The discovery thread!

[Cecala]

Hey, after over a month (most of it in the customs office), my Zempire Audio ZE51B arrived. I bought them because BadGuyGoodAudioReviews hyped them up so much and i was blown away with his previous hype trains (i owned the Canpur CP622B and loved it, then later the same with the APX SE).
They are hard to photograph, anyway:



These are my impressions after ~3 hours:

The case is great for transportation, but useless for storage because it's too big. It's fine. It's a small pelican case.
They come with Zhuaudio(?) Bamboo tips, only. The tips are great and comfortable, but they don't synergize with the IEM's sound very well in my opinion, more on that soon.
The cable is cheap, there is no way around it, it's not like from a 35€ Kinera IEM, it actually is. I own the Kinera Celest Gumiho, and the cable is identical. Big oof. You will need to change it, it works, it's flexibel, but the sound is not adequate for this IEM.

Regarding the IEM itsself:
Beautifully made, i could choose the colours (went for a nice red and blue, both are darker than i thought, but i'm happy regardless), they look premium enough for its price. They seem chonky, but are actually very comfortable, with a lot of tips. That's important.

Regarding the sound:

Bass: Bombastic impactful bass with the BCD driver, it's by far the highlight of the IEM. It's super fun and kicks ultra hard, it's plenty both quantity and quality. It's not as clean and transparent like my APX SE, but that shouldn't be a suprise. The impact the bass has is unique, people that have heard an outstanding BCD IEM like the Canpur CP622B know what i mean, this bass has the same quality, but more quantity. It pierces your skull and deep into your brain. Pure, brutal, thunderous BCD bass fun, i love it. This is the reason to get this IEM. There's the tiniest bass bloat into the midrange (into male vocals), but it's really no big deal.

Mids: Somewhat laid-back vocals, less forward than Harman in general. They are really good from a tonality perspective. I would say they certainly compete in this price region with other IEM's (mostly), but kilobuck+ IEM's will have better mids. Because they are a bit more laid-back, you might think that they lack that last bit of engagement and intimate factor. But: They are never shouty, be it with male or female vocals, which i sometimes have a problem with Harman-tuned IEM's. All in all, they are fine, but not groundbreaking. They sound full, warm, but a bit more distant. But they are not thinn. Occasionally you get some rare harshness with "S" and "T" consonant, i'll talk about that in the next paragraph.

Treble: It's somewhat dark-ish treble. That is sharp. Yup, i said it. It didn't pass my listening criteria titel for sharpness (Queen - "Too Much Love Will Kill You" at 0:28). Sharp treble, "S" consonants are easily piercing and i winced when i first plugged this IEM in with the original cable and the original tips on my Holo May -> Mass Kobo 428 (which is basically a MK475) and did my above mentioned listening test. I think that you need to swap the tips and the cable.
Symbio W eartips work great. Eletech Baroque work great, i use them. If you have a plethora of tips i'm sure you will find a pair that massively reduces / negates the sharpness.
I then also changed the cable to a KBEAR 16 Core Pure Copper one, it's a super soft, flexibel pure copper cable which i went for because i thought that the copper would help to reduce the sharpness of the problematic "S" etc. sound. It's 30€ from Hifigo, so not even something expensive. I might get an even better cable for the ZE51B down the road. I then also swapped the amplifier to my Rebelamp, which is a bit less resolving than the MK, but also very dynamic and smoother / warmer.
Result: -> The sharpness nearly vanished. Only on songs that have over the top sharpness with their "S" consonants i get bothered by them anymore (and it's not wincing anymore), it's so much better than the stock configuration, i would say that i reduced the sharpness by 70-80%.
The ZE51B is no sparkly, airy IEM, the treble is there, it's sufficient, but it won't blow you away with details and the ringing out of splashy instruments / female voices. I would say that it's the weakest part of the ZE51B.
I have to state that the more i listen to different music, the less problematic the treble is. It's smooth ~90-95% of the time, when i started listening i threw problematic songs at it to really test its limits. Maybe not fair. Maybe it is. Maybe it's true to the source and the DaVinci / APX SE is more forgiving, which could be the case. Either way, there is still a single high treble peak that sometimes gets on my nerve a bit, but on most albums i can't hear anything that sounds problematic.

