[mikemalter]

 
Quote:

 

And how is the DAC war going, are you keeping both the Bryston and the W4S?
 

I kept the W4S and sent the BDA-1 back.  The BDA-1 is a really good DAC, and I especially liked the 192K upsampling feature.  However, I found the W4S DAC-2 more musical to my tastes.
 
I'd also like to publically acknowledge the people at Audio Advisor.  When they invited me to try the BDA-1 (after I bought the BDP-1 and needed a digital cable) they said it was a no questions asked return policy.  When it came time to get an RMA, it was literally no questions asked.  They were just as polite, respectful and interested in what I had to say then as when a potential sale is happening.  I trust those guys.
 
Can write more later, off to the gym.

 

[FlyingBear]

The first-sale doctrine covers this situation and it is not a violation of copyright law to buy and enjoy a used CD or LP, or for Goodwill to sell it. This is a limitation in copyright law that allows the resale or lending or giving away of a copyrighted work. Essentially, the copyright holder does not have the right to control the disposition of the work after (s)he first sells it to you.
 
Libraries (which also lend books, not just CDs!) pretty much exist only because of the first-sale doctrine.
 
The ripping of a CD that you own to various digital forms for your personal enjoyment is covered by fair use.
 
Both the first-sale doctrine and various fair use rights have been attacked repeatedly by the entertainment industry. In its death throes, and its desperation, the music industry has made some pretty extreme statements which, unfortunately, went too far and lost them some ground, sympathy and credibility, e.g. that ripping CDs to listen to them on your iPod is illegal. The disintermediation of the record labels was rather painful for them: they just didn't adapt to digital fast enough. It's not clear if they could have adapted, unless they were willing to sacrifice their business model; that's very hard for any company or industry. Like most middle-men, they were largely unloved by those who paid them on both sides of the transaction. Artists still have to get paid, and they're finding other ways, e.g. direct distribution and more gigging.
 
There are many ways for content owners to avoid first-sale and fair use issues, e.g. by licensing content to you with restrictive terms. The software industry has made an art of this.
 
Disclaimer: IANAL (I am not a lawyer) and you should check the above with one if, for some reason, you intend to rely on it!
 
Quote:

When I meant no one will come after you I was not speaking of pirating from the web.  
 
Consider this scenario.  You go to the Goodwill or even perhaps the used CD/vinyl store and you buy something used there.  Is it a violation of copyright law?  Goodwill and the used CD store are not sending royalties in for those sales.
 

 

 

[WarriorAnt]

Quote:

Yes.
 
 

Is that a recent acquisition? 
 

 

[Nova13]

Thanks in advance for those who read this and respond - I really appreciate it.....................................
 
So I have recently starting trying to move away from computer based audio - I study with a computer all day, plus the internet is too damned distracting.  I'd like to step away from it in order to truly relax and listen.  Also I have a tidy CD collection I've inherited and I'd like to play those in a comfortable chair without a screen staring at me.
 
I am hitting some major issues though.
 
Currently I happily run a Xonar Essence STX soundcard from my desktop -->  Ack Dack! (older version, borrowing from my brother, its a non-upsampling battery-powered DAC for those unfamiliar) --> WA3 --> DT880/600's.  This sounds great to my ears!  And most importantly, it is DEAD SILENT, I hear no tube noise (with the right tubes that is - many thanks to John), no hum, no hiss, no RFI, just beautiful music.  
 
Before buying a decent cd player (which I am eyeing the marantz CD5004), I wanted to try out the hypothetical setup using just a basic DVD player as a transport.  This sounded good in theory, but I get MAJOR hum/hiss/noise that I blame on the dvd players when I hook things up.  
 
 
So, does it make sense that a source could cause a tremendous amount of hum?  Perhaps I should not even call it hum, its just terribly loud noise that overwhelms the music, you can barely hear it.  It increases with volume, and goes away when the source is unplugged (i/e its not a problem with my amp).  Please read on, as I have already attempted a few things to resolve my issue....

 

So I think the dvd player is picking up then outputting an insane amount of hum/hiss/some kinda of awful noise.  I've never had any hum or noise when running my sound card as a source.  From searching, I find little complaints of folks getting hum from their sources.  I don't want to buy any sort of decent source if this may happen with it too.  Has anyone ever heard of a source introducing immense hum?

 

 

 

 

I have tried different AC outlets, including the ones my computer uses (and my computer/soundcard is SILENT).  Also, all of these cheap sources use two-pronged plugs, so using a cheater cable is not something I can try..

 

I have tried two cheap DVD players so far, both with the same horrid result:  Panasonic DVD-S35 and Sony DVP-SR200P.  I also tried a Sony Playstation 2 via optical out as well - same result!

 

I've tried both players this way:  

Digital out (via coax on the Sony, optical on the Panasonic) --> DAC --> amp

 

as well as:

DVD player R/W analog out --> amp

 

I have tried multiple outlets all over my apartment, but the apartment is so small (850 square feet - Yay!) that if RFI is the problem, there is no escaping it.

