[XP_98]

Does the X5/E12 stacking kit fit ?

 

[issachar1943]

  Excuse me if you have already disclosed this info previously in this thread, but do you connect your X5 to the E17 via digital(coax) or from the line out?

 
Hi there! 
 
I am connecting my X5 and E17 via lineout only. 
 
I would love to try the digital out now you mentioned. 

 
Now you gave me a wonder why wouldn't I do that? haha

 

[good sound]

 

   
To be completely honest, to say that I am less than enthused about the prospect of using any two piece portable system would be a big understatement, so the E12/X5 combo will have to be a very significant overall improvement over the X5 alone for me to even consider the possibility of toting around both pieces, even with the handy dandy HS6 stacking kit.

So I'm very interested by your future feedback
I just bought the NAD HP50 because it will be easier to drive by my X5 to come, and I'm reluctant to have to buy something more... unless it brings a very significant sound improvement.

The Viso HP50's and the X5 are a good match, although I did purchase the HP50's for use with my X3 which I ended up selling shortly after purchasing the HP50's when I got a really good deal an a very lightly used X5. It's difficult to say for sure if I would have bought the HP50's if I had auditioned them with the X5 instead of the X3. The combination of X5/HP50 is not for bassheads, that's for sure. One thing I did discover, by finally connecting the HP50's to my Oppo, is that the HP50's scale very well, but I think that is true of most hi-end headphones and IEM's.
 
P.S. I do seem to need to set the volume a little higher than I would have expected for a headphone with the impedance and sensitivity rating of the HP50, but maybe this is normal, I don't know, I haven't used my X5 with any other phones with a 32ohm rating and a similar sensitivity spec. I usually have the volume set around 80 to 85, occasionally higher, and I don't find it to be very loud necessarily. I am fifty now so maybe I am just going deaf, LOL.

 

[XP_98]

  The Viso HP50's and the X5 are a good match, although I did purchase the HP50's for use with my X3 which I ended up selling shortly after purchasing the HP50's when I got a really good deal an a very lightly used X5. It's difficult to say for sure if I would have bought the HP50's if I had auditioned them with the X5 instead of the X3. The combination of X5/HP50 is not for bassheads, that's for sure. One thing I did discover, by finally connecting the HP50's to my Oppo, is that the HP50's scale very well, but I think that is true of most hi-end headphones and IEM's.
 
P.S. I do seem to need to set the volume a little higher than I would have expected for a headphone with the impedance and sensitivity rating of the HP50, but maybe this is normal, I don't know, I haven't used my X5 with any other phones with a 32ohm rating and a similar sensitivity spec. I usually have the volume set around 80 to 85, occasionally higher, and I don't find it to be very loud necessarily. I am fifty now so maybe I am just going deaf, LOL.

Did you feel the need of adding an external amp like E12 or E17 (using only the amp part) ? Could you compare with / without ?
 
I'm 49, so maybe I'll need some higher volume too
 
P.S. : should I understand that you liked the combo X3/HP50 more than X5/HP50 ?

 

[kennybobenny]

Does the X5/E12 stacking kit fit ?

It is a nice fit, like they were made for each other

 

[good sound]

 

  The Viso HP50's and the X5 are a good match, although I did purchase the HP50's for use with my X3 which I ended up selling shortly after purchasing the HP50's when I got a really good deal an a very lightly used X5. It's difficult to say for sure if I would have bought the HP50's if I had auditioned them with the X5 instead of the X3. The combination of X5/HP50 is not for bassheads, that's for sure. One thing I did discover, by finally connecting the HP50's to my Oppo, is that the HP50's scale very well, but I think that is true of most hi-end headphones and IEM's.
 
P.S. I do seem to need to set the volume a little higher than I would have expected for a headphone with the impedance and sensitivity rating of the HP50, but maybe this is normal, I don't know, I haven't used my X5 with any other phones with a 32ohm rating and a similar sensitivity spec. I usually have the volume set around 80 to 85, occasionally higher, and I don't find it to be very loud necessarily. I am fifty now so maybe I am just going deaf, LOL.

Did you feel the need of adding an external amp like E12 or E17 (using only the amp part) ? Could you compare with / without ?
 
