[Zerstorer_GOhren]

CVJ Konoka on the house.




My super quick impression is... they feel like toys those plastic shells, like some sort of Gunpla model parts, lol. Look at the last picture.

Nice! How was the new tech.

 

[ToneDeafMonk]

I'm fairly new here, but I've been frequenting this thread ever since I've joined this community because it seems to be the place to read about the latest and greatest.

Although I don't think he should've called you out for your rating before you even reviewed the product, he's right about how there are a lot of reviews that are rated highly with 4-5 stars. If you look at the latest reviews, you find nothing but 4-5 stars and rarely find anything that's 3.5 or below. Some of the reviews have a list of cons that are showstoppers for some people (obviously the reviewer included), but the product still gets a high rating. I've seen reviewers stating that they've been given the product in exchange for a review, purchased the product with a discount, or purchased in full with their own money, but it does seem sketchy when most products end up with a 4-5 star rating.

I've also seen reviewers state that they don't review products that they think are bad. Why is that? If there's supposed to be no bias towards vendor-relations and all thoughts and opinions are your own, why not share your honest opinions with the community whether the product is good or bad?

I do appreciate the time and effort that all of the reviewers take for each writeup, but it sure is difficult to differentiate between a legitimate review and a fluff piece.

I used to feel the same way about reviewers and was critical and a ass as well when I first joined this forum.

Then I started doing reviews and got deeper into the hobby.

A bit ashamed about my early comments.
Now I understand a whole lot more about
Supplies/manufacturers and doing reviews.

I totally respect how much time and effort it takes to get to a point with your listening impressions to actually write a review or shoot a video.

There is so much badly tuned/wonky wierd or just poorly implemented crap out there.
Manufacturers graphs lie... And worse they have figured out how to hit a curve while packing a crap load of cheap drives to get there.
And when you listen to it ,makes your ears bleed.
Next you have collaborations that are pushing a agenda and myself included fall for it and get caught up in the hype.

To sum up the bad stuff is not worth your time or anybody else's to give up anymore.
Most good stuff after the initial hype wears off stands the test of time and will come out. The trick is to be patient and if you figure that out let me know this rabbit hole is evil. " Like Fruits from the Deveel"
All spun up in glorious .
TDM

 

[Zerstorer_GOhren]

I think it shouldn't be labelled as a "bone conductor" though, as a real BC transducer needs to be touching a bony surface (something like the jaw or mastoid bone of the skull) to transmit the vibration to bypass the eardrum.

Maybe something more like a bass shaker or some other terminology. This tech still goes thru the eardrums and the normal listening route.

That's why I'm using the term "haptic motor" drivers.

 

[ToneDeafMonk]

The 1-5 rating scale you have to work with on this forum is terrible. Should be 1-20
IMHO

 

[saldsald]

CVJ Konoka on the house.




My super quick impression is... they feel like toys those plastic shells, like some sort of Gunpla model parts, lol. Look at the last picture.

OK anyway, the graphs are actually correct. With the driver switched on, the sound of the bass is affected, in a negative way that the punch and tightness are gone. It actually sounds quite decent with a fairly large stage without the vibrator. So, I think it really needs to be tested with some FPS game play instead of with music.

The huge dip at around 8k looks like a phase alignment problem to me from my modding experience of messing up the circuits that I will investigate with phase measurements.

 

[DynamicEars]

There's a video showing the buzzer working FWIW.

Must be something new experience, but I'm not sure if that is in good way (good sensation) or bad way (pushed too hard to stands out from the crowd but real life usage is uncomfortable for end user)

 

[Zerstorer_GOhren]

The 1-5 rating scale you have to work with on this forum is terrible. Should be 1-20
IMHO

As I try adapt the Head-Fi five star system, here are my takes for each categories, full star = excellent, half star = fair/average, no star = impressive.

I rate it based on subjective basis; build quality, wearability, tonality, technical peformance and product presentation along its inclusions as I try to simply everything.

 

[Zerstorer_GOhren]

OK anyway, the graphs are actually correct. With the driver switch on, the sound of the bass is affected, in a negative way that the punch and tightness are gone. It actually sounds quite decent with a fairly large stage without the vibrator. So, I think it really needs to be tested with some FPS game play instead of with music.


The huge dip at around 8k looks like a phase alignment problem to me from my modding experience of messing up the circuits that I will investigate with phase measurements.

So, its a bright v-shape after all, right?

 

[Carpet]

There's a video showing the buzzer working FWIW.

You know that pair of IEMs you have, that won't stay put in your ears?

They may have company!

(Just a guess, I saw them jiggling their way across the tabletop)

Edit: excuse me while I tape a PlayStation controller to the side of my head. To figure out if this concept has any chance of being enjoyable.

 

[saldsald]

So, its a bright v-shape after all, right?

it's not that V shape sounding but the treble is a bit forward. The mids are not scooped at least.
The descriptions of the modes are actually quite accurate. 00 is decent for music. 10 is bright music monitor mode. I haven't watched movies or played games with it so I can't comment on the other two modes yet.

