. I have a fellow Pittsburgh Head-Fi'er who has the modi, and he got the Vali instead of the Magni. Now, the Vali I really liked! Maybe a little detail was sacrificed, and the "EEeeeeeeee..." sound of the first 30-45 seconds of warm-up and any physical impact to the amp is real, but the humble amp is musical and fun to listen to. I wouldn't call the Vali an end-game amp, and Schiit definitely designed it as a gateway to audiophile gear, but A/B-ing it against my more expensive tube amp still had 98% of what made the music more enjoyable for me and was clearly a better value, making me look like I had overspent on my tube amp (though at the end of the day, I still love mine). With an AKG, soundstage is a little less wide but also less oval and more circular, sweetens the highs a bit, and IMO is a good pairing.

Right now, I'm having a good time using my Creative E5 with my AKG K612, it does for me what the FiiO E17 did for Mad Lust Envy as an amp but also as a flexible everyday device. It's like they took the features of the FiiO E17, added a few more (Bluetooth, noise-canceling mic, optical in and out, USB connection for smartphones), used the FiiO E12 amp but made it slightly warmer, and added SBX surround for PC/Mac users. For gamers, it's a definitely capable quality device that also solves all the setup issues you might have, except it can't decode a surround signal from a console. Either stick with stereo, or the upcoming G5 which is supposed to be like an E5 + Dolby decoding... The G5 looks like a replacement/upgrade to the Astro Mixamp all-around with better sound quality and no extra amping needed, though I suspect an XBone setup is stick going to be a PITA.

I've also read good amp impressions about Garage1217 amps, Little Dot amps, Emotiva, Cayin, and more. For couch/living room setups, I prefer portable amps because they're easy to put away and re-attach, and I often check out HEAD-Fi user ClieOS for his portable amp reviews. For desktop setups like mine, where you've got your computer, console, monitor, and desk space all right there, the sky's the limit and I prefer to have some awesome powerful (but bigger-sized) stuff.
 
Oct 29, 2015 at 5:38 PM Post #32,672 of 48,568
Okay, so I got my Magni 2 in today and I've run into another issue. It seems I need some kind of adapter. Pardon my ignorance in all this.
 
I have the 3.5mm headphone plugged into the Magni. However, the Magni only has a female RED/WHITE Stereo input in the rear. What exactly do I need to make this work? An A/V to 3.5mm adapter?
 
Is there a specific adapter you guys would recommend?
 
EDIT: I've posted an update (http://www.head-fi.org/t/534479/mad-lust-envys-headphone-gaming-guide-5-31-2015-beyer-cop-and-shure-1540-added/32865#post_12073235) to my working setup for anyone looking for a similar setup. Just browse a few pages ahead or search through my posts to find the detailed setup guide.
 
Oct 29, 2015 at 5:56 PM Post #32,673 of 48,568
Okay, so I got my Magni 2 in today and I've run into another issue. It seems I need some kind of adapter. Pardon my ignorance in all this.

I have the 3.5mm headphone plugged into the Magni. However, the Magni only has a female RED/WHITE Stereo input in the rear. What exactly do I need to make this work? An A/V to 3.5mm adapter?

Is there a specific adapter you guys would recommend?


I'm trying to motivate myself to edit console/gear/headphone setup videos right now. A lot of people have questions about this, and reading doesn't make it clear enough for some people.

What are you trying to connect the Magni to?
 
Oct 29, 2015 at 6:07 PM Post #32,674 of 48,568
I'm trying to motivate myself to edit console/gear/headphone setup videos right now. A lot of people have questions about this, and reading doesn't make it clear enough for some people.

What are you trying to connect the Magni to?

 
 
Astro Mixamp Pro TR for PS4.
 
EDIT: I've posted an update to my working setup for anyone looking for a similar setup. Just browse a few pages ahead or search through my posts to find the detailed setup guide.
 
Oct 30, 2015 at 12:29 AM Post #32,676 of 48,568
Now im in a bind :frowning2:. I want to get a pci e ssd, but i noticed that if i add another thing, ill run out of pci e lanes. So ill have to remove my sound card if I go that route.. I have a cheap asus xonar sound card but i was using its toslinq optical out for my schiit stack.
 
If I go the route of an external sound card with all the best features for competitive fps gaming (to hear footsteps and precise location) whats the best usb sound card do you guys recommend?
 
Ill basically hook up my 5.1 logitech z906 speakers to it and through optical out to the schiit stack from there headphones for gaming. I basically want a feature rich sound card for gaming as the rest will get optical out.
 
