[Ace Bee]

In one word: Astounded!!!

I put them in my ears today, and I cannot find almost any flaw in it.... I'm just entranced, and been listening to music with it for 2 hours now, couldn't stop. Tried all my sources, it sings from everything!

My heartiest thanks, @Dsnuts for pushing me to get it. One of the best decisions ever! This is one winner iem for sure!

Surprisingly, this does not have any kind of less bass from a stock 3DT, proving all my worries totally unnecessary...if anything, its bass has more body, thickness, and presence than 3DT, with which I am extremely pleased and content.

Currently I am just lost in this track. The album is brilliant!

 

[kmmbd]

However, the lack of bass slam and rumble do concerns me, as that's one aspect of Zen that I do not want to compromise even a bit. May be Holocene is still not for me...

I am yet to find another IEM in the <$1000 range that has bass quality similar to Zen, and I've gone through the "basshead dreams" like Final E5000 (not as fast as Zen's bass), IMR R2 Aten/Rah/R1 Zenith (lacks the density of Zen's bass), Sony EX800ST (gets too much with vent mod and distorts somewhat in high volumes). Even the Empire Ears LX has much worse bass response (that thing is basically quantity over quality, IMO). Sony IER-Z1R is the true upgrade from Zen's bass, and also has more recessed mids, so you can already see the direction you need to go...

 

[Dsnuts]

Geeze Ace. Seems you like em thats good. They sounded pretty good out of the box.

 

[jmwant]

Topping releases E50 as an upgrade to E30!
https://hifigo.com/blogs/news/toppi...ac-an-upgrade-to-highly-acclaimed-topping-e30

 

[AmericanSpirit]

I am yet to find another IEM in the <$1000 range that has bass quality similar to Zen, and I've gone through the "basshead dreams" like Final E5000 (not as fast as Zen's bass), IMR R2 Aten/Rah/R1 Zenith (lacks the density of Zen's bass), Sony EX800ST (gets too much with vent mod and distorts somewhat in high volumes). Even the Empire Ears LX has much worse bass response (that thing is basically quantity over quality, IMO). Sony IER-Z1R is the true upgrade from Zen's bass, and also has more recessed mids, so you can already see the direction you need to go...

As far as I know IER-Z1R uses LCP diaphragm for the bass DD, which Moondrop Variations also uses, do you happened to come across Variations by any chance?

 

[kmmbd]

As far as I know IER-Z1R uses LCP diaphragm for the bass DD, which Moondrop Variations also uses, do you happened to come across Variations by any chance?

Unfortunately I've not tried that yet but to my knowledge the LCP DD on the Variations isn't too different from the one used on the Moondrop Aria, which I've reviewed and found to have a nice bass response. However it's not even close to Final E5000 in terms of bass texture and such, so I don't think the Variations would perform exceptionally in the bass region vs the likes of Zen etc. let alone the Z1R.

Another thing about the Sony IER-Z1R is the way the drivers are placed inside the housing (check the image below). The housing of the Z1R is exceptionally large due to the inner acoustic cavity where there is a separate resonance chamber behind the DD alongside an acoustic tube that further enhances the sense of "rumble" in the sound (and also makes the decay slightly longer which is unique to the IER-Z1R). If one needs that kind of bass, the other alternative is the Sennheiser IE900 which also uses similar tricks to get a larger-than-life bass response. Dunu Zen, with its ACIS unit on the back of the IEM, also does something similar.

Moondrop variations and other psuedo-custom shell IEMs don't have such sophisticated structure to enhance bass (I haven't seen one yet). It's mostly the venting mechanism and the length/diameter of the tube that they change to increase/decrease bass and thus falls behind the "bass specialists", I'd say. Simply adopting a stiffer diaphragm material with high excursion won't work.

 

[AmericanSpirit]

Unfortunately I've not tried that yet but to my knowledge the LCP DD on the Variations isn't too different from the one used on the Moondrop Aria, which I've reviewed and found to have a nice bass response. However it's not even close to Final E5000 in terms of bass texture and such, so I don't think the Variations would perform exceptionally in the bass region vs the likes of Zen etc. let alone the Z1R.

Another thing about the Sony IER-Z1R is the way the drivers are placed inside the housing (check the image below). The housing of the Z1R is exceptionally large due to the inner acoustic cavity where there is a separate resonance chamber behind the DD alongside an acoustic tube that further enhances the sense of "rumble" in the sound (and also makes the decay slightly longer which is unique to the IER-Z1R). If one needs that kind of bass, the other alternative is the Sennheiser IE900 which also uses similar tricks to get a larger-than-life bass response. Dunu Zen, with its ACIS unit on the back of the IEM, also does something similar.

Moondrop variations and other psuedo-custom shell IEMs don't have such sophisticated structure to enhance bass (I haven't seen one yet). It's mostly the venting mechanism and the length/diameter of the tube that they change to increase/decrease bass and thus falls behind the "bass specialists", I'd say. Simply adopting a stiffer diaphragm material with high excursion won't work.

