[Uprox]

Thank you for the suggestion. It would be nice if it had higher sensitivity when not at my main setup though. Amplification isn't an issue since I have plenty of amps. Just not portable ones.

When looking at something used for around $120 or so, is there another suggestion that you have? That way I could technically get something that would be more expensive if it were new (better value).

I can suggest Audiosense AQ0. L-shaped sound is funny, has quite good resolution. As for me there is too much bass for my most preference music styles. I bought mine for $49 only, so you could wait for a discount.

 

[Redcarmoose]

Luck is 10% chance, 90% preparation.
So many chances being thrown around, the issue being do you have what it takes to seize that chance?
---
Oh hey, my PR2 finally ship along with many others delayed PR2.
It seems KZ Global got a new batch of PR2

I love your post!

 

[DynamicEars]

One question: what does it mean "mid-bass bleed"? Warm/bassy is "bass bleed" by definition, isn't it? If the bass does not "bleed", the midrange wouldn't be warm and you would have something like Monarch II with detached bass.

Along that note, does Andromeda 2020 has "bass bleed" given that it does not have strong punches but noticeable "fat" around 250Hz and 500Hz.

Mid-bass bleed = a boosted mid-bass relative to the midrange/treble, so that the ears perceive the mid-bass to encroach into the lower midrange. So there is a veil; tail notes of mid-bass notes mesh together with the lower midrange - this results in the midrange not sounding transparent, with notes in that frequency band appearing muddy and not defined. On your query of the Andromeda 2020, yes I think it has a bit of mid-bass bleed actually.

Yes agree that a mid-bass bleed warms the lower midrange and makes the overall tonality sound warm/lush. Though you can have different degrees of midbass bleed right, from bad to less bad? This may require better tuning on the tuners part, but perhaps may also be to do with driver capability and perhaps driver type? Sometimes for some trandsucers, it seems amplification and/or eartips may "tighten" the mid-bass and give better control too, so it doesn't appear to bleed so much?

Anyway, you can still have a bassy IEM that has bass focused mostly at the sub-bass (<60 Hz), this won't give you a mid-bass thump or bleed, but it gives a visceral rumble felt in the chest as a different presentation of bass. Ie the Crin style targets haha.




Hard line to balance. That's the magic equilibrium all of us are trying to find, for the least amount of coin haha. It is subjective too, some consumers are bassheads, some are sensitive to bass, so YMMV.

If you have heard some of the FatFreq IEMs (which retail at eye watering prices), they have copious bass, but the bass doesn't seem to encroach too much into the other frequency bands, and they can still sound very technical despite being basshead.

As a picky bass person I want to chime in about this "bass bleed".. can't help lol.

I want to share about an illustration, based on my personal experience with lot of IEMs and comparing them with the graph. The danger area of bass bleed is between 100hz and 300 hz territories. Especially on 100hz-150hz area where the mid and upper bass sit there.

I made this triangle of bass bleed (blue triangle) for roughly where the bass tuning shouldn't pass that triangle area for the frequencies. While the yellow rectangle area,
is where we can get great punch or impact from mid and sub bass together. With note, that applied with balancing from around +8db pinna gain on high mids area.

There are a lot of bass tuning style, for examples :

The most common V-style bass tuning, found in so many entry / budget level especially single driver (mostly DDs) because of the natural character of the driver.
As you can see here, this type of tuning have "bass bleed" because they are passing the +5db increment on 100hz, and also on 150hz.
This will be warm on half side (can be bright if the counter balance high area is too boosted of course), but also sounded as "bass bleed" for DDs, for BAs and planars they have better control and minimum "smear" so those 2 types of drivers are more tolerable.

Next we have this kind of tuning :

The clean bass tuning with nice punch,
as you can see, the mid and upper bass still on blue triangle area. This tuning is surely don't have bass bleed, but they have good punch because on 60hz and below, they are reaching similar +db with the pinna gain (quantity of the bass boost can be vary based on personal preferences). This type of tuning need extra driver and crossover to create. So usually this kind of tuning only appears on multi driver IEMs. Personally i like this kind of tuning, Z1R, Monarch MkII, Mest MkI and MkII, EE Odin are using this kind of bass shelf. Depend on implementation, too low 150-300hz area can make mids little bit "thin" or not enough body weight. Some people also need time to accept this kind of tuning especially if jumping from their usual thicker mid and upper bass presentation. And very genre dependant too, if your genre have thin mid and upper bass like classic pop / rock, 60s, 70s, you will want more mid and upper bass a little bit. That's why HBB prefer thicker mid and upper bass because of his genre.


Next...