Overall it sounds very relaxed, smooth, somewhat dark, non-aggressive. Except on very few occasions you still get that hint of sharpness, maybe it will reduce itsself further with the time / a better cable.

Soundstage is good, it's not the biggest, but it's really solid for an IEM.

Comparisons:
Versus the GOAT below 500€ (for me), the DaVinci: The DaVinci is more balanced, it has a really perfected tonality. Vocals are a bit more forward (closer to you) on the DaVinci.
The treble of the ZE51B is weaker and not that well tuned (there, i said it) in comparison to the DaVinci. The midrange (vocals) are also not on the same level for me as on the DaVinci, i think it's better textured and vocals sound more true to life. It's just not quite there, which does not mean that it's bad, but when listening to something like "Feeling Good - Michael Buble" the DaVinci is ahead. Maybe that's only because its vocals are a touch more forward, but it wins. I admit that the tonality of the DaVinci is truly perfect and the ZE51B is often not that far behind, but overall it is. My main problem with the DaVinci are its dynamics. Finally, the bass. The ZE51B just runs circles around the DaVinci. It's just not a fair comparison. It hits so hard, so brutally honest and deep, you just smile from one ear to the other. I don't own my Canpur CP622B anymore (sold it to fund the APX SE), so i can't compare them directly, but this super impactful BCD bass that just pierces through your skull and leaves a remarkable impression that leaves you speechless, is the exact same thing the Canpur did, the ZE51B does the same thing, but even more, and better. But the ZE51B lacks in other areas compared to the Canpur (which was way more forward) or the DaVinci (which i find truly perfect from a tonality perspective), which just trumps the ZE51B with its perfected, balanced tonality. The Canpur is the better IEM, but it is five times the price, and even then, the ZE51B has an even deeper reaching BCD bass, on the Canpur it was a very nice additive feature, on the ZE51B it is the main attraction and the whole reason to get it.

Overall the sound is very smooth, non-aggressive. It does not throw details in your face and is a very easy listening experience. I'm still not sure if the details are adequate for its pricepoint (esp. in comparison to the DaVinci), regardless of the treble peak that you may or may not hear depending on different factors. The BCD factor is 100% worth it if you want to experience such a thing. But as i said, in a direct comparison to the DaVinci, the Dunu just sounds more refined in the mids and treble (and honestly most of the time more detailed without that sharpness / harshness that sometimes appears), that's what i hear.
It's clearly a bass first, mids second, and lastly treble IEM. I also think that you should not get such a cable with a 700€ purchase.

TLDR: Best BCD implementation that leaves a unique bass impression, other cheaper IEM's may trump with a better tonality, allthough i would not call the ZE51B bad in this regard at all after swapping the cable and tips (and source if you can). This IEM is in a very unique position and most likely a bass lovers dream, its BCD implementation is truly addicting. In other areas it needs a bit more refinement.

All in all, i'm happy with my purchase, i missed the BCD sound of the Canpur, but after the APX SE purchase i was in no position to get another multikilobuck IEM.

Anecdote: I know that the manufacturer is from russia, I don't want to get into politics in here, let's just hope things get better and this guy can keep working on his stuff and maybe somewhere in the future there will be a flagship that competes with the big boys, because the BCD implementation of this IEM is truly special. In the end we're all people that love music.

Let's hope that this improves mightily after a decent burn in. 3 Hours is very short. So far though, your initial impressions has left a sour taste in my mouth. I had very high hopes for this iem. That slight bass bleed into the mids is a big no for me as well as that mediocre sound-stage. The bass department sounds incredible although if the rest are not at the same level then I'm moving on. I would like this compared to the ISN EBC80 & Thieaudio Origin ultimately.

 

[bithalver]

Did you know that autism and the love of lists often go hand in hand? Many autistic people create lists of their favorite songs, shows they want to watch, or recipes they want to try, among many others. This affinity for lists is common enough that many people wonder whether making lists is a sign of autism.

Creating list by itself is not an autistic-only behavior; maybe you are just a melancholic type. See sort here and in a book here; that book is translated to many languages for a reason.

 

[Exekuhtor]

Lets hope that this improves mightily after a decent burn in. 3 Hours is very short. So far though, your initial impressions have left a sour taste in my mouth. I had very high hopes for this iem. That slight bass bleed into the mids is a big no for me as well as that mediocre sound-stage. The bass department sounds incredible although if the rest are not at the same level then I'm moving on. I would like this compared to the ISN EBC80 & Thieaudio Origin ultimately.