Thanks!

Actually Aria’s stock tuning is limited due to the acoustic damper filter, so the one on Variations is the one without damper filter, it’s quite different in texture and impulse response. You can remove the iron damper filter of Aria by nail-pin and it will perform better by the way(it will flatten the bass floor though)

 

[kmmbd]

Thanks!

Actually Aria’s stock tuning is limited due to the acoustic damper filter, so the one on Variations is the one without damper filter, it’s quite different in texture and impulse response. You can remove the iron damper filter of Aria by nail-pin and it will perform better by the way(it will flatten the bass floor though)

I guess removing the filter on the Aria would also introduce some resonance peaks in the upper-mid/treble region since those are usually smoothed out by such filters (alongside keeping earwax out etc.). Variations doesn't need that since the bass is already separated by the crossover circuit (so the DD only has bass to deal with, no issue with higher frequency peaks) and the BA/EST drivers have their separate dampers inside the respective sound-tube itself.

 

[Ace Bee]

Geeze Ace. Seems you like em thats good. They sounded pretty good out of the box.

You bet I do, I'm blown away since the first listen!

 

[rodel808]

I am yet to find another IEM in the <$1000 range that has bass quality similar to Zen, and I've gone through the "basshead dreams" like Final E5000 (not as fast as Zen's bass), IMR R2 Aten/Rah/R1 Zenith (lacks the density of Zen's bass), Sony EX800ST (gets too much with vent mod and distorts somewhat in high volumes). Even the Empire Ears LX has much worse bass response (that thing is basically quantity over quality, IMO). Sony IER-Z1R is the true upgrade from Zen's bass, and also has more recessed mids, so you can already see the direction you need to go...

Have you auditioned the Xelento or IMR BC (bass canons)? Would appreciate a comparison to Zen if so.

 

[kmmbd]

Have you auditioned the Xelento or IMR BC (bass canons)? Would appreciate a comparison to Zen if so.

I haven't auditioned the IMR BC but the Xelento I have tried multiple times. The bass on Xelento is slower and the microdynamics are worse. The Xelento also has somewhat of a bass-bloom where the mid-bass thickness somewhat encroaches into the upper-bass and masks over subtle details when there's a fast bassline in a track (or fast double pedal hits).

 

[baskingshark]

I haven't auditioned the IMR BC but the Xelento I have tried multiple times. The bass on Xelento is slower and the microdynamics are worse. The Xelento also has somewhat of a bass-bloom where the mid-bass thickness somewhat encroaches into the upper-bass and masks over subtle details when there's a fast bassline in a track (or fast double pedal hits).

Thanks for the impressions.

So is the Xelento competitive with other upper tier midfi single DD sets in 2021? The industry moves so fast that even a few months can render an IEM obsolete. Sometimes old is gold but some things on the other hand, don't age too well against the cheaper and newer CHIFI evolution.

 

[AmericanSpirit]

I guess removing the filter on the Aria would also introduce some resonance peaks in the upper-mid/treble region since those are usually smoothed out by such filters (alongside keeping earwax out etc.). Variations doesn't need that since the bass is already separated by the crossover circuit (so the DD only has bass to deal with, no issue with higher frequency peaks) and the BA/EST drivers have their separate dampers inside the respective sound-tube itself.

Aria has two layers of damper filter, the iron outer filter, and inner white micro mesh filter. I tried both, removing outer layer and both, when fully removed the resonance peak indeed spikes out, but the outer layer removal actually helped better bass response as well as smoother mid transient response. My guess for the purpose of outer layer was to tame Aria to Moondrop’s harman curve target, but it came with a cost in degrading the tonality.

If you felt the mid range of Aria is too scooped, removing outer is a good and easy mod

 

[kmmbd]

So is the Xelento competitive with other upper tier midfi single DD sets in 2021? The industry moves so fast that even a few months can render an IEM obsolete. Sometimes old is gold but some things on the other hand, don't age too well against the cheaper and newer CHIFI evolution.

IMO, the Xelento is still superior to the Fiio FD5/Final E5000 (overall resolution is better on Xelento but I love the bass on E5000 when paired with the right source). The likes of Dunu Zen, Moondrop Illumination, however, are superior IEMs in 2021. I am also looking forward to the upcoming Dunu Falcon C and would like to see how a mid-tier IEM can compete with the good ol' Xelento.

 

[ericp10]

Ditto that. The Fiio FD5 for example didn't excel in... anything at all. The bass wasn't the best in the price bracket, nor the mids/treble, neither the technicalities e.g. resolved detail/imaging/staging (staging was wide but lacked depth).

I really hope that they come up with a better tuning this time and at least excel in one category. The driver is a pure Be foil after all, loads of potential.

I actually like the FH5s over the FD5. But as Ds have stated here many times, you have to put the right cable (pure copper) on it and find the right ear tips. After over 100 hours of burn-in, the FH5s perform mightly!