iTui
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May I ask your suggestion for a set of balanced cables connecting between C.E.C TL51XR and WA22? My cans are HD800 and L3000. Thanks in advance for your comments.
Woo Audio Amp Owner Unite
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Covenant
Headphoneus Supremus
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Quote:
Hi DarKu, I had difficulty getting conclusive answers to this one as well, as few people seem to have compared upgraded units to the stock units. Takezo has a WA6 with Blackgates and a stock WA6SE though (or was that the other way around?), and he informed me that most of the difference was in the tone of the units. If you PM him you might get some more info.
Quote:
All the driver tubes for the WA6SE are cheap, which is a plus. There don't seem to be any truly "premium" drive tube options, so just buy a few different brands/types and find the set you like.
Quote:
Sorry to hear that Outdoor
Quote:
I asked Jack Woo about the EML tubes at one stage, and he recommended the EML 5U4G instead:
5U4G Data sheet. Emission Labs.
Quote:
I'd be very interested in this reply, please post it when you get it
Quote:
iTui, that shot of the WA22 is beautiful. Congrats!
Regarding interconnects, I found that OCC copper tends to match my tastes the most. SPC can sound nice too, if you like a slightly brighter, more detailed type of sound. If you go with SPC, I'd contact APureSound and source some balanced IC's from them. For OCC, there are several companies around. All my OCC cables were done by Qusp of Twisted Cables, who I'm sure could tailor some XLR IC's to suit your needs.
| Originally Posted by DarKu /img/forum/go_quote.gif Hello WooAudio Gurus!
Did some of you listened the Woo6SE stock and 6SE with "premium parts upgrade package" ? It is a big difference between them or it is just some hype behind the Black Gates?? |
Hi DarKu, I had difficulty getting conclusive answers to this one as well, as few people seem to have compared upgraded units to the stock units. Takezo has a WA6 with Blackgates and a stock WA6SE though (or was that the other way around?), and he informed me that most of the difference was in the tone of the units. If you PM him you might get some more info.
Quote:
| Do i need better drive/power tubes too others than stock ones ? Thank you |
All the driver tubes for the WA6SE are cheap, which is a plus. There don't seem to be any truly "premium" drive tube options, so just buy a few different brands/types and find the set you like.
Quote:
| Originally Posted by OutdoorXplorer /img/forum/go_quote.gif My Sophia Princess finally RIP today. It lasted approx 500+ hours from the date I took possession since mid May 2009. I and surprised of its short lifespan. Wonder whether Jack will provide a replacement. |
Sorry to hear that Outdoor
Quote:
| Originally Posted by dannie01 /img/forum/go_quote.gif EDIT. One more option, the EML 274B Mesh from JAC MUSIC, Euro148 + shipping, email them for a quotation and you'll have it with shipping cost included. Learned that from a thread somewhere around saying that the sound of the EML 274B Mesh is even better than the Sophia (not sure, never try before and this is the one that I was targeted to my 6SE) but of course price higher. |
I asked Jack Woo about the EML tubes at one stage, and he recommended the EML 5U4G instead:
5U4G Data sheet. Emission Labs.
Quote:
| Originally Posted by OutdoorXplorer /img/forum/go_quote.gif I just sent an email to Richard of Sophia Electric inquiring whether it is normal for the tube to turned smokey after some time and at the same time asking about the purchase. Let see what he replies. |
I'd be very interested in this reply, please post it when you get it
Quote:
| Originally Posted by iTui /img/forum/go_quote.gif May I ask your suggestion for a set of balanced cables connecting between C.E.C TL51XR and WA22? My cans are HD800 and L3000. Thanks in advance for your comments. |
iTui, that shot of the WA22 is beautiful. Congrats!