Absolutely. 3h with zero burn-in is only good for the first impressions, but that's what i did.
I think the bass bleed is basically non-existent, with a good cable it is a non-issue. The main problem will be the slight sharpness in the treble which i hope will be completely or almost completely gone after more hours of use and a better cable.
I just glanced over a review of the Origin and it seems that it has way less BCD bass than the ZE51B. I honestly doubt that there are a lot of sets (if any) that have this monstrous BCD bass. No idea of the ISN EBC80, it also seems to be a very niche manufacturer IEM, interesting...

 

[DynamicEars]

I’m curious. How does something like that impact the sound?

It makes the DD bass go from BLEH to YEAH!
The small hole allows airflow to get through the overly dense filters being used. In my experience, this translates to better bass dynamics and texture, while still allowing the filter to do it's job of taming the upper mids/lower treble. A bit more brightness does get through, but the improvement in bass quality is almost always worth it.

I'm sure senpai @DynamicEars will explain it much better.

I think this also explains a bit why the bass can be so good on BCD sets, especially the Sonion type. No filters blocking those drivers, full impact.

What @Ineras said is just nothing short.

Bass is great without any filters, raw bass with good airflow is the best, without smear but manufacturers need to put damper (usually nylon paper similar to that mesh 250 mesh500 etc) to reduce harshness from high mids and treble frequencies, caused by the DD itself, or other drivers (if the set is multidrivers)
So they usually sacrifice the bass quality with those nylon paper, to dampen the edges of high frequencies. And these filters are dense, enough to block the airflow on bass attack, so they reverb back couldn't go out at the moment the bass notes appears. These will caused "smears" because of over resonance bass notes inside the IEM shell or cavity.
When we poke a tiny hole, (just with tip of the small needle - you have to take out the filters first, poke it and put it back on nozzle - NEVER poke the filter when on the nozzle) like @Ineras said, it will make airflow hole for bass notes, so bass will sounded tighter as they have way to go out (go to our ears, which make air pressure feeling too, a good thing that differentiate from BA drivers) but the filter still do it's job to tame the peaks and harshness from mid and high frequencies

For IEMs with tubes, if the DD also dampened heavily, they will sounded blunted too, because lack of airflow. Estrella is a good example why the bass can't sounded open, and Monarch MkII also.



Good bass DD should be undampened, or dampened (if they also make sound on upper frequencies) but with decent airflow. Take the Shock for example, they don't use any damper at all on Bass tube, and the bass quality in Shock is great. Sony Z1R use foam for dampers, which I found still better airflow and absorb the bass through the foam, at least they wont over reverbing or resonance back to the driver.



Bass quantity roughly will be the same, but the quality is way different, like wrap your big subwoofer speaker with cloth, they will still sound similar in quality but different in quality.
Or take a straw, blow it with thin paper on the other end and try without, this is the similar anology.

whoever create the damper with tiny hole on the center, or foam like donut shape will reign the bass quality king, no manufacturer do that to date, I wonder why.

Meanwhile, My modded Shock (with foam on mids tube to retune the highmids and 6khz area, and little foam on treble tube for more refine sound, closer to EST smoothness but detailed as I turn up the brown Knob) :


Basically, I just just medium density or "imported foam" similar with Z1R foam (you can buy in Ali, in bulk) (pictures above are using high density foam for my first attempt but I didn't like it, too dense resulting too much treble absorbed) but same method. Cut into half of the tube then cut again into 2 (become half circle) then just slowly insert it into tube opening, gently. This way also prevent dust and earwax go inside the tube. I let the bass DD tube undampened for great airflow.

I modded my Shock and fine tune them with final tuning on Yellow Knob 3.9 and Brown Knob 4.5 (with foam attached on mids and trebles tube), after few days and settled, I measured them and the result is similar to what I want (my personal target FR) (I also want to test how close my preference sound without seeing the graph first as I can fine tune the Shock, to my target FR because my target FR is the tuning that I build based on many IEM and experience, combined)

And here the result compared to my personal target FR (I borrow Mark Ryan's squig as base, thanks to him @MRSallee :

Surprisingly, the result is very close to my personal target FR, so I already know what I want since many years back (my FR was created 7 years back with slight adjustment though years as I listened to more IEMs) 8khz is coupler's peak and there is no aggressive mid sibilance there.




