[hakuzen]

Thanks!


Does the positive and ground on single ended apply for the 4 core version of the wire 175? Or it doesn't because of the stranding technique used by electro acousti? Thanks!

yes, it applies to 175. 4 cores, you have to use one material for positive, another material for negative(balanced)/ground(single-ended).
anyways, cable 175, 4 or 8 cores, will be your best one surely

 

[MadDane]

Sorry, wrong thread moved to the
Low end. Cheap. Generic. Otherwise bang for buck cable thread!
.

 

[Slater]

Sorry, wrong thread moved to the
Low end. Cheap. Generic. Otherwise bang for buck cable thread!
.

Speaking of which, that thread is slowly turning into $100-$200 cables lol. Which is not low end, cheap, or generic

 

[1Q84]

yes, it applies to 175. 4 cores, you have to use one material for positive, another material for negative(balanced)/ground(single-ended).
anyways, cable 175, 4 or 8 cores, will be your best one surely

So does this mean that the 8 cores is more "flexible" soundwise since with the 4 core you have a tendency to have more bass or treble depending on which one is the positive and the ground, while the 8 core is more balanced, right? Its because I only use single ended most of the time for portability. Thanks!

 

[hakuzen]

Speaking of which, that thread is slowly turning into $100-$200 cables lol. Which is not low end, cheap, or generic

"otherwise bang for buck cable"
if price of a typical priced >$300 cable in boutique shop, is found around $150, it's bang for buck. it doesn't hurt

So does this mean that the 8 cores is more "flexible" soundwise since with the 4 core you have a tendency to have more bass or treble depending on which one is the positive and the ground, while the 8 core is more balanced, right? Its because I only use single ended most of the time for portability. Thanks!

the 8 cores cable uses both materials for every contact/signal, so fully mixed.
if you use 4 cores, and single-ended jack, i guess the wire used in positive would be the main wire. but a head-fier mixed AuAg wire (positive) with cardas 23awg copper (ground, single-ended), and he noticed a big difference (larger bass notes) compared to only AuAg wire

 

[superuser1]

POV

 

[warriorpoet]

"otherwise bang for buck cable"
if price of a typical priced >$300 cable in boutique shop, is found around $150, it's bang for buck. it doesn't hurt


the 8 cires cable uses both materials for every contact/signal, so fully mixed.
if you use 4 cores, and single-ended jack, i guess the wire used in positive would be the main wire. but a head-fier mixed AuAg wire (positive) with cardas 23awg copper (ground, single-ended), and he noticed a big difference (larger bass notes) compared to only AuAg wire

Your first point is absolutely well taken. I get performance out of my Gu.Craftsman and the incredibly built Electro Acousti cables that rivals any high $ cable. They're PHENOMENAL bargains.

On your second point, we're talking about electrical circuits here, so conductivity will be an average of positive and negative signals. That means it's accurate to say the performance of a mixed 4 core is the rough average of both.

 

[hakuzen]

Your first point is absolutely well taken. I get performance out of my Gu.Craftsman and the incredibly built Electro Acousti cables that rivals any high $ cable. They're PHENOMENAL bargains.

On your second point, we're talking about electrical circuits here, so conductivity will be an average of positive and negative signals. That means it's accurate to say the performance of a mixed 4 core is the rough average of both.

in the case of balanced jack (plugged in a balanced in output) i guess the result is very similar, if not identical, to fully mixed (for every contact) 8 cores wire.
in the case of single-ended output, only positive signal carries the sound (low, mids, and high frequencies), so i guess that the result could be a bit different. i haven't checked this, but i know a head-fier who has stated that material which carries ground signal also matters, and the effect is very considerable.

 

[Slater]

"otherwise bang for buck cable"
if price of a typical priced >$300 cable in boutique shop, is found around $150, it's bang for buck. it doesn't hurt

Oh, don’t get me wrong. I’m not saying it’s a bad thing.

I was only pointing out that the journey started with $5-$10 KZ and very entry level cables, and over the course of 1-2 years moved up to nicer and nicer and more expensive and more expensive cables.

It was the natural progression of things though. More expensive cables are built nicer, have better quality copper, better plugs, better solder joints, etc. And as you pointed out, they offer a lot of bang for the buck.

My original comment was meant as nothing more than simply an observation. No offense was intended

 

[hakuzen]

Oh, don’t get me wrong. I’m not saying it’s a bad thing.

I was only pointing out that the journey started with $5-$10 KZ and very entry level cables, and over the course of 1-2 years movies up to nicer and more expensive cables.

It was the natural progression of things though. More expensive cables are built nicer, have better quality copper, better plugs, better solder joints, etc. And as you pointed out, they offer a lot of bang for the buck.

My original comment was meant as nothing more than simply an observation. No offense was intended

Your observation has made me stop for a while and take a look at my journey. I was a non-believer in cables and started with $5-$10 cables, who could realize I'd end trying $200 cables? not me, lol.
I also started with $5 kz iems, xiaomi piston 3, vivo xe800.. and ended with moondrop blessing and pointing to qdc anole vx.. from takstar pro 80 to hifiman ananda, from topping nx1a to thx 789..
Once you taste better sound quality, it's difficult to stop, it's natural progression of things, like you say.. and natural progression of wallet run out as well.

 

[superuser1]

Your observation has made me stop for a while and take a look at my journey. I was a non-believer in cables and started with $5-$10 cables, who could realize I'd end trying $200 cables? not me, lol.
I also started with $5 kz iems, xiaomi piston 3, vivo xe800.. and ended with moondrop blessing and pointing to qdc anole vx.. from takstar pro 80 to hifiman ananda, from topping nx1a to thx 789..
Once you taste better sound quality, it's difficult to stop, it's natural progression of things, like you say.. and natural progression of wallet run out as well.