   Not for volume's sake. Yes, I normally listen at what most would consider a fairly high volume setting, but there is still plenty of power left if needed. I am only now considering an outboard amp in conjunction with the X5 to improve the overall sound quality which i had no issues with until I plugged my HP50's into my Oppo BDP-105. Again I cannot compare as I have no experience with the E17, or the E12 for that matter.
 
I'm 49, so maybe I'll need some higher volume too
 
 Possibly, but I was really only joking about that part.
 
P.S. : should I understand that you liked the combo X3/HP50 more than X5/HP50 ?
 
    No, I wouldn't necessarily say that. It's just that the X3 had more bass than the X5, all else being equal, and the HP50's could be considered by some to be a little light in the bass. So now you have a headphone that is considered somewhat light in the bass and a DAP that has the same reputation. Don't get me wrong the bass output is still more than acceptable for most, just not really thunderous basshead type bass like say the B&W P7 which I auditioned at the same time I auditioned the HP50's. I really liked them as well, but found that they were a little bass heavy with the X3, which I suppose I could have tamed with the X3's tone controls, but I think I liked the HP50's a little more and they were a hundred dollars cheaper. Who knows, if that same audition had been done with the X5 maybe I would have chosen the P7 or the Momentums which I also auditioned. That is all I meant.
 
 

 

[good sound]

 

Does the X5/E12 stacking kit fit ?

It is a nice fit, like they were made for each other

Heheheheh!.

 

[Znuff89]

I have the e12diy and the x17. The x17 adds a little umph to the x5 but the e12diy even with their original combo makes the x5 sound really good. I would say adding the x17 doesnt add enough and might leave you disappointed, but there is no way you would be disappointed with the e12diy x5 combo...amazing.

also...I hear a little noise with x5 only when player is on with no music playing...almost like a seashell effect. This goes away when using either of my amps which leads me believe it has to do with the internal amp of the x5. Anyone notice this on their player?

 

[XP_98]

  Does the X5/E12 stacking kit fit ?

 
 

It is a nice fit, like they were made for each other

 

  Heheheheh!.

 
Well... 

I thought it was obvious that my question was for issachar1943 who had just told me that he was using - and enjoying - his X5 paired with E17...
I know the E17 is smaller, that's why I asked about the staking kit (made for E12)... 
 
Anyway, I'm french, so you can blame it on my bad english...

 

[kennybobenny]

B

sorry if I stepped on your toes. I misunderstood





Well... :confused_face: I thought it was obvious that my question was for issachar1943 who had just told me that he was using - and enjoying - his X5 paired with E17...
I know the E17 is smaller, that's why I asked about the staking kit (made for E12)... 

Anyway, I'm french, so you can blame it on my bad english...

 

[XP_98]

sorry if I stepped on your toes. I misunderstood
B

No problem !

 

[CH23]

Is the quoting system completely broken or did y'all just write IN quotes, quoted yourself multiple times, etcetera?

 

[aangen]

Okay so I ordered an E12 DIY (gold) and an HS6 strapon device for my X5 with Shure SE535 IEMs. 
It had better sound much better dang it!!!  You guys and your blah blah blah.

 

[kennybobenny]

Okay so I ordered an E12 DIY (gold) and an HS6 strapon device for my X5 with Shure SE535 IEMs. 
It had better sound much better dang it!!!  You guys and your blah blah blah.

I can't wait to hear what you think. I am building a custom stand out of wood to set on my desk at work. That's how much I like mine.

 

[ClieOS]

  First of all I think it's eminently more reasonable to expect a portable DAP that is almost three times the price and already in a significantly larger enclosure than a stand alone portable amp from the same manufacturer, to sound as good as the stand alone amp, as it is for someone to expect a Ferrari to offer all the amenities of a mini-van. That analogy is frankly absurd. Even simply for the purpose of making a point I would hope someone would be better served not to utilize such unreasonable exaggeration.
 

 
No, X5 is not in any way significant larger then E12. If you are comparing X5 to an E6 or E11 than that will make sense. I have looked at their inner (as general I do with all my gears to understand their working principle) to inspect the components so I actually know what I am talking about, and not try to pullthings out of my behind. Have you actually see both side by side? They are almost the same size!
 