Regarding interconnects, I found that OCC copper tends to match my tastes the most. SPC can sound nice too, if you like a slightly brighter, more detailed type of sound. If you go with SPC, I'd contact APureSound and source some balanced IC's from them. For OCC, there are several companies around. All my OCC cables were done by Qusp of Twisted Cables, who I'm sure could tailor some XLR IC's to suit your needs.
takezo
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Quote:
from my experiences, the biggest differences in sound comes from the blackgate
upgrades in the following positions: a) the cathode plate cap and b) the
cathode bypass cap. it influences the tonal characteristics and
soundstage imaging as much as the input stage coupling caps like v-cap.
the input stage coupling caps influences the timbre, speed and transparency
just as much. (the wa6SE doesn't utilize input coupling caps but the resistor
in the signal path is critical in tonal characteristics. carbon types offer a
warm and euphonic tone, whereas the film metal types offer a more cool
neutral tone with slightly harder edges at the top.)
the blackgate upgrades in the power filtering stages are marginal in
improvement of providing a black background. even the stock
filters wooaudio uses is adequate. the panasonic ts-ed filtering caps
are exceptional and on par with the blackgates at 1/4 the price.
i'd recommend the 6de7/6cy7 for rock and pop. the 6sn7 and 6dn7 for
classical, vocal and small ensemble jazz. wooaudio now carries the adapter
for the 6sn7/6dn7. （this works for the wa6. for the wa6SE the adapter
needs a 1.4k resistor in the path of pin 9 to raise the cathode impedance
from 3.3k to 4.7k ohms. i don't think wooaudio has experimented with the SE, yet)
| Originally Posted by DarKu /img/forum/go_quote.gif Hello WooAudio Gurus!
Did some of you listened the Woo6SE stock and 6SE with "premium parts upgrade package" ? It is a big difference between them or it is just some hype behind the Black Gates?? 6SE it is pricey for me, but with premium parts it's already an expensive amp. I thinking about a new amp and this one draws my attention the most ( the second on the list is an GS-1) Do you think an 6SE with Sophia will do the job? Do i need better drive/power tubes too others than stock ones ? Thank you |
from my experiences, the biggest differences in sound comes from the blackgate
upgrades in the following positions: a) the cathode plate cap and b) the
cathode bypass cap. it influences the tonal characteristics and
soundstage imaging as much as the input stage coupling caps like v-cap.
the input stage coupling caps influences the timbre, speed and transparency
just as much. (the wa6SE doesn't utilize input coupling caps but the resistor
in the signal path is critical in tonal characteristics. carbon types offer a
warm and euphonic tone, whereas the film metal types offer a more cool
neutral tone with slightly harder edges at the top.)
the blackgate upgrades in the power filtering stages are marginal in
improvement of providing a black background. even the stock
filters wooaudio uses is adequate. the panasonic ts-ed filtering caps
are exceptional and on par with the blackgates at 1/4 the price.
i'd recommend the 6de7/6cy7 for rock and pop. the 6sn7 and 6dn7 for
classical, vocal and small ensemble jazz. wooaudio now carries the adapter
for the 6sn7/6dn7. （this works for the wa6. for the wa6SE the adapter
needs a 1.4k resistor in the path of pin 9 to raise the cathode impedance
from 3.3k to 4.7k ohms. i don't think wooaudio has experimented with the SE, yet)
CandlePower
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Quote:
Wow, that tube-life seems way to short.
Here's some stuff I found on Tubes at: http://www.vacuumtubes.net/How_Vacuum_Tubes_Work.htm
3) Lifetime of cathodes: The lifetime of a tube is determined by the lifetime of its cathode emission. And the life of the of a cathode is dependent on the cathode temperature, the degree of vacuum in the tube, and purity of the materials in the cathode.
Tube life is sharply dependent on temperature, which means that it is dependent on filament or heater operating voltage. Operate the heater/filament too hot, and the tube will give a shortened life. Operate it too cool and life may be shortened (especially in thoriated filaments, which depend on replenishment of thorium by diffusion from within the filament wire). A few researchers have observed that the lifetime of an oxide-cathode tube can be greatly increased by operating its heater at 20% below the rated voltage. This USUALLY has very little effect on the cathode's electron emission, and might be worth experimenting with if the user wishes to increase the lifetime of a small-signal tube. (Low heater voltage is NOT recommended for power tubes, as the tube may not give the rated power output.) Operating the heater at a very low voltage has been observed to linearize some tube types-- we have not been able to verify this, so it may be another worthy experiment for an OEM or sophisticated experimenter. The average end-user is advised to use the rated heater or filament voltage--experimentation is not recommended unless the user is an experienced technician.
