[Wyville]

Hey @Wyville it's Sunday , it's time for doggie pic

I'll post one in the usual place.

 

[Layman1]

What’s your current setup out of curiosity?

Also does anyone in this thread know UM dealers I could contact to maybe get a demo moving? @Layman1 welp buddy

From previous chats with UM, Andrew at MusicTeck would be your guy!
Let me know if no joy, and I'll see if I can get something sorted

And by the way, your idea of opening up an EU dealership with non-extortionate pricing certainly has my vote too!
@mvvRAZ for president!

 

[Deferenz]

I’d be interested in that but no way I’m paying the EU markup.... seriously considering opening a dealership in the EU with actually fair and adequate prices tbh

+10

 

[mvvRAZ]

I’m looking into it quite seriously I’ll keep you guys posted

 

[Wyville]

I’m looking into it quite seriously I’ll keep you guys posted

Let me know if I can help out.

 

[mvvRAZ]

Let me know if I can help out.

I sent you a pm, thanks bud!

In the meantime, if any of you happen to have some market information I'd greatly appreciate a pm or a post! I'm collecting a fair bit myself, but at this stage I can't really turn down any kind of data that will help me crunch some numbers and make some forecasts

 

[KuroKitsu]

So, my next IEM purchase is a tossup between the MEST and the Dmagic. The former is getting a ton of attention these days (funny how it took six months for this to happen), so it’s hard to ignore the accolades. But I prefer the build and aesthetics of the Dmagic, and its use of DD drivers. I especially love the wood body shells.

This is one of those times where a CanJam would be really helpful to choose which to buy. I made the most expensive blind purchase with my Odin—I’m happy I did—but due to covid related out of hand spending on head-fi gear this year, I’m reluctant to just buy both and sell one taking the typical hit.

If anyone has first-hand experience comparing the two, I’d be happy to read your assessment.

Why not both?

Thats's what I did after moving on from the u12t due to fit and weight issues. I enjoy both in equal measure.

The bass on the MEST is very appealing, but that bump around 2.5K on the Dmagic has worked for me in the past creating a sense of immediacy.

The DMagic bump is interesting, it seems to be much more present when running Asian pop than say Western pop. Upper mid bumps have traditionally been a bit of contention for me, I'm probably less iffy about it than Michael is, but for similar reasons. MEST might be the safer bet in this case.

 

[KuroKitsu]

All in all, I think the Zephyr is a great IEM if you're looking for something that specifically pulls off female vocals, but also kinda falls short as an all rounder.

Please do note if you are reading this that I've become a little um... allergic to forward upper mids. It seems like half the IEMs in the market are in a way completely relying on just overdoing that frequency region, and in the process sacrificing the IEM's entire ability to be an adequate all rounder. The Zephyr is more balanced in that aspect than both the Odin and the Homunculus, but well, I still can't quite get behind it either.

I was hoping for something that's not a flop like the Tux5 or M3, seems like this might be a bit of a miss as well. Or perhaps Noble trying to get a slice of that asian market as well.

Re the forward upper mids, an astute observation. It seems like a consious decision to throw something out into the asian market that seems like a safe bet to do wel on the part of many companies. I've always though I've had a relatively tight standard in how that area should be done, but it seems that you might have got me beat there Michael! Forward Upper mids and modern music are very hard to get right from what I've tried and it's rare they get in it my sweet spot.

I take it you weren't a fan of that huge bump on the DMagic?

 

[mvvRAZ]

I was hoping for something that's not a flop like the Tux5 or M3, seems like this might be a bit of a miss as well. Or perhaps Noble trying to get a slice of that asian market as well.

Re the forward upper mids, an astute observation. It seems like a consious decision to throw something out into the asian market that seems like a safe bet to do wel on the part of many companies. I've always though I've had a relatively tight standard in how that area should be done, but it seems that you might have got me beat there Michael! Forward Upper mids and modern music are very hard to get right from what I've tried and it's rare they get in it my sweet spot.

I take it you weren't a fan of that huge bump on the DMagic?

I'd say the Zephyr is a really solid IEM, but I'm sort of hearing it at the wrong time - I recently had a terrible experience with the Odin and a really bad one with the DMagic as the upper midrange lifts make almost everything I listen to sound either overly forward or flat out wrong. The Zephyr has a smaller bump in that area, and the rest of the frequencies are really well aligned with it, so I'd say it's a successful IEM if that's what you're looking for - like a good implementation of a tuning philosophy that I don't enjoy

 

[mvvRAZ]

A12t, A18S, and you totally could've made it in showbiz

As usual, to state my bias upfront, I am a bit of a 64 fanboy....