 

My best theory is this:  There is a massive RFI problem in my apartment that these cheap components are picking up.  I think my soundcard is well shielded - the Xonar STX advertises an RFI shield around the card, and thus explains why it is silent and the other cheap dvd players are not.

 

Is there a way to rule out RFI as an issue?  Might I flip all my breakers but one and then have a listen?  Make a tin-foil anti-alien helmet for my source?  There are FOUR AC units right outside my house, perhaps I am just stuck in an RFI nightmare?

 

So my questions for you all - 

1.  what do you think of my theory?  Any other theories of your own?

2.  Is there anything that can be done? - I was thinking of eventually getting one of these if I liked the whole idea of cd's - http://www.stereophile.com/content/marantz-cd5004-cd-player, but it would be unusable if it sounded remotely like these cheap dvd players.  But perhaps the marantz will also have no problems like my soundcard?

3.  Would flipping all breakers (but one, obviously) R/O the possibility of RFI?  Or can this stuff penetrate through the walls from the neighbors, etc?

 

Thanks for the help,

 

Eric

 

[grokit]

Eric, even if your sources are 2-prong, a cheater plug/cable on your amplifier might help. Good luck!

 

[Nova13]

grokit and I discussed via pm that a cheater plug on the amp probably would not help. The system is silent when the source is my soundcard and thus it would mean the amp itself isn't to blame.  however, we decided it was worth a try - but I am sad to say that this did not change anything.  
 
The song remains the same, so to speak...

 

[mikemalter]

Quote:

Is that a recent acquisition? 
 

Just took delivery last week, Tuesday or Wednesday I think.

 
 

 

[Silent One]

Quote:

Just took delivery last week, Tuesday or Wednesday I think.

 
 

Wednesday. I arrived after your drop. 

 

[Silent One]

Quote:

Thanks in advance for those who read this and respond - I really appreciate it.....................................
 
So I have recently starting trying to move away from computer based audio - I study with a computer all day, plus the internet is too damned distracting.  I'd like to step away from it in order to truly relax and listen.  Also I have a tidy CD collection I've inherited and I'd like to play those in a comfortable chair without a screen staring at me.
 
I am hitting some major issues though.
 
Currently I happily run a Xonar Essence STX soundcard from my desktop -->  Ack Dack! (older version, borrowing from my brother, its a non-upsampling battery-powered DAC for those unfamiliar) --> WA3 --> DT880/600's.  This sounds great to my ears!  And most importantly, it is DEAD SILENT, I hear no tube noise (with the right tubes that is - many thanks to John), no hum, no hiss, no RFI, just beautiful music.  
 
Before buying a decent cd player (which I am eyeing the marantz CD5004), I wanted to try out the hypothetical setup using just a basic DVD player as a transport.  This sounded good in theory, but I get MAJOR hum/hiss/noise that I blame on the dvd players when I hook things up.  
 
 
So, does it make sense that a source could cause a tremendous amount of hum?  Perhaps I should not even call it hum, its just terribly loud noise that overwhelms the music, you can barely hear it.  It increases with volume, and goes away when the source is unplugged (i/e its not a problem with my amp).  Please read on, as I have already attempted a few things to resolve my issue....

 

So I think the dvd player is picking up then outputting an insane amount of hum/hiss/some kinda of awful noise.  I've never had any hum or noise when running my sound card as a source.  From searching, I find little complaints of folks getting hum from their sources.  I don't want to buy any sort of decent source if this may happen with it too.  Has anyone ever heard of a source introducing immense hum?

 

 

 

 

I have tried different AC outlets, including the ones my computer uses (and my computer/soundcard is SILENT).  Also, all of these cheap sources use two-pronged plugs, so using a cheater cable is not something I can try..

 

I have tried two cheap DVD players so far, both with the same horrid result:  Panasonic DVD-S35 and Sony DVP-SR200P.  I also tried a Sony Playstation 2 via optical out as well - same result!

 

I've tried both players this way:  

Digital out (via coax on the Sony, optical on the Panasonic) --> DAC --> amp

 

as well as:

DVD player R/W analog out --> amp

 

I have tried multiple outlets all over my apartment, but the apartment is so small (850 square feet - Yay!) that if RFI is the problem, there is no escaping it.

 

My best theory is this:  There is a massive RFI problem in my apartment that these cheap components are picking up.  I think my soundcard is well shielded - the Xonar STX advertises an RFI shield around the card, and thus explains why it is silent and the other cheap dvd players are not.

 

Is there a way to rule out RFI as an issue?  Might I flip all my breakers but one and then have a listen?  Make a tin-foil anti-alien helmet for my source?  There are FOUR AC units right outside my house, perhaps I am just stuck in an RFI nightmare?

 

So my questions for you all - 

1.  what do you think of my theory?  Any other theories of your own?

2.  Is there anything that can be done? - I was thinking of eventually getting one of these if I liked the whole idea of cd's - http://www.stereophile.com/content/marantz-cd5004-cd-player, but it would be unusable if it sounded remotely like these cheap dvd players.  But perhaps the marantz will also have no problems like my soundcard?

3.  Would flipping all breakers (but one, obviously) R/O the possibility of RFI?  Or can this stuff penetrate through the walls from the neighbors, etc?