Also, will there be any noticeable latency through this route?
 
Thanks in advanced
 
Oct 30, 2015 at 2:08 AM Post #32,677 of 48,568
Astro Mixamp Pro TR for PS4.


Oh, a 3.5mm headphone plug to RCA plug cable will do fine. Quite easy to find on Monoprice and Amazon. 3.5mm to RCA.


DiamondPact,
You're basically going to bypass everything but the DSP on whatever USB sound card you get, so it doesn't matter too much and spending more would be a waste of money. Get an Asus dongle if you prefer Dolby Headphone, and a Creative dongle if you prefer SBX surround. I used to use Creative's Omni, that has a headphone jack, microphone, optical out, and analog (unpowered) outputs for a 5.1 speaker setup. You basically would be switching between the optical output for your headphone setup, and the speaker outputs for your desktop computer speakers. However, you might be able to find something even cheaper with processing and an optical out, and the Schiit M&I'm stack would still define your sound quality. If you like Dolby headphone, the U3 has an optical output and is only like... $30 or something.

And no, no noticeable lag.
 
Oct 30, 2015 at 6:18 AM Post #32,678 of 48,568
hmm, i did some further research, apparently usb sound options aren't great, they are limited and don't offer true potential. Ill wait off on the pic e sad till skylake e releases and just upgrade the computer.
 
Whats the best sound card for pc gaming with optical out to my stack?(best as in 3d positioning features)
 
I think the cmss 3d and the SBX pro might be the best options for fps gaming, while dolby headphone and trustudio being inferior.
 
whats better sbx pro or TruStudio? I know the true studio is new and is supposed to replace sbx but I've read mixed reviews. what do you guys think?
 
 
Which which of all the different types of the 3d positioning audio features do you guys think are the top two for headphones, specifically k7xx and superlux hd681 evo, k7xx being the priority. For sound accuracy/imaging.
 
Thanks in advanced.
 
Oct 30, 2015 at 9:27 AM Post #32,679 of 48,568
  So I picked up those Logitech G933s. They're the best and worst headset I've ever owned.
 
Wireless signal is flawless. Sound is pretty good, although I still prefer the sound of the PLYR1s by a bit. It's still far better than anything Logitech has put out in the past, and I could totally live with it. Comfort is decent...a little heavy and tight, but nice large earcups and good isolation. Good build quality overall and I like the look of them. Lots of silly features like RGB lights, seriously who cares, but whatever.
 
The mic is awesome IMO - it literally disappears into the headset. When you want to use it, you just fold it down and extend the wire, which holds its place perfectly.. If it's muted a red light comes on, and the amount of sidetone is customizable. Sounds nice and clear too. Really great job overall on the mic.
 
The best part by far is the DTS Headphone X. Compared to DH and SBX, it has far more convincing rear/side cues. Way better than any other virtual surround I've ever heard. You have some control over the "room", and the first person shooter preset is pretty dry sounding with crystal clear positioning around you. Seriously I wish I could just buy headphone X software on it's own, or there was at least one other decent headset that used it. I really don't want to go back to DH or SBX.
 
Now here's where it gets ugly - there's a driver bug that forces the headphones to appear to windows as stereo only, not 5.1/7.1. That means the vast majority of games won't output the 6/8 channels needed to do true virtual surround. The only game I ever heard the VS work properly is CS:GO, where you can force 5.1 in game. The DTSX sounded awesome in it. Everything else was just expanded stereo, and sounded like garbage. Normally I'd assume that's something that will be fixed promptly, but judging by the Logitech forums this has been an issue for months. And not only for the G933, but their software for the past few months has killed VS across the board for their entire lineup. And they're not even fully acknowledging the problem. It's completely and utterly baffling that it's gone on that long - it's like NVidia releasing a GPU that cant do 3d acceleration. I don't even have the proper words for how ridiculous this situation is.
 
So...it's a well built, pretty good sounding headset with a great mic and by far the best virtual surround (for my ears at least)...and under no circumstances should anyone even consider it for a second, until that bug is fixed. They've got a week before I return it and write them off forever, and I'm not holding my breath.   

 
are you using LGS 8.75? Did you check our their recent entry?
 
http://support.logitech.com/en_us/article/New-audio-processor-for-Dolby-Surround-and-DTS-with-Logitech-gaming-headsets
 
Microsoft has required vendors to adopt the new APO model for effect processing. They believe the new APO driver model provides a better overall audio effect experience. Specifically, system level crashes, or "blue screens", caused by older kernel mode drivers, are reduced when processing effects. 

