[theintention]

Done with this conversation, hopefully my comments don't get deleted but I expect they will. Time to start using my ignore button for users here... shame.

 

[Click]

Done with this conversation, hopefully my comments don't get deleted but I expect they will. Time to start using my ignore button for users here... shame.

You're pretty new here. I've learned (too late) that blocking people is the best course of action to a better head-fi experience. Unless you enjoy getting trolled, spammed, or attacked over and over.

 

[Click]

I haven’t read anyone say anything inappropriate, but let’s be honest, there’s two clear penon promotors on this forum, who are not impartial and have an incentive to push their products.

They really should be labelled as “members of the trade”, to not mislead new-comers into believing they’re something that they’re not.

They don't work for Penon and don't take a financial incentive from them to promote Penon's products, so they don't need to pay a fee to head-fi and be labeled "members of the trade" to keep doing what they're doing. Penon pays that fee themselves to advertise here.

They get paid in free goods, which technically, don't belong to them but it's not like Penon demands those review "samples" back.

It's the same tactic that every company uses on YouTube and review sites. Some companies bribe popular reviewers/YouTubers/influencers with free "review" units and collabs and use people as their marketing department. Check out HBB's latest video for more on that topic.

 

[F700]

Thin skins in here

 

[Vonbuddy]

Because calling people out and attacking users isn't allowed on head-fi? Because mods/admins deem it unacceptable? Because it causes bad vibes and animosity? Because it derails threads, like it is doing now?

You don't have to agree with me, but I'm just sharing my experience and opinions with this issue. If you don't like it, then there are other forums like HFGF that allow people to attack companies, forums, and each other and call everyone out. Maybe try going to those forums instead. I have recently.""

"Calling out" might be the magic words. What constitutes a personal attack? Animosity generally muddles discussion and creates defensiveness. Confrontation isn't bad in and of itself, but the manner is what is regulated. How can you confront an issue with civility? And what do you do if you cannot get satisfaction in the response? A message board or community of participants don't have to agree with each other and that is evident here. But where is the line drawn on personal attacks and reasonable criticism? Good question. What is the difference in stimulating reasonable discussion and using a forum to hurt someone or carry a personal vendetta/agenda? Those are questions I would ask. Stating why I don't like something, or I do like something should never be censored. It gets muddled when we feel very personal about what we perceive as an injustice and make it known in a community. I participate in other community message boards and personal attacks usually get censored. Opinions should never be.

 

[Danx3k]

They don't work for Penon and don't take a financial incentive from them to promote Penon's products, so they don't need to pay a fee to head-fi and be labeled "members of the trade" to keep doing what they're doing. Penon pays that fee themselves to advertise here.

They get paid in free goods, which technically, don't belong to them but it's not like Penon demands those review "samples" back.

Paying someone in currency or paying someone with free gifts, is still paying someone.

They’re not impartial and have an agenda to push penons products.

It’s not a crime to promote products, but don’t pretend to just be another audio enthusiast posting on here. There needs to be transparency.

The fact you clearly know which two posters I was referring to speaks volumes.

 

[Click]

Stating why I don't like something, or I do like something should never be censored.

It didn't get censored. Like I said, go back a few pages when people started calling out @Redcarmoose. Those comments remained. What got deleted was someone saying he needs to keep his post counts up on Penon products to keep freebies rolling in. And another comment or two after that which I didn't get to read.

 

[Vonbuddy]

It didn't get censored. Like I said, go back a few pages when people started calling out @Redcarmoose. Those comments remained. What got deleted was someone saying he needs to keep his post counts up on Penon products to keep freebies rolling in. And another comment or two after that which I didn't get to read.

A comment like that is kind of personal. A general statement about conflict of interest would have been sufficient without names.

 

[Click]

Paying someone in currency or paying someone with free gifts, is still paying someone.

They’re not impartial and have an agenda to push penons products.

It’s not a crime to promote products, but don’t pretend to just be another audio enthusiast posting on here. There needs to be transparency.

The fact you clearly know which two posters I was referring to speaks volumes.

It's a loophole that every company utilizes. Not sure why Penon is any different. Just because they do most of their advertising on head-fi instead of YouTube?

Obviously people know who Penon's "trusted reviewers" are. They get free "samples" way ahead of everyone so they can "review" it and hype things up.

 

[Vonbuddy]

It didn't get censored. Like I said, go back a few pages when people started calling out @Redcarmoose. Those comments remained. What got deleted was someone saying he needs to keep his post counts up on Penon products to keep freebies rolling in. And another comment or two after that which I didn't get to read.

I was making a generalized statement. Not addressing specific situation.

 

[requal]

The only problem has always been that people who have hard-earned money are influenced by people who got something for free and create artificial interest in products. In my opinion, a lot of bad things would never have developed if it weren't for the testers of free samples, for example barrage of new products without any technical value. Reviewers with hundreds of handsets should at least be labeled the same as brand representatives.

 

[ssantan2]

It's a loophole that every company utilizes. Not sure why Penon is any different. Just because they do most of their advertising on head-fi instead of YouTube?

Obviously people know who Penon's "trusted reviewers" are. They get free "samples" way ahead of everyone so they can "review" it and hype things up.

It's one thing to review products you get for free and it's another to blatantly lie about products. Should we not call out the people on tik Tok who say take this supplement and you will be thin in 10 days? I see that as no different than some of these cable reviews. Turn a $100 IEM into a $2000 iem with a cable swap? Naw man, that's a straight up lie.

Not to mention Penon is known for having this site remove negative reviews. There is no excuse for censoring posts calling these actions out imo

EDIT: I do agree there is no need for personal attacks however one of the deleted comments was not a personal attack and the one that was should have been replaced with a comment saying why it was deleted instead of being poofed

 

[Danx3k]

It's one thing to review products you get for free and it's another to blatantly lie about products. Should we not call out the people on tik Tok who say take this supplement and you will be thin in 10 days? I see that as no different than some of these cable reviews. Turn a $100 IEM into a $2000 iem with a cable swap? Naw man, that's a straight up lie.

Not to mention Penon is known for having this site remove negative reviews. There is no excuse for censoring posts calling these actions out imo

Spot on.

 

[Click]

The only problem has always been that people who have hard-earned money are influenced by people who got something for free and create artificial interest in products. In my opinion, a lot of bad things would never have developed if it weren't for the testers of free samples, for example barrage of new products without any technical value. Reviewers with hundreds of handsets should at least be labeled the same as brand representatives.

Do you have the same problem with YouTube reviewers too? Or just the ones on head-fi? Because YouTube reviewers are much worse by comparison but most of them don't get the negative and nasty response.

 

[Kenyon]

Do you have the same problem with YouTube reviewers too? Or just the ones on head-fi? Because YouTube reviewers are much worse by comparison but most of them don't get the negative and nasty response.

They do - they just delete the comments so viewers don't see them ...

Wait - isn't that what's happening here...