 

Thanks for the help,

 

Eric

Do you have CATV service? If so, two things I would put under observation: touch the coax connection in/around the cable box; touch coax connection on/around DVD player and see if the hum lessens or disappears altogether. If so, then you can proceed with Ground loop solutions...
 

 

[Silent One]

Quote:

I don't know Abraham Laboriel -- thanks very much for pointing me in his direction. Any specific recommendations for beginners (in addition to the album you mention above)?
 
 

 
http://www.amazon.com/Dear-Friends-Abraham-Laboriel/dp/B0000034C1
 
 
 

 
 

 

[Silent One]

Quote:

Btw, because of you guys, I looked at my little CD collection and I changed my mind now.
 
I'm gonna christen my amp with stevie wonder - live at last album. That's one of his best concert of all time imo.

Wise choice... but what track shall be the first?

   I'm looking forward to seeing the DVD (nice mention). Also, "Stevie Wonder Live: Natural Wonder" (Stevie, the Band & backup singers playing with the Tokyo Symphony Orchestra in Japan) is a must listen... amazing!
 

 

[Silent One]

Quote:

The first-sale doctrine covers this situation and it is not a violation of copyright law to buy and enjoy a used CD or LP, or for Goodwill to sell it. This is a limitation in copyright law that allows the resale or lending or giving away of a copyrighted work. Essentially, the copyright holder does not have the right to control the disposition of the work after (s)he first sells it to you.
 
Libraries (which also lend books, not just CDs!) pretty much exist only because of the first-sale doctrine.
 
The ripping of a CD that you own to various digital forms for your personal enjoyment is covered by fair use.
 
Both the first-sale doctrine and various fair use rights have been attacked repeatedly by the entertainment industry. In its death throes, and its desperation, the music industry has made some pretty extreme statements which, unfortunately, went too far and lost them some ground, sympathy and credibility, e.g. that ripping CDs to listen to them on your iPod is illegal. The disintermediation of the record labels was rather painful for them: they just didn't adapt to digital fast enough. It's not clear if they could have adapted, unless they were willing to sacrifice their business model; that's very hard for any company or industry. Like most middle-men, they were largely unloved by those who paid them on both sides of the transaction. Artists still have to get paid, and they're finding other ways, e.g. direct distribution and more gigging.
 
There are many ways for content owners to avoid first-sale and fair use issues, e.g. by licensing content to you with restrictive terms. The software industry has made an art of this.
 
Disclaimer: IANAL (I am not a lawyer) and you should check the above with one if, for some reason, you intend to rely on it!
 


 

In my view, The FlyingBear hit the Bull dead in his eye! The Majors actually could have adapted and done so well, considering the business model was outdated anyway. And the only leverage labels had left was in the vaults... eggs sold in different formats but never the golden goose! Addicted to the Gravy Train, they chose to fight instead... and lobbied. Every time I hear of Congress being "Lobbied," for some reason I picture the rear doors to the Brink's truck being swung open, with bags of cash being lobbed onto the steps of Congress. 

 
The DMCA signed in 1998 had started out with good intentions to bring the U.S. up to World copyright standards and address the newer tech issues brought forth along with the Internet. But those bags of cash bought Congress a heavier hand - to lean on an ol' German proverb, Threw the baby out with the bath water. "Fair Use" for consumers suffered serious water damage inside listening rooms across America.
 
Prior to 1998, "Fair Use" had a much better balance allowing all the parties - Labels, Artists, Electronic Cos. & Consumers to all thrive. Not saying protection with DMCA was not needed by creators of content. But that, an industry's influence unfairly eroded the rights of consumers, whose purchases allow for many a content companies existence in the first place. Wait, where's our representation for people v. lobbyists?! Most people will do the right thing most of the time; you'll always have insiders behaving corruptly and others outside the industry exploiting for profit.
 
Parts or all of my viewpoint may come under heavy dispute (from those reading this post, not necessarily FlyingBear). My indifference only comes by way of dinner... 

 
 
 
 

 

[WarriorAnt]

Quote:

Just took delivery last week, Tuesday or Wednesday I think.

 
 

Another unit to burn in!  How do you like it so far?
 
 

 

[Nova13]

To follow up on my noise problem.
 
I took the face plate off the outlet the dvd player was plugged into.  Plugged the DVD player back in.  Touching a bit of speaker wire from the chassis of the dvd player to the metal inside the outlet area totally removes the sound.
 
Forgive my ignorance here - but did I just run a ground? 

  or was this some sort of gypsy magic?
 
And is there a way to do this in a semi-permanent manner?

 

[Silent One]

Quote:

To follow up on my noise problem.
 
I took the face plate off the outlet the dvd player was plugged into.  Plugged the DVD player back in.  Touching a bit of speaker wire from the chassis of the dvd player to the metal inside the outlet area totally removes the sound.
 
Forgive my ignorance here - but did I just run a ground? 

  or was this some sort of gypsy magic?
 
And is there a way to do this in a semi-permanent manner?

Before Nova13 becomes a SuperNova, careful pokin' around that outlet! 
 
Now that you survived that little adventure, finding a solution should come easy... with Google (or any search engine).