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Mad Lust Envy's Headphone Gaming Guide: (12/10/2019: Schiit Gaming Dac/Amps 'Hel' and 'Fulla 3' added)

Discussion in 'Video Games Discussion' started by mad lust envy, Jan 17, 2011.
  1. ronfifer
    Some reviews claim that SXFI is not good for competitive gaming, while it expands the soundstage, it blurs imaging and distorts the sense of direction of sounds. Any evidence that counters these reviews? I don't yet understand the SXFI hype for FPS games.
     
  2. Nemmera
    The thing with competitive FPS gaming is that a huge soundstage is less important than accurate imaging and the ability to detect approaching enemies. I know I've written it before in this thread, but that's a reason I can't really use my K712pro for PUBG. The soundstage is HUGE (even in pure Stereo), but it makes the sound very "left/right" in it's presentation - which makes for worse imaging. Maybe some VSS tricks may be able to counteract this, but so far I've found pure Stereo to be preferrable for FPS.

    Good VSS is awesome for immersive single player experiences, movies/series etc though!
     
    ronfifer likes this.
  3. greyforest
    I think the claim is legit, I haven’t tried sxfi but i have tried wavesnx möbius. While the vss makes the immersive experience much better than any other solutions it does decreases resolution of the sound by quite a margin. Besides that many game is developed with only stereo sound processing, i compared same movie with 2.1 and 7.1 output throughout ae-5’s digital mix vss for headphone. Drastically different performance, 7.1 source is much better. In short 7.1 source transform into better vss effects.

    Competitive gamer utilize sound different from usual players, they don’t need realistic sound, but only ‘sound clues’, therefore the muddier the mix is the worse it is for competitive plays.
     
    ronfifer likes this.
  4. ronfifer
    In this post, MLE is quoted to say SXFI is best for positional accuracy. So far the reviews claim the opposite: inflated soundstage but blurred imaging and distorted sense of direction when SXFI is turned on. Any fps gamers who experienced SXFI here?
     
  5. halcyon
    Has anybody tried the Nahimic 3D sound and compared it to Sennheiser GSX or SoundBlaster G6 / X7 ? Esp, in terms of positional accuracy and esp. front/back localization, which is the weak point of almost all 3D HRTFs.
     
  6. halcyon
    I had Mobius and for me the wavesNX was not nearly as good as SBX Pro or Sennheiser GXS for 5.1/7.1 real multichannel input to Stereo VSS 3D positional accuracy (in FPS games).

    That's why I sold mine (and other reasons, incl. crap support from Audeze).
     
  7. Nemmera
    I still find the Mobius to be insanely good for positional accuracy in pure stereo, beats any combination of DT770/GSP600/K712pro/HD700 connected to NuAudio/GSX1000/XonarEssence. Sure, there is an audible hiss when they are quiet. They get hot. They push on the ears slightly (even with gel pads). Don't get me wrong, I find both GSX and SBX to be better at VSS... Just talking positional audio and imaging for FPS here. :)

    No idea how good/bad their support is. Their software/driver design leaves something to be desired, but I'm guessing they have a limited team for it.
     
  8. Mad Lust Envy Contributor
    Even if details are blurred, being able to tell something is coming from 2 o clock or 5 o clock, etc, is much more important than how defined those sounds are. What good is all the resolution in the world if i can't tell something is 5 o clock behind me just from sound alone? For me, being able to place it in an obvious direction trumps absolutely everything else. I don't care if it's not as clean. Hence why SXFI, DH to me are better than SBX and CMSS-3D



    This is why I say things like, I'll take a cheap pair of KSC75s with Dolby Headphone through an Asus Xonar U3, over an HD800 in stereo from a $5000 dac/amp.

    The moment I know something/ANYTHING is behind me in a direction, I can just look there and see it. While with the best headphones ever in stereo, I'd have to take a moment to understand if something is in front or behind me and THEN move towards that sound. Doesn't matter how clear it is. I could care less in comparison.
     
    Last edited: Nov 25, 2019
  9. WhiteHartMart
    So is there a Creative G3 around the corner. There is a coming soon console specific device on the Creative websites, codenamed 'Project Auris'. The iOS SoundBlaster Command app has just got an update to receive G3 support and in the following video there is a device connected to a PS4 and on the back, around 39 seconds in, it looks like it has the G3 name near the top?



    Perhaps another SXFI device, with access to equaliser settings etc (and maybe voice/game sound balance? for PS4??
     
    tmaxx123 likes this.
  10. tmaxx123
    Looks like our x7 with sparkos are still king of the hill then. G3 looks puny haha
     
    WhiteHartMart likes this.
  11. Mad Lust Envy Contributor
    The other day, I told a Creative rep that my community is really interested in an X7 successor that has SXFI. Fingers crossed.
     
    Last edited: Nov 25, 2019
    Vader2k, WhiteHartMart and tmaxx123 like this.
  12. ronfifer
    Reading the marketing material on the X3 official page, they promote it as a cinematic device to create immersion in movies, Creative does not try to promote SXFI as a feature that gives an edge to competitive gamers, like they did when promoting the G6, though they do mention immersion in gaming for the SXFI. Nothing about directional accuracy.

    So which one shall i buy now to pair with my Ad900x and K702: G6 with dolby Headphone and Prostudio or X3 with SXFI?
     
    halcyon likes this.
  13. halcyon
    Positional accuracy for stereo is pretty much meaningless, imho, unless one is palying left-to-right scrolling 2D games. Stereo only contains left/right position and IF game engine calculates it, distance and reverbation.

    The whole point of VSS is to get the discrete 7.1 sound probably via HRTF into a surround-like experience, where front/back localization is retained. Hopefully in the future, this will include audio-tracing the soundwaves in the game geometry.

    That is the *ONLY* way to retain proper positional accuracy, beyond mere left/right panning.

    Of course, if the game-engine (Like Overwatch) has it's bult in VSS (Dolby Atmos), then a stereo only headset/soundcard will do fine, but it is still Discret multi-channel via VSS algo (game engine provide) into a stereo headphone.

    But in the end, we are comparing the actual algorithms (WavesNX, Dolby Atmos, SBX Pro, Sennheiser GSX algo, Nahimic 3D, etc) against each other, regardless of the headphone itself (yes, the headphone does affect this, but it can only decrease the quality of the positioning that the VSS algo gives out).

    And running VSS from a stereo input (2-channel discrete) makes no sense for game positional accuracy, it just mucks everything up.
     
  14. halcyon
    Sold my X7 and my Sparkos. GSX is my current go-to, it's better (imho) for positional accuracy AND it has lower audio latency compared to X7 (you actually hear the sounds earlier with GSX than with X7). Yes, the headphone amplifier is limited and there is limited set of settings on the soundcard itself, so yes, I hope that Creative comes out with a better SXFI Amp that has a better headphone Amp, better positional accuracy, better manual tuning of the algo and lower latency.

    Hope spring eternal :-D
     
  15. WhiteHartMart
    I wish - the G3 is just a glorified USB dongle so not getting hopes up about that one - Creative call it 'console focused' - just looks a dumbed down device to me.

    Hoping for a decent X7 Black Friday deal if I'm honest. Have the G6 on PS4 but fed up of the volume so sensitive on first start up and also having to move the device to an ancient laptop of mine every time I want to change the settings. Lack of a Mac or mobile app on that one a real let down imho.

    I'd happily switch to a X7 just for the chance to change some settings from my mobile on the fly. If there was the chance of a X7 replacement imminently though, I'd wait but reckon it'll be last next year if at all imho.
     

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