I'm shocked that my retuned Shock actually close to Origin, not sure the bass quality since it's Thieaudio (I heard great reviews, but yeah I'm more strict to bass quality even compared to Precogvision or Tzennn (sorry forget your new nickname). And I don't know how the BC drivers compared between Sonion BC and that more traditional Piezo based BC on Origin. Currently I find that my Shock don't have any shortage, just slight "room for improvement" but my Shock sit on my top of collection with Z1R, taking place the Mest (!!!), way above Monarch MkII, let alone the IEMs on similar price. The Spatial staging is special, the bass is special, the imaging precision is crazy, mids are lush and detailed. Tonality after fine tuning is close to perfect. Treble extension after tuning also very extended, refined and detailed.



More balanced tonality than Z1R, Z1R still have more bass impact from that 12mm DD, but the bass on shock is shockingly good, especially on texturing and tightness. Mids also bit more forward than Z1R with little bit more treble extension.




I chase the treble tuning of Annihilator 2023, and the modded Shock delivers, maybe 90% of the treble detail and refinement, bass is on same level. I won't call this as baby Annihilator, maybe Little brother Anni 2023 suits better. 20% of the price with 80-90% of the SQ, I couldn't be happier.

Just waiting my M.Hawk cable now, I'll do anything to max out the Shock SQ, I think it's quite pause game, semi retired for me. The BCD changes everything.

 

[Redcarmoose]

Creating list by itself is not an autistic-only behavior; maybe you are just a melancholic type. See sort here and in a book here; that book is translated to many languages for a reason.

Right, no it is just pretty common to find that many reviewers have such, like HBB has Asperger's Syndrome.

The TSMR Armor just arrived. Darn the airmail is fast at times? To bad it is rainy today, and I don't have one of those indoor studios to take box opening shots.

The crazy part is we don't even know what it looks like, it probably looks like this though?

 

[Vonbuddy]

Creating list by itself is not an autistic-only behavior; maybe you are just a melancholic type. See sort here and in a book here; that book is translated to many languages for a reason.

While persons who make lists might have autism, that is not a diagnostic factor in determining the presence of the disorder as you said. I have worked with persons with autism for over 30 years and no two people with autism are the same. The main determinants in diagnosing autism involve early development (early onset), communication problems, extreme concrete thinking, and social interaction issues, among other factors. There is the co-occurrence of other disorders like obsessive-compulsive disorder, anxiety disorder, and other mental health diagnoses in a smaller percentage of persons diagnosed as having autism. I would consider a person making lists as "organized".

 

[GroovyAudio]

Hey, you gotta trust the process. I'm sure the MG800 will sing for you! I'm surprised you held on to the H60 as long as you did. Yeah, it will NEVER leave my rotation, and I pretty much spent all yesterday and earlier today listening to it exclusively, and it was amazing, but for those with fit problems, it isn't ideal. That's why I would say steer clear of the Anvil. As soon as the EBC80 lands, I'll keep you in the loop, my friend.

Speaking of trusting the process, I never got interested in the QT-X because when the hype is created by one single person, I don't tend to bite. The train wasn't maintained outside of that one source, and now the two owners I know from this thread either sold or have it up for sale, so that speaks volumes for me, regardless if it's "really good" or not. It's not good enough to keep (for very long). I like consensus. I guess I'm democratic that way LOL

The EBC80 is being sold for a very competitive price. Definitely less than you'd think, especially with the level and branding of tech, and the price of other IEMs that have the same or similar tech count. This seems to be a market disruptor, like the pricing on the Dita Project M, TMSR Shock, or the AFUL Performer 5+2.

Word. I'll be honest with you. I was heartbroken when I sold my H60. It really left such a good impression on me. Regarding QT-X, well... yea I guess I had my honeymoon phase with it but after using Dynaquattro and H60 for a longer period, QT-X simply couldn't keep up. When Akros made a comparison in his video with QT-X and H60 saying that H60 is one step ahead I didn't agree but now I can see that he was right. Can't wait to hear your EBC80 impression. Very competitive price sounds amazing. Cheers!

 

[tombrisbane]

Mega5EST Bass+ arrived, I'm ignoring the 3.5mm to 4.4mm adapter as it seems like an accident waiting to happen, but other than that this is sounding pretty awesome so far.