 
 

  Secondly I think a lot of your argument is born from assumption and some of those assumptions simply don't hold water. Even if those assumptions were all correct, it still doesn't explain the supposed amount of improvement adding the E12 to the X5 produces. Throwing away or reducing the MAJORITY of the E12 parts to accommodate it into the X5 chassis with all of the other necessary components for the DAP section is an assumption, unless you have some direct insight to FiiO's work on the project. Just because the claim that FiiO would have to use a much larger chassis than the X5 to accomplish the task, and that the final product would cost the customer considerably more may seem logical on the face of things does not automatically make it so.

 
I'll just list one simple example why E12 is better - voltage swing. Every audio device starts with a power section. The better the power section, the better you can design an analog circuit around it. If you don't believe me, just ask anyone who have designed an amp before. Do you know what are the voltage swing for both devices? X5 is about +/-6V and E12 is around +/-11V. That number alone means that the dynamic range E12 can potentially offer is a lot more than X5... and mind you, these are all boosted from the 3.7V offered by Li-ion battery. The bigger the boost, the harder to get it right as any kind of boosting unavoidably increase noise (and it becomes worst the more you boost it), and therefore requires more circuit and carefuller design to make sure your power section remains as clean as it can be. Again, just check with any amp designer or qualified DIYer and (s)he will tell you the same thing. I am not an EE by training, but I have spent the better part of the last decade in DIY so I am not totally useless when it comes to amp circuit.
 
Now just heard me out - HifiMan HM901 is widely regarded as one of the best sounding DAP in the market right now. Do you know its power section design? To obtain the cleanest possible voltage without boosting, they start with connecting two Li-ion in serial to get a nominal voltage of 7.4V (3.7V x 2), then uses two of this battery pack to create the dual +/-7.4V power rail. The whole battery pack is half the weight of X5. In fact, The battery pack contribute over half the weight of HM901 itself. That how serious Hifiman think the power section is - and they avoid all the problem of boosting by using a giant of a complex battery pack just to get the power rail right, even though that battery means that HM901 is about 40% thicker than X5 and offer less play time. That's however not a problem for Hifiman because HM901 is meant to offer the best SQ for audiophile who are willing to sacrifice all other aspects of the DAP. It is more of a niche market than X5 is meant for.
 
Now that's just voltage swing, and I am not even touching other areas.
 

  Thirdly, and I think most importantly, is the fact that i want to assure everyone that I have no axe to grind against FiiO, but nor do I have any vested interest in the company either. I own and enjoy my X5 on a daily basis as I did my X3 before that, and I will seriously consider the purchase of an E12 and the stacking kit to pair with my X5, so it should be perfectly clear that II am not in any way FiiO hating. I have before and will in all likelihood again support FiiO in the best way I know how, with my wallet. I think my question and concerns were and still are valid and legitimate. Will not the X7 need a better amp section to outperform the X5 regardless of how much better the DAC chips are and how they are implemented? Will the X7 have a significantly larger chassis than the X5? Yes, of course the X7 will cost more.
 

 
I agree and I don't see your post as an attack. But it is a general lack of understanding in electronics no less, thus the reason I replied.
 
Personally, I don't really think X7 needs an "improved" amp section from X5, but more of a fine-tuning. I have heard many expensive DAP for the last few years from iBasso to iriver A&K. You will be surprised at how some of them have very inadequate amp section related to their price tag. Takes the original AK100 for an example. It is about twice as expensive as X5, actually has no real amp section at all and only delivers minimum of driving power. If you think X5's amp section should have been as good as E12, you ought to think again. There are actually only less than a handful of higher end DAP in the market now that has as solid a amp section as X5. Quite a few that cost a lot more barely offer half or even 1/4 as much power.
 

  ClieoOS, your position and opinion of FiiO have been clearly demonstrated in these forums and I truly have no issue with that. FiiO is a great company and they deserve all the support, but i feel that sometimes you tend to defend them with more than just a hint of defensiveness. My original inquiry was not born out of animosity, anger or malevolence, it was born out of discovery and legitimate curiosity. I certainly feel that i fully weighed all the factors that were available to me before forming and stating my inquiry..

 
I defend anyone who is worth defending. Of course I can only defend those I know and understand. I can't just go out and defend devices I have no knowledge of, couldn't I? I also stand up for other brands as well, you just probably haven't read those posts I had made - and I am not just defending FiiO for the sake of defending or fanboism. It is because there are good, solid reason to do so, regardless if it is FiiO and any other brands.