With this change, we understand there are questions that result from differences in how the Speaker Propertiesin Windows now appear. Previously, we’ve shown Surround Settings in our LGS Control Panel and have tried to duplicate these settings in the Windows Speaker Properties panel.  
 
 
 

 
 
ok, apparently the problem with the NEW model is that older games read from the windows control panel settings and decide the output mix. APO compliance is a must for any game now else you'll get stereo only.
 
Logitech pls
 
Oct 30, 2015 at 4:59 PM Post #32,680 of 48,568
YUS, I can now die happy! https://www.massdrop.com/r/7P8F5L AKG K7XX are already on mass drop! Down side, I was under the impression that they were going to be out for like 3-4 months before coming back in. With this mindset, I bought the Supberlux hd681 evo.. They just arrived lol.
 
Only 500 units this time around though, and about 90 are sold. So i should be getting mine early when they start shipping out these.
 
Oct 30, 2015 at 7:52 PM Post #32,681 of 48,568
All black limited editions becoming the norm, it seems...



http://www.amazon.com/Beyerdynamic-DT990-PRO-250ohm-Straight/dp/B010IJ9W1U
 
Nov 1, 2015 at 10:35 AM Post #32,683 of 48,568
DTS Headphone X vs. Dolby Headphone.... 
 
Admittingly.. I do no gaming anymore.  Everything I watch are movies.
 
I am thinking that many of you play games and watch movies as well.  My home theater is a living room home theater which backs up to the bedroom.
My wife likes to sleep in on the weekends and my only choice is headphones.  I have the AKG712 and a Musical Fidelity X2  tube amp with a 3 year old SoundBlaster Recon3D standalone unit (24 bit, 5.1 96khz).  Primarily watching VUDU rentals in Dolby Digital Plus HDX or Directv rentals or Netflix.  I own some Blurays as well.
 
Not sure when DTS-X will be released.  I own a Marantz AV7702..it has a "Virtual" mode on the headphone side which is brutal.  They may be releasing a new version of this preamp processor next year which introduces DTS-X
 
So I am asking.. what would be my "next step up" in performance to get that simulated surround ?  Or am I pretty much maxed out right now?  I was hoping the X7 would have been steller, but I don't think it will give me that knock your socks off next step up...  2016 is timeframe
 
Nov 1, 2015 at 11:11 AM Post #32,684 of 48,568
MichaelJames99,
Read the Surround Sound post of my "If I Knew Then..." Thread, linked in my signature. I talk about DTS X Headphone there and have an audio sample.
I didn't know Marantz was putting DTS X in their next receivers, IMO that's great news. Let's hope that it's not just DTS X and also include DTS X Headphone. Where did you hear Marantz is gonna do this? Please post a link!
Marantz receivers are usually pricey, definitely have a larger physical size than the X7, would require a completely separate chat/mic setup, and much more overkill for people that mainly want to use headphones and occasionally speakers, so I think the X7 would still have situations where it will still be preferred (especially if Marantz skimps at all on headphone jack output). However, in your setup where apparently speakers are your main audio, the Marantz might be your best option if/when it becomes real. If you get the new Marantz and the headphone side is still "brutal," then you're probably better off using the Marantz for speakers and the Sound Blaster G5 for headphones. If you REALLY want to max out your headphone surround... Smyth Realizer.

But seriously, click the link in my signature!
 
Nov 1, 2015 at 11:22 AM Post #32,685 of 48,568
Hey! I was checking out this guide, very good guide man. Anyway, I really needed help picking a headset and I thought I would rather ask you since you are an audiophile. I am looking at a headset for gaming, and it really needs to have surround sound, all those features because I need to hear well in my counterstrike games. I also will use this to listen to a bit of music while playing.
 
I have Astro a40's right now, they are about a year old but the mic isn't working, they are very dirty and all beaten and broken. I was considering buying another pair of astros but that is last resort unless I find something better. I was looking at either the hyperx clouds ( only because comp. csgo users use them, otherwise I hate how they look with their fat ugly design), Sennheiser 558, or the sennheiser Game one.
 
I need something with a mic. I cannot have an external mic like a blue snowball or blue yeti, I need something that attaches to the headset. I am considering both the sennheisers. Would you recommend the Game one's? I'm scared that they won't perform well because they are being marketed to gamers. Are there any other headphones you recommend for me? I didn't watch all your videos. My budget is $200, That budget is not a firm price though. Thanks
 

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