This has happened with most of us... alone vx is still far

 

[hakuzen]

Added measurements of standard length cables 175 (easier to compare with other cables). 2.5mm jack, MMCX, and 4.4mm jack + MMCX.

175. tw upocc AgAu+copper litz 8c (silv/cop,eagle,MV):
195/188/166..163/176/167..161/161/166..173/186/163 mΩ..[35.7/33.7/35g]..137/144/160..138/137/145 pF..[137/140/140cm]
139/138..142/137..136/134..144/134 mΩ..[28/32.4g]..118/128-119/136 pF..[113cm] 2.5/4.4mm



Added new custom 2.5mm TRRS balanced to 3.5mm TRS single-ended, and to 4.4mm TRRRS balanced, adapter cables, from electro acousti store (https://www.aliexpress.com/store/5003206).
They can be found at my list of jack adapters: jack adapters (measurements, pics, and links)

62. tw upocc AgAu+copper litz 8c eagle.......................18.6/20.1...17.4/17.8...17.7/15.8...16.2/14.3
......tw upocc AgAu+copper litz 8c eagle 2.5-4.4...........18.2/18.4...16.9/17...15.5/19.1...15.4/17
custom adapter from https://www.aliexpress.com/store/5003206, using same wires than cable 175.
7.5cm (not counting plugs). neotech (taiwan) up-occ silver 99%+ gold 1% alloy, and frozen 7n up-occ copper litz (best silver and copper wires in my stock, imo).
8 cores of 28awg, 25AWG/signal.
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/33046978735.html
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/33008255130.html
very high quality plugs (eagle, rhodium plated over gold plated beryllium copper):
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1000007394708.html
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1000007901246.html
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1000007708309.html

 

[progdvd]

custom cable 175 is now in stock version: https://www.aliexpress.com/item/4000158772005.html (4/8 cores)

Please, what's the difference between 4 and 8 core Soundwise?

 

[hakuzen]

Please, what's the difference between 4 and 8 core Soundwise?

The main difference between 4 and 8 identical cores is resistance.
You get near half resistance (double conductivity) with 8 cores. Total section of that cable per signal is 28AWG (4 cores) and 25AWG (8 cores). 135mΩ (8 cores) vs 255mΩ (8 cores).
Guess there is no need to explain why lower resistance is much preferable (read the introduction at my list).
You should always keep output impedance (source + cable) the lowest possible as a norm, for electrical damping, efficiency and lower attenuation, etc.
It can be very important when dealing with IEMs equipped with balanced armatures, and/or low impedance. Of course, if your source output impedance is much higher than the difference of resistance between cables, 4 vs 8 cores becomes irrelevant for this purpose.

Other than this, you shouldn't notice much sound difference. I think you preserve better fuller bass with 8 cores version, but it could be bias; very slight difference, anyway.

Another thing to consider in this case, is you can mix both wire materials for each contact/signal (full mix) in 8 cores version. While in 4 cores version, positive signals will use one material, and negative (balanced) or ground (single-ended) the other. I don't think there will be audible differences between 8 cores and 4 cores version, if balanced. Guess differences when single-ended should be more noticeable, but haven't tested this yet.

I'd say, if you decide to invest in such quality cable, go for 8 cores if you can afford it, and forget future doubts. You'll get top notch cable for long, ultra versatile thanks to lower resistance, best wires combination, and usability with many IEMs and headphones thanks to adapters.
But you also can decide to invest less money with 4 cores version. It will be surely your best cable anyways, and you'll get the pleasure to taste this excellent cable.

 

[progdvd]

The main difference between 4 and 8 identical cores is resistance.
You get near half resistance (double conductivity) with 8 cores. Total section of that cable per signal is 28AWG (4 cores) and 25AWG (8 cores). 135mΩ (8 cores) vs 255mΩ (8 cores).
Guess there is no need to explain why lower resistance is much preferable (read the introduction at my list).
You should always keep output impedance (source + cable) the lowest possible as a norm, for electrical damping, efficiency and lower attenuation, etc.
It can be very important when dealing with IEMs equipped with balanced armatures, and/or low impedance. Of course, if your source output impedance is much higher than the difference of resistance between cables, 4 vs 8 cores becomes irrelevant for this purpose.

Other than this, you shouldn't notice much sound difference. I think you preserve better fuller bass with 8 cores version, but it could be bias; very slight difference, anyway.

Another thing to consider in this case, is you can mix both wire materials for each contact/signal (full mix) in 8 cores version. While in 4 cores version, positive signals will use one material, and negative (balanced) or ground (single-ended) the other. I don't think there will be audible differences between 8 cores and 4 cores version, if balanced. Guess differences when single-ended should be more noticeable, but haven't tested this yet.

I'd say, if you decide to invest in such quality cable, go for 8 cores if you can afford it, and forget future doubts. You'll get top notch cable for long, ultra versatile thanks to lower resistance, best wires combination, and usability with many IEMs and headphones thanks to adapters.
But you also can decide to invest less money with 4 cores version. It will be surely your best cable anyways, and you'll get the pleasure to taste this excellent cable.

Thank you for your time and effort!!! This is incredible I appreciate it very much!!!
Just like you said to awoid future what ifs, I'll definitely take 8 core one and be done with it, but I'll have to gather some funds first, for it and a nice DAP as well.
Cheers