The mid bass focus IEMs tuning
they wont sounded bleed on mid bass, and have thick upper bass and great body weight to the mids that give warmness to mids area. But this kind of tuning usually don't have big rumble or punch with Exception! If the low end driver provides real big air moving like MDR-1000EX, we can still feel the sub bass there. This kind of tuning very popular on 90s, lot of sennheiser and sony IEMs tuning this way. This also similar with Andromeda bass presentation, thick mid and upper bass, with lack of punch and impact, especially if the driver used for low end is BA. Fiio FH9 also have this kind of similar bass tuning, but the FH9 actually have BA drivers to handle mid upper bass and big 13.6mm DD to handle the sub bass. for budget/midfi price IEMs, if you have listen to BQEYZ Spring 1 and 2, they have similar bass tuning also (13mm DD, crossing with BA)



Now this kind of bass tuning
Definitely the Impact and the punch is the best experience, a Basshead bass tuning, but usually, have lot of midbass bleed too. see the 100-150hz area, they already too much there. Fir Audio Xenon 6 have this kind of tuning, the recent 7hz Legato, or Fatfreq Maestro SE and mini (i havent heard this personally).



And then we got the special case tuning, where they are not bleed at all, while having great punch, but also provide warmness because of 300-500hz boost there.
I also personally like this kind of tuning but very rare tuning. 64Audio did great job on this kind of tuning with u12t, the Tia Trio also have approached this way but not as good as u12t while having better punch and impact because the Trio is using DD for the low end.

 

[Barndoor]

Luck is 10% chance, 90% preparation.
So many chances being thrown around, the issue being do you have what it takes to seize that chance?
---
Oh hey, my PR2 finally ship along with many others delayed PR2.
It seems KZ Global got a new batch of PR2

Haha, I cancelled my PR2 order yesterday!
Came to the decision that I didn't really need it.
I tend to pick up a DD over a planar.
After initially being keen on the quartet, am also wondering the same.
Go me, showing unusual amount of constraint!

 

[activatorfly]

I have the Hook-X, the S12, the P1 Max, the Dioko and a couple others.

The Dioko has good resolution and treble extension but it’s basically lifeless. It’s flat in a bad way.

If I had to keep only one planar I’d probably go with the Hook-X, but the S12 is a very close second.

In comparison what is your take on the P1 Max...plus what sources are you using?

 

[o0genesis0o]

As a picky bass person I want to chime in about this "bass bleed".. can't help lol.

I want to share about an illustration, based on my personal experience with lot of IEMs and comparing them with the graph. The danger area of bass bleed is between 100hz and 300 hz territories. Especially on 100hz-150hz area where the mid and upper bass sit there.

I made this triangle of bass bleed (blue triangle) for roughly where the bass tuning shouldn't pass that triangle area for the frequencies. While the yellow rectangle area,
is where we can get great punch or impact from mid and sub bass together. With note, that applied with balancing from around +8db pinna gain on high mids area.

There are a lot of bass tuning style, for examples :

The most common V-style bass tuning, found in so many entry / budget level especially single driver (mostly DDs) because of the natural character of the driver.
As you can see here, this type of tuning have "bass bleed" because they are passing the +5db increment on 100hz, and also on 150hz.
This will be warm on half side (can be bright if the counter balance high area is too boosted of course), but also sounded as "bass bleed" for DDs, for BAs and planars they have better control and minimum "smear" so those 2 types of drivers are more tolerable.

Next we have this kind of tuning :

The clean bass tuning with nice punch,
as you can see, the mid and upper bass still on blue triangle area. This tuning is surely don't have bass bleed, but they have good punch because on 60hz and below, they are reaching similar +db with the pinna gain (quantity of the bass boost can be vary based on personal preferences). This type of tuning need extra driver and crossover to create. So usually this kind of tuning only appears on multi driver IEMs. Personally i like this kind of tuning, Z1R, Monarch MkII, Mest MkI and MkII, EE Odin are using this kind of bass shelf. Depend on implementation, too low 150-300hz area can make mids little bit "thin" or not enough body weight. Some people also need time to accept this kind of tuning especially if jumping from their usual thicker mid and upper bass presentation. And very genre dependant too, if your genre have thin mid and upper bass like classic pop / rock, 60s, 70s, you will want more mid and upper bass a little bit. That's why HBB prefer thicker mid and upper bass because of his genre.


Next...

The mid bass focus IEMs tuning
they wont sounded bleed on mid bass, and have thick upper bass and great body weight to the mids that give warmness to mids area. But this kind of tuning usually don't have big rumble or punch with Exception! If the low end driver provides real big air moving like MDR-1000EX, we can still feel the sub bass there. This kind of tuning very popular on 90s, lot of sennheiser and sony IEMs tuning this way. This also similar with Andromeda bass presentation, thick mid and upper bass, with lack of punch and impact, especially if the driver used for low end is BA. Fiio FH9 also have this kind of similar bass tuning, but the FH9 actually have BA drivers to handle mid upper bass and big 13.6mm DD to handle the sub bass. for budget/midfi price IEMs, if you have listen to BQEYZ Spring 1 and 2, they have similar bass tuning also (13mm DD, crossing with BA)



Now this kind of bass tuning
Definitely the Impact and the punch is the best experience, a Basshead bass tuning, but usually, have lot of midbass bleed too. see the 100-150hz area, they already too much there. Fir Audio Xenon 6 have this kind of tuning, the recent 7hz Legato, or Fatfreq Maestro SE and mini (i havent heard this personally).