 

[kaeswiss]

MAAAAAAN why do they keep doing this to me! Really love the look of this one and a Flash Acoustics collab is interesting…. Expect this one to be priced a little higher and hope for the best!

I saw this on (X) Twitter too. I’m not sure I’ll be able to resist this one. After the last TANGZU

The original Wu was $159.00. If a damn cable jacks it up to $500.00, or anywhere around that price, count me out. $350.00 is the highest I'm willing to go. But that's just me.

Their latest IG post shows the whole lineup so I have a feeling they won't stray too far off in pricing.

 

[flre]

A few weeks ago I bought these ROSESELSA Distant Mountain because I liked the look of them, because I wanted to test out some supra-aural headphones, and because they cost $70:

https://rosetechnics.com/products/r...ootd-vintage-design-44mm-dd-driver-mmcx-3-5mm

They come with a standard MMCX cable and connector from what I can tell.
The cable provided is a 3.5mm, and I don't plan on changing it for now.
The cable is a fabric type, quite thin and light.
(decent I'd say)

These type of headphones don't completely envelop the auricle, so the isolation from the outside environment is not optimal
(similar to open back headphones, but even less so), and they tend to make you increase the volume if you are not in a completely silent environment.

On the other hand, they offer the advantage of being less heavy and tiring to wear than circumaural headphones.

That said, speaking of sound, I have to say that I quite like these small and cheap headphones.

They offer the type of sound that I like: they offer good bass and mid-bass (but little sub-bass), decent mid and mid-high tones (quite forward, but they easily go into crisis in congested tracks).

I hear traces of sibillance on the voices from time to time (or when violins play), especially when the track is 'full' (and the listening volume increases).

I would say that they are good for non-critical music listening, where the only purpose is to listen to music without looking for too many refinements.

Received mine today and can only say your description is spot on!
All in all a better Porta Pro in my book. Except for the comfort, there the Koss wins. Got some midrange honkiness going on, but apart from that pretty smooth and nice treble! Bass is also not too shabby considering they are open on ears.
And don’t underestimate all the hard work that went into removing ANC and passive noise isolation. Finally you can wear headphones and talk to people at the same time! The future is now, indeed! (Sorry for the irony, but the product description kinda prompted me to have some fun )
Looks are stunning, obviously. I chose the same color scheme as yours, so I will honor your beautiful pictures by not taking some myself that may remind people of the color of earwax again

 

[BlueA]

I would consider a person making lists as "organized"

I called them people with taste.
It's very difficult to curate and align style.

It require memory and subtle pattern recognition of large sets to start categorization.
It also mean you can understand the intent of the authors cause it's the main determinant.

I'm not even trying to go beyond gross styles for myself

 

[Nimweth]

Just in: KA11. This thing is really powerful! Had to reduce volume from 34 to 14 on source device. Bass is vastly improved vs. Penon OS133. Have not tried it with planars yet, but will soon. Fabulous value at £20 Ali Express.

 

[Audiofilobrpt]

Mega5EST Bass+ arrived, I'm ignoring the 3.5mm to 4.4mm adapter as it seems like an accident waiting to happen, but other than that this is sounding pretty awesome so far.

Have you had the mega5est 7th Edition to let me know if the shell sizes are the same? The Bass Edition appears to have a larger shell from the pictures.

 

[ToneDeafMonk]

Have you guys seen this , it was shared to be from a Facebook post.

Wow BASN should be boycotted simply looking for paid shills.

I wouldn't trust a single review about thier products- kinda reminds of another one P.

 

[thaslaya]

Mail call.

Muse Hifi M5 Ultra in

Alright, I gotta confess something. Penon Impact has been in my ear for a lot of today while I'm writing and working on other things. Before the M5 Ultra came in that is. I like it but I'm also not likely going to go full bore on bass marks, etc.

But the M5 Ultra solved my biggest issue with them with way more note weight. This is the good stuff.

Tube-y goodness in a small package! This thing looks really nice too. Definitely worthy of the white glove treatment. Looking forward to your future reviews utilizing the M5 Ultra

Have you guys seen this , it was shared to be from a Facebook post.

Wow BASN should be boycotted simply looking for paid shills.

I wouldn't trust a single review about thier products- kinda reminds of another one P.

Yes paying for reviews is absolutely terrible, but I think the real tragedy here is that keyboard