Oxide cathodes tend to give shorter lifetimes than thoriated filaments. Purity of materials is a big issue in making long-lived oxide cathodes--some impurities, such as silicates in the nickel tube, will cause the cathode to lose emission prematurely and "wear out". Low-cost tubes of inferior quality often wear out faster than better-quality tubes of the same type, due to impure cathodes.
Small-signal tubes almost always use oxide cathodes. Good-quality tubes of this type, if operated well within their ratings and at the correct heater voltage, can last 100,000 hours or more.
The world record for lifetime of a power tube is held by a large transmitting tetrode with a thoriated filament. It was in service in a Los Angeles radio station's transmitter for 10 years, for a total of more than 80,000 hours. When finally taken out of service, it was still functioning adequately. (The station saved it as a spare.) By comparison, a typical oxide-cathode glass power tube, such as an EL34, will last about 1500-2000 hours; and a tube with an oxide-coated filament, such as an SV300B, will last about 4000-10,000 hours. This is dependent on all the factors listed above, so different customers will observe different lifetimes.
| Originally Posted by OutdoorXplorer /img/forum/go_quote.gif My Sophia Princess finally RIP today. It lasted approx 500+ hours from the date I took possession since mid May 2009. I and surprised of its short lifespan. Wonder whether Jack will provide a replacement. |
Wow, that tube-life seems way to short.
Here's some stuff I found on Tubes at: http://www.vacuumtubes.net/How_Vacuum_Tubes_Work.htm
3) Lifetime of cathodes: The lifetime of a tube is determined by the lifetime of its cathode emission. And the life of the of a cathode is dependent on the cathode temperature, the degree of vacuum in the tube, and purity of the materials in the cathode.
Tube life is sharply dependent on temperature, which means that it is dependent on filament or heater operating voltage. Operate the heater/filament too hot, and the tube will give a shortened life. Operate it too cool and life may be shortened (especially in thoriated filaments, which depend on replenishment of thorium by diffusion from within the filament wire). A few researchers have observed that the lifetime of an oxide-cathode tube can be greatly increased by operating its heater at 20% below the rated voltage. This USUALLY has very little effect on the cathode's electron emission, and might be worth experimenting with if the user wishes to increase the lifetime of a small-signal tube. (Low heater voltage is NOT recommended for power tubes, as the tube may not give the rated power output.) Operating the heater at a very low voltage has been observed to linearize some tube types-- we have not been able to verify this, so it may be another worthy experiment for an OEM or sophisticated experimenter. The average end-user is advised to use the rated heater or filament voltage--experimentation is not recommended unless the user is an experienced technician.
Oxide cathodes tend to give shorter lifetimes than thoriated filaments. Purity of materials is a big issue in making long-lived oxide cathodes--some impurities, such as silicates in the nickel tube, will cause the cathode to lose emission prematurely and "wear out". Low-cost tubes of inferior quality often wear out faster than better-quality tubes of the same type, due to impure cathodes.
Small-signal tubes almost always use oxide cathodes. Good-quality tubes of this type, if operated well within their ratings and at the correct heater voltage, can last 100,000 hours or more.
The world record for lifetime of a power tube is held by a large transmitting tetrode with a thoriated filament. It was in service in a Los Angeles radio station's transmitter for 10 years, for a total of more than 80,000 hours. When finally taken out of service, it was still functioning adequately. (The station saved it as a spare.) By comparison, a typical oxide-cathode glass power tube, such as an EL34, will last about 1500-2000 hours; and a tube with an oxide-coated filament, such as an SV300B, will last about 4000-10,000 hours. This is dependent on all the factors listed above, so different customers will observe different lifetimes.
DarKu
Reviewer at Soundnews
Covenant and takezo thank you very much!
When I will have the money I will order an stock WA6SE with Sophia
and maybe will mod it by myself, too bad Blackgates are hard to find..
I never heard a tube amp, but the Havana was a big surprise for me, so I can't go wrong with the Woo's
When I will have the money I will order an stock WA6SE with Sophia
I never heard a tube amp, but the Havana was a big surprise for me, so I can't go wrong with the Woo's
iTui
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Covenant, thank you so much for your suggestion. I may go for OCC, but still need more opinion.