"Dear Vitaliy, I wrote you but still ain't callin"

The A12t and A18S showed up today, and boy was I excited. There's always a certain Xmas morning feel to trying on your new customs for the first time, not knowing whether it's going to be a sweater that your crazy aunt made or that RC car you kept on staring at in the mall so your mom would notice. This time around it was the RC car - the CIEMs fit extremely well - after a little over an year, 64 and I finally managed to nail the canal thickness

The build quality.... oh lawd almighty. Both CIEMs have the recessed sockets as I requested since those feel much better and the cable barrels look far nicer - apparently it was quite challenging to fit those on my A18S, but 64 managed - cables just fit much nicer in them and I'm less worried about bending or breaking the pins. The look is simply out of this world, I'm still trying to capture the abalone in all its glory - this is the closest I've gotten so far, but well, I'm sure there's more skilled photographers in this thread

Before we get to the comparison post, a little on the A12t

I've spent some 12 hours with it since I received it yesterday with only brief pauses to refresh my A18S memory to be able to deliver on a better comparison between the two, but either way, I guess you could say that these are partially initial impressions of the A12t but also after 10-12 hours my impressions of something are in a decently final shape

In the interest of full disclosure, 64 was able to extend me a 25% discount on the A12t cause they were offering 20% anyways and you know, loyal customers yadda yadda. If I am to evaluate the A12t at the 15/1600$ price point it's currently resting at, it's barely even fair. I've expressed some very warm sentiments towards the Sony IER M9 - I find the A12t has a few similarities in how tonally correct it is, but in a slightly darker and warmer signature which resolves those "almost sibilant" moments the IER M9 has every now and then. It has a natural signature, with amazing dynamics, a large soundstage, and amazing treble extension but with a bit less air due to the less present treble.

To me the A12t is an IEM that strikes an extremely optimal balance between pleasant and technical - it is pleasant enough for me to enjoy my music without thinking about what I'm listening to, and it's technical enough for me to not get bored several days in. Again comparing to the IER M9 (another IEM that I think is highly technical), the A12t stretches wider, retrieves more detail and has better separation. The dynamics might just be the best of the entire 64 lineup

And onto the A12t vs A18S! When the A18S was first released most of the questions I was seeing was A18S vs A18t, but soon after that it became clear that the A18S had taken more from the A12t than any other monitor 64 has made, and realistically, that's true

Just after receiving the two CIEMs yesterday I started AB-ing them and um... at first I could barely tell them apart. The A18S and A12t are very, very similar in a lot of ways, and on certain parts of certain tracks I legitimately struggle to tell them apart if I am not actively thinking about what I'm listening to. That's why I changed my methodology this time around, and spent a straight 5-6 hours with the A12t to sort of burn it into my brain, get really accustomed to its signature, and then swapped back to the A18S to see what stands out to me as different

Mind you, the fact that I had to do that shows just how much of a resemblance there is between the two

I can't say the A12t is a straight up dark monitor, but it's certainly very treble neutral.. maybe a touch dark, especially compared to a treble monster like the Fourte or the U18t, but those I consider plain bright. The A18S takes the upper-treble focus of the A12t and takes that a bit further, giving it a more exaggerated sense of air and space - when you couple that with the even wider staging, you can see how the A18S presents itself as a natural upgrade to the A12t

The bass on the A12t is a little slower and more DD-like. It's not a full on DD sound like the Legend X or even the Sultan or the Thummim, but it certainly gets pretty close - some of the closest any BA has gotten I suppose. The A18S on the other hand is punchier, more focused and better placed within the soundstage - you can tell exactly where each drum hit happens. I think the speed and punchiness of the A18S gives me the sense of more bass even though they're definitely quite comparable in terms of quantity. I personally hear some more subbass on the A18S, but it might be the same perception that the speed is giving it.