And then we got the special case tuning, where they are not bleed at all, while having great punch, but also provide warmness because of 300-500hz boost there.
I also personally like this kind of tuning but very rare tuning. 64Audio did great job on this kind of tuning with u12t, the Tia Trio also have approached this way but not as good as u12t while having better punch and impact because the Trio is using DD for the low end.

Outstanding work, mate! Are you reading my mind? Couldn’t explain better. I need to save this for future reference. Some comments in no particular order:

• The reference bass is yummy
• The FH9 is an oddball due to its driver configuration. It’s tuned like old-school midbass IEM, but it slams.
• Driver configuration plays an important role here. The Andromeda 2020 gets away with the thick 250Hz partially because of the “BA timbre”, making notes cut through the thick “fog” of the lower frequencies.
• You are spot on about the oddball tuning of 64 audio. They always boost mid-midrange and dip 1kHz. When done just right, the sense of space of the stage gets a boost. Overdone (Tia Fourte) and the sound would get weird.

You should do another post about the ear gain

 

[r31ya]

I love your post!

i didn't quite remember where the first time i read that quote,
but shortly after i learn the hard way about it.

Basically got offered some exporting business by my cousin abroad, seems i have the right connection, fumbling around trying to do it, and only ended realizing my current skill depth. Rather than jeopardizing my cousin and other connection business, i gave it to a more experienced aquitances of mine. shame.

Since then, everytime i read a post or article "oh, he is lucky his business works out" or "oh she is lucky that her gig works out",
sometimes i will be like "No mate, he had/learnt the skill needed to make the business chance he stumbled on into profit"

---

Haha, I cancelled my PR2 order yesterday!
Came to the decision that I didn't really need it.
I tend to pick up a DD over a planar.
After initially being keen on the quartet, am also wondering the same.
Go me, showing unusual amount of constraint!

well, technically PR2 is sent faster than ESX i bought from official KZ shop,
ESX from KZ official shop was sent out on the early 14th day (last day before cancellation)
PR2 from KZ Global (third party apparently), was sent out on 12th day.

so yeah its not as long,
and i was going to sell my PR1 Pro, didn't particularly fond of the treble and harshness.
but i decided to wait till my PR2 arrive and compare them before selling one of them.

 

[Redcarmoose]

i didn't quite remember where the first time i read that quote,
but shortly after i learn the hard way about it.

Basically got offered some exporting business by my cousin abroad, seems i have the right connection, fumbling around trying to do it, and only ended realizing my current skill depth. Rather than jeopardizing my cousin and other connection business, i gave it to a more experienced aquitances of mine. shame.

Since then, everytime i read a post or article "oh, he is lucky his business works out" or "oh she is lucky that her gig works out",
sometimes i will be like "No mate, he had/learnt the skill needed to make the business chance he stumbled on into profit"

In my old business the saying was, the harder you work, the luckier you get! I just remembered (again) how to say it.

 

[KokushiTsumo]

Haha, I cancelled my PR2 order yesterday!
Came to the decision that I didn't really need it.
I tend to pick up a DD over a planar.
After initially being keen on the quartet, am also wondering the same.
Go me, showing unusual amount of constraint!

Was thinking of doing the same given the posts here, however mine just shipped as well. Guess KZ delayed the orders that used the discount code.

 

[jmwant]

https://hifigo.com/blogs/news/luxury-precision-launches-w4-w4-ex-flagship-portable-usb-dac-amps


Stunning design and specs!

 

[r31ya]

https://hifigo.com/blogs/news/luxury-precision-launches-w4-w4-ex-flagship-portable-usb-dac-amps


Stunning design and specs!

It has an output power rating of up to 420mW

whoa, i guess when you have the target on your back by every dongle dac, you have to step up your game.

 

[Nimweth]

In my old business the saying was, the harder you work, the luckier you get! I just remembered (again) how to say it.

As Thomas Edison said: "Genius is one per cent inspiration and 99 per cent perspiration."

 

[Redcarmoose]

https://hifigo.com/blogs/news/luxury-precision-launches-w4-w4-ex-flagship-portable-usb-dac-amps


Stunning design and specs!

No W3 or W3Ex?

 

[superuser1]

Wow!
A dongle at $450+ now i have almost seen everything.

 

[Redcarmoose]

Wow!
A dongle at $450+ now i have almost seen everything.

No you haven’t, the case? The case is extra!
https://shop.musicteck.com/products/luxury-precision-w4-w4ex-case

$33.00