OutdoorXplorer
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I have tried contacting Jack of Woo Audio and JacMusic but no reply from both of them. A quotation is received from Sophia Electric for a Princess with 12 months warranty. I am running the amp with my spare Princess and undecisive to purchase a EML 274B or another Princess as the first experience wasn't favorable due to the short lifespan. Both options cost the same except delivery time as EML takes 2 to 3 weeks to ship where else SP is within a week.
I am hoping someone to help in deciding which rectifier tube to go for.
I am hoping someone to help in deciding which rectifier tube to go for.
dannie01
Headphoneus Supremus
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Covenant said
"I asked Jack Woo about the EML tubes at one stage, and he recommended the EML 5U4G instead:
5U4G Data sheet. Emission Labs
"I asked Jack Woo about the EML tubes at one stage, and he recommended the EML 5U4G instead:
5U4G Data sheet. Emission Labs
Wow only 500 hours? Is that normal or did you just have a defect maybe?
Johnny Moondog
100+ Head-Fier
Hello to everyone!
I want to jump on board the good ship Woo Audio very soon, so thought I would start right here.
I recently discovered Woo Audio from reading the Steve Hoffman Music Forums. I want to use the upcoming Beatles Remasters as an excuse to upgrade my headphone gear. Currently using Etymotic ER-4S/ER-4P headphones and HeadRoom Ultra Micro Amp.
I read that Steve Hoffman uses the Sennheiser HD-600/Woo Audio 6, and when I inquired via private message he highly recommend all things Woo! I've seen a lot of other people talking about that particular combination here in these forums, along with variations that include the HD-650, HD-800, (other great headphones), WA2, WA6 SE, WA22.
So now the Newbie questions:
Having noticed the HD-600/WA6 as a popular combination, are there other combos that have become popular with Woo Audio owners?
Is it generally true that one would most likely be happier (and lighter in cash
) with each step along the Woo Audio product line ... WA6 ... WA2 ... WA6 SE ... WA22 ... WA5 LE ... and the WES Gulp?
Could you safely recommend to someone new "just spend what you can afford, borrow, or steal" and then search for the matching headphones of your choice?
Hit me with your best shot...
And thanks!
I want to jump on board the good ship Woo Audio very soon, so thought I would start right here.
I recently discovered Woo Audio from reading the Steve Hoffman Music Forums. I want to use the upcoming Beatles Remasters as an excuse to upgrade my headphone gear. Currently using Etymotic ER-4S/ER-4P headphones and HeadRoom Ultra Micro Amp.
I read that Steve Hoffman uses the Sennheiser HD-600/Woo Audio 6, and when I inquired via private message he highly recommend all things Woo! I've seen a lot of other people talking about that particular combination here in these forums, along with variations that include the HD-650, HD-800, (other great headphones), WA2, WA6 SE, WA22.
So now the Newbie questions:
Having noticed the HD-600/WA6 as a popular combination, are there other combos that have become popular with Woo Audio owners?
Is it generally true that one would most likely be happier (and lighter in cash
Could you safely recommend to someone new "just spend what you can afford, borrow, or steal" and then search for the matching headphones of your choice?
Hit me with your best shot...
And thanks!
Covenant
Headphoneus Supremus
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Quote:
Jack stocks the EML tubes as well, although I didn't confirm with him that he'll forward on the 1 year EML warranty. I'd double check that before buying, but it gives you an option to get one now if you decide to go that route.
I also asked Takezo of his oppinion of the EML Vs Sophia, hope you dont mind me reposting it here:
Quote:
Note that this is for the EML 274B though. I'm not sure if there'd be any sonic difference between this and a 5U4G.
| Originally Posted by OutdoorXplorer /img/forum/go_quote.gif Both options cost the same except delivery time as EML takes 2 to 3 weeks to ship where else SP is within a week. I am hoping someone to help in deciding which rectifier tube to go for. |
Jack stocks the EML tubes as well, although I didn't confirm with him that he'll forward on the 1 year EML warranty. I'd double check that before buying, but it gives you an option to get one now if you decide to go that route.