 

[saldsald]

OK anyway, the graphs are actually correct. With the driver switch on, the sound of the bass is affected, in a negative way that the punch and tightness are gone. It actually sounds quite decent with a fairly large stage without the vibrator. So, I think it really needs to be tested with some FPS game play instead of with music.


The huge dip at around 8k looks like a phase alignment problem to me from my modding experience of messing up the circuits that I will investigate with phase measurements.

Anyway, and here are the impedance and phase measurements:

00

01

10

11

These graphs indicate that the vibrator has very low impedance and that's why the power of the DD is drawn to the vibrator causing the weak bass. I wonder if it is possible to add a resistor to the vibrator to cancel out the negative effect.

And opened it up so I will add a 20ohm for the experiment.

 

[baskingshark]

I think it shouldn't be labelled as a "bone conductor" though, as a real BC transducer needs to be touching a bony surface (something like the jaw or mastoid bone of the skull) to transmit the vibration to bypass the eardrum.

Maybe something more like a bass shaker or some other terminology. This tech still goes thru the eardrums and the normal listening route.

In case anyone is interested in what Bone Conduction tech does, and its applications:

Spoiler: The science behind bone conduction technology

We see a few IEMs in recent times espousing Bone Conduction technology. What is this tech about? Is it a gimmick or a real game-changer?


Basically, on a normal day to day basis, humans hear via both air conduction (AC) and to a lesser extent, bone conduction (BC).

AC is the usual route we hear - as its name suggests, sound waves travel thru the air, and the outer ear funnels these to the middle ear and thru the eardrums, into the inner ear nerves, which are converted to electrical signals to the brain.

BC is the alternative route, whereby sound is transmitted thru vibrations along the skull or jaw bone. They bypass the outer/middle ear and eardrums, and directly go to the inner ear nerves. For example, BC is in play when you cover your ears and you speak; you can still hear words, because sound goes thru the skull bones to the inner ear.

BC tech has actually been around for centuries. The famed composer Beethoven lost his hearing (possibly from Menierre's disease or lead poisoning), and his livelihood would have been affected should he not be able to compose or hear music. He used a creative DIY fix by sticking a rod to his piano, and clenched it in his jaw, thereby using BC to hear transmitted sounds.

BC has widespread use in hearing aids for folks who have conductive hearing loss or tinnitus, to bypass the eardrums, and are also used in the military (BC headsets can transmit commands, but still allow soldiers be situationally aware through AC).

BC tech is not that commonly used in IEMs, but are found in some headsets that cyclists use, to be situationally aware in traffic. Granted, as of 2023, BC sound isn't as refined as AC - audiophiles may think a pure BC gear is not as good sounding, and isolation also is an issue with pure BC gear.

However, quite a number of these so-called "BC" drivers in IEMs are actually functioning more like a piezoelectric or "shaker/vibrator" - rather than a true BC tech, as that would require the BC driver to be pressed along a bony part of the skull like the jaw, cheek or mastoid (back of the skull). These small "BC" drivers in IEMs are not touching the skull bones and are still transmitting sound via the eardrum (AC), and are probably more of a marketing ploy.

Having said that, the BC tech is still in its early stages, and who knows, maybe give it a few years and the technology will get more refined and useful to audiophiles.

 

[Zerstorer_GOhren]

Anyway, and here are the impedance and phase measurements:





00

01

10

11

These graphs indicate that the vibrator has very low impedance and that's why the power of the DD is drawn to the vibrator causing the weak bass. I wonder if it is possible to add a resistor to the vibrator to cancel out the negative effect.

@NymPHONOmaniac @paulwasabii

 

[Redcarmoose]

 

[SynaestheticA]

What is the point of a "perfect" iem if it isn't one we use all the time? If it doesn't whisper our name through its dirty little tubes beckoning us to come back to it?

I've got a solution to the ratings system.

Now obviously if everyone could agree on any rating system together then it would be guaranteed to work. But hear me out.

If ratings were given based on how much we listened to an iem rather than how we think it performed across various dimensions.

So for me the Kublai Khan is a 5/5 and so is the HiBy Zeta as I use them more than anything and don't need to find something better than either.

The IMR BC 2023 is a 4 as although it's near perfect in its classical presentation of music. It doesn't get used more than my other iems.

The Timeless is a 3 cause I sold it. Tri i3 Pro is a 3.5 and so on.

"Cheaper" iems can still get a 5 star, but there would be less of them from reviewers.

I highly doubt anyone rating the Chu 4.5 or 5 is going to end their musical journey there and therefore it isn't worthy of a 5 star rating.

~~~~
This is less of a ranking system and more of a "what are the real world implications of having this iem? Do I actually use it?"

Have I done it? Do I get to become a moderator now? Where is my medal!