[raband]

No - it's an "all in one" solution built into the headphone.

 

[Mad Lust Envy]

They do now, check out nfb 28.38 for example.

It's about time then, but it likes like they're all on the expensive side compared to the older NFBs that didn't have analog inputs.

 

[illram]

No - it's an "all in one" solution built into the headphone.

Thanks. That's what I figured.

Tried out Waves Nx tonight. (just the free trial not with the head tracker). It wasn't bad. It was definitely more like a virtual speaker room, complete with the maybe-more-than-necessary reverb. SBX, what I am familiar with, seems to still do rear cues well without the extra reverb. I tried out the max setting (Movie Theater), for the same reason the Spinal Tap guitar amps go to 11. It was a bit buggy at first but eventually it worked. (It refused to see any of my audio output devices until I rebooted my PC 3 times. Sure, OK.)

It is odd, as was noted in this thread by someone a while ago, that you have basically no idea how Waves is doing its thing. You can't (or don't have to?) configure speakers like you do with SBX, for example. I assume Mobius, using Waves tech, is the same in that you just select it as your audio device and that's that. I want that to be how this all works but a few years of messing around with this stuff has made me paranoid that that isn't sufficient to "just work" with everything (vs. a solution like SBX where you know everything works all the time if you just select the right speaker config). I tried Call of Duty Modern Warfare 3, which lets you configure in game (outside windows control panel) windows default vs. 5.1, and it did sound like 5.1 sounded a bit better. The rear cues seemed more behind me (just a little bit). But, on Windows default I still felt like rear cues were truly behind me. They just felt a little closer. I also tried GTA V, which also has its own surround settings, and it was just OK. Big huge room-size-fake soundstage but not blow-me-away rear cues.

I am curious how that magic is happening on default in games, if it is actually just taking a stereo signal and waving digital surround unicorn dust on it or virtualizing channels like SBX and GSX or what. (Placebo? Or I lack a solid understanding of precisely how windows default audio drivers communicate. Or something.)

 

[Mad Lust Envy]

If it's anything like Mobius, choosing 7.1 directly adjusts how many speakers are outputting in Windows at the driver level. Same with the Senn GSX1000.

With the Mobius even if your source is two channels, itlli be like youryoin a room with two speakers in front of you on the sides.

 

[illram]

If it's anything like Mobius, choosing 7.1 directly adjusts how many speakers are outputting in Windows at the driver level. Same with the Senn GSX1000.

With the Mobius even if your source is two channels, itlli be like youryoin a room with two speakers in front of you on the sides.

What's Windows feeding it when the game does not offer surround channel selection (5.1 or 7.1) though? A lot of games don't. Is Waves dependent on the game having that option?

 

[Mad Lust Envy]

I have never used Waves, so I dunno.

 

[illram]

I have never used Waves, so I dunno.

Mobius and Waves Nx are the same thing, at least as far as the surround software. Or does Mobius let you mess with speaker channels in its software?

 

[Mad Lust Envy]

No. They let you adjust room size, your head shape.

What I'm saying is that, on a two channel file, the sound are still gonna come from two virtual speakers in front of you.

 

[FlashBangStun]

Hey guys, new here!

So I've had a DT 990 pro 250ohms for 3-4 years now, driven by massdrop o2odac, Due to some sound muddiness when I play with the DT, I have been looking in my area for a stereo headphone with the same, or larger sound stage then my DTs.

While aware that it sounds like side-grade, I have narrowed the search down to the AD700x or AD900x (2nd hand), because they cost more or less the same currently. Going through tons of reviews and forums, I'm still undecided between the 2 and it's hard to find shops that would allow me to try them on for an extended period so I'm asking. My main concerns are:

1. Soundstage (For FPS gaming)
2. Any advantages of the 900x over 700x?

It'll be great if I could also read some of your experiences using both sets.

Thanks for reading this!

 

[illram]

No. They let you adjust room size, your head shape.

What I'm saying is that, on a two channel file, the sound are still gonna come from two virtual speakers in front of you.

Right, I get that. What I'm wondering is, if the movie/game/whatever does not let you select 5.1 or 7.1 you're using "windows default." Windows default is 2 channel, right? If so that's a limitation on the usefulness of the DSP (for gaming at least) since so many games don't offer that sort of audio customization.

It's the same conundrum people were wondering about with Windows Sonic.

 

[mindbomb]

Right, I get that. What I'm wondering is, if the movie/game/whatever does not let you select 5.1 or 7.1 you're using "windows default." Windows default is 2 channel, right? If so that's a limitation on the usefulness of the DSP (for gaming at least) since so many games don't offer that sort of audio customization.

It's the same conundrum people were wondering about with Windows Sonic.

The windows default format is user configurable, based on what your dac supports.



Selecting windows sonic for headphones though, automatically sets it to stereo. Which really limits how useful it is.

 

[Mad Lust Envy]

That's one reason I like how the GSX1000 and the Mobius does it. At the driver level. The Creative X7 is defaulted to stereo, so people who don't know to go to the sound settings in windows or forget, are not getting the proper experience.

 

[illram]

The windows default format is user configurable, based on what your dac supports.



Selecting windows sonic for headphones though, automatically sets it to stereo. Which really limits how useful it is.

I know, but Waves Nx (and Mobius, if I'm not mistaken) don't let you configure speaker selection though. The Configure button is literally greyed out. As you point out that's also the confusion/limitation with Windows Sonic.

Re: the GSX1000, my understanding is you still need to ensure the speakers are set to 7.1 in Windows via the "Configure" button. Like SBX. (If it does it automatically that's cool, but the function is still available to switch it.) But Waves Nx (and Mobius), again, seem to operate differently--that option in Windows is entirely removed. So: the question remains, if the program (e.g. your game) also lacks any channel selection config, are you getting stereo?

 

[Fegefeuer]

Waves NX is reporting itself as a 7.1 device to games.

sorry, I mean 7.1

 

[illram]

Waves NX is reporting itself as a 5.1 device to games.

Thank you! The answer I was looking for. How did you find that out? My google-fu must be weak.

edit: I'll answer my own question: the Kickstarter page FAQ includes an answer saying Waves Nx reports itself as a "7.1 soundcard" to Windows. I assume Mobius is thus doing the exact same.

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/waves/waves-nx-3d-audio-on-any-headphones/faqs

It would be nice if Windows audio settings weren't so damn opaque and multi-layered with seemingly duplicative settings pages. (E.g. the new audio device panel you get when you right click and select Sound Settings, but you can still find the "old" control panel box by clicking "Sound Control Panel" on that page... Ugh.)