I also asked Takezo of his oppinion of the EML Vs Sophia, hope you dont mind me reposting it here:
Quote:
| i like the eml 274b as much as the sophia 274b. they're slightly different in sound signature. whereas the sophia's brutuish at the bottom register and round at top, the eml is slightly tamer at the bottom and very wide and extended at the top. great for L3000, senn 650 and oddly enough the GS1000. the eml 274b makes the GS1000 sound very balanced and magical at the top with a 3-d holographic thing going for it. and it requires less burn-in then the sophia to sound at its best. |
Note that this is for the EML 274B though. I'm not sure if there'd be any sonic difference between this and a 5U4G.
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Quote:
Welcome to head-fi, and sorry about your wallet.
| Originally Posted by Johnny Moondog /img/forum/go_quote.gif Hello to everyone! I want to jump on board the good ship Woo Audio very soon, so thought I would start right here. I recently discovered Woo Audio from reading the Steve Hoffman Music Forums. I want to use the upcoming Beatles Remasters as an excuse to upgrade my headphone gear. Currently using Etymotic ER-4S/ER-4P headphones and HeadRoom Ultra Micro Amp. I read that Steve Hoffman uses the Sennheiser HD-600/Woo Audio 6, and when I inquired via private message he highly recommend all things Woo! I've seen a lot of other people talking about that particular combination here in these forums, along with variations that include the HD-650, HD-800, (other great headphones), WA2, WA6 SE, WA22. So now the Newbie questions: Having noticed the HD-600/WA6 as a popular combination, are there other combos that have become popular with Woo Audio owners? Grados are very nice with the Woo WA6 also, as are all my high-end custom IEM. Is it generally true that one would most likely be happier (and lighter in cash
Yes. Could you safely recommend to someone new "just spend what you can afford, borrow, or steal" and then search for the matching headphones of your choice? Any woo is a safe bet, but I liked the WA22 more than the WA6 and WA5. I missed hearing the WA6SE. You could get a used HD600 for $225-250 and enjoy it sooner than later. *add $30 for HD650 cable as an upgrade* Hit me with your best shot... And thanks! |
Welcome to head-fi, and sorry about your wallet.
Covenant
Headphoneus Supremus
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Quote:
As Larry remarked, and I just recently found out, Grados seem to mesh very well with Woo amps.
Quote:
The way I decided which Woo model to buy went something like this:
First, I wanted a seperate power supply, to eliminate any transformer noise from getting anywhere near the signal.
Second, I wanted an overkill power output, as Sennheisers are power hungry beasts.
Third, I was only interested in single ended, not balanced.
The first two criteria eliminate the WA6 and WA2, I didn't need balanced so the WA22 was also out, leaving the WA6SE and the WA5-LE.
WA5-LE has half again as much output power, but a stock WA5-LE with Sophia rectifiers costs considerably more than a fully upgraded WA6SE, so I went the latter.
| Originally Posted by Johnny Moondog /img/forum/go_quote.gif Hello to everyone! Having noticed the HD-600/WA6 as a popular combination, are there other combos that have become popular with Woo Audio owners? |
As Larry remarked, and I just recently found out, Grados seem to mesh very well with Woo amps.
Quote:
| Is it generally true that one would most likely be happier (and lighter in cash
|
The way I decided which Woo model to buy went something like this:
First, I wanted a seperate power supply, to eliminate any transformer noise from getting anywhere near the signal.
Second, I wanted an overkill power output, as Sennheisers are power hungry beasts.
Third, I was only interested in single ended, not balanced.
The first two criteria eliminate the WA6 and WA2, I didn't need balanced so the WA22 was also out, leaving the WA6SE and the WA5-LE.
WA5-LE has half again as much output power, but a stock WA5-LE with Sophia rectifiers costs considerably more than a fully upgraded WA6SE, so I went the latter.
Johnny Moondog, I have the WA6 with HD580 and HD650. Both sound magical when powered by the Woo... the synergy is pretty incredible. And I agree with HeadphoneAddict, sounds amazing w/ my Grado as well. All in all, it's worth every penny IMO. I'm sure you'll be VERY pleased with a WA6+HD600 combo. Should be a world of improvement from the Ultra Micro + ER4.
oricon82
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Anyone tried HD800/HF2 with WA6se? Saw HPA's reply to Johnny's post that grado's in general are very nice with the wa6 so I guess the HF2's should mate nicely with the WA6se. Not quite sure with the HD800's thou. Any advice?
Thanks in advance!
Thanks in advance!
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