The midrange of the A12t is a little warmer than that of the A18S - vocals have some more body, while the A18S has taken some of the A18t DNA, with more precise, reference vocals - I'd say the A18S is pretty much 60% A12t and 40% A18t in that part of the FR. They're pretty comparable once again though, any differences that I'm describing here would be an exaggeration so I can better highlight them

The treble is the main deviation to my ears - the A18S is a little brighter, a little airier and a little sparklier. I love that both IEMs have extremely clean treble that at no point gets peaky or sibilant, but at the same time has insane extension and upper treble presence. They have almost identical treble in the sense of tuning, the A18S just has a little more of it in the upper registers

Technical ability I sort of covered already - the A18S stretches a little wider and delivers on some more detail and has just slightly higher resolution all in all (at least in terms of what I'm hearing here)

The big question... Which do I recommend when and do you upgrade from the A12t and what the **** was the point of all of this

If you own the A12t already, and would really like some more out of it, or a little more treble... I guess if you really want it, I can see it kinda being worth it. It's not going to be a night and day difference though

If you own the A18S already, there's little point in an A12t

If you own neither, you can kinda get 95% of the way to an A18S (while getting like, 110% dynamics) with an A12t... If you're on a strict budget an A12t + a DAP or a cable might be a more worthwhile purchase than a straight up A18S

 

[gLer]

A12t, A18S, and you totally could've made it in showbiz

As usual, to state my bias upfront, I am a bit of a 64 fanboy....

"Dear Vitaliy, I wrote you but still ain't callin"

The A12t and A18S showed up today, and boy was I excited. There's always a certain Xmas morning feel to trying on your new customs for the first time, not knowing whether it's going to be a sweater that your crazy aunt made or that RC car you kept on staring at in the mall so your mom would notice. This time around it was the RC car - the CIEMs fit extremely well - after a little over an year, 64 and I finally managed to nail the canal thickness

The build quality.... oh lawd almighty. Both CIEMs have the recessed sockets as I requested since those feel much better and the cable barrels look far nicer - apparently it was quite challenging to fit those on my A18S, but 64 managed - cables just fit much nicer in them and I'm less worried about bending or breaking the pins. The look is simply out of this world, I'm still trying to capture the abalone in all its glory - this is the closest I've gotten so far, but well, I'm sure there's more skilled photographers in this thread



Before we get to the comparison post, a little on the A12t

I've spent some 12 hours with it since I received it yesterday with only brief pauses to refresh my A18S memory to be able to deliver on a better comparison between the two, but either way, I guess you could say that these are partially initial impressions of the A12t but also after 10-12 hours my impressions of something are in a decently final shape

In the interest of full disclosure, 64 was able to extend me a 25% discount on the A12t cause they were offering 20% anyways and you know, loyal customers yadda yadda. If I am to evaluate the A12t at the 15/1600$ price point it's currently resting at, it's barely even fair. I've expressed some very warm sentiments towards the Sony IER M9 - I find the A12t has a few similarities in how tonally correct it is, but in a slightly darker and warmer signature which resolves those "almost sibilant" moments the IER M9 has every now and then. It has a natural signature, with amazing dynamics, a large soundstage, and amazing treble extension but with a bit less air due to the less present treble.

To me the A12t is an IEM that strikes an extremely optimal balance between pleasant and technical - it is pleasant enough for me to enjoy my music without thinking about what I'm listening to, and it's technical enough for me to not get bored several days in. Again comparing to the IER M9 (another IEM that I think is highly technical), the A12t stretches wider, retrieves more detail and has better separation. The dynamics might just be the best of the entire 64 lineup

And onto the A12t vs A18S! When the A18S was first released most of the questions I was seeing was A18S vs A18t, but soon after that it became clear that the A18S had taken more from the A12t than any other monitor 64 has made, and realistically, that's true

Just after receiving the two CIEMs yesterday I started AB-ing them and um... at first I could barely tell them apart. The A18S and A12t are very, very similar in a lot of ways, and on certain parts of certain tracks I legitimately struggle to tell them apart if I am not actively thinking about what I'm listening to. That's why I changed my methodology this time around, and spent a straight 5-6 hours with the A12t to sort of burn it into my brain, get really accustomed to its signature, and then swapped back to the A18S to see what stands out to me as different

Mind you, the fact that I had to do that shows just how much of a resemblance there is between the two

I can't say the A12t is a straight up dark monitor, but it's certainly very treble neutral.. maybe a touch dark, especially compared to a treble monster like the Fourte or the U18t, but those I consider plain bright. The A18S takes the upper-treble focus of the A12t and takes that a bit further, giving it a more exaggerated sense of air and space - when you couple that with the even wider staging, you can see how the A18S presents itself as a natural upgrade to the A12t

The bass on the A12t is a little slower and more DD-like. It's not a full on DD sound like the Legend X or even the Sultan or the Thummim, but it certainly gets pretty close - some of the closest any BA has gotten I suppose. The A18S on the other hand is punchier, more focused and better placed within the soundstage - you can tell exactly where each drum hit happens. I think the speed and punchiness of the A18S gives me the sense of more bass even though they're definitely quite comparable in terms of quantity. I personally hear some more subbass on the A18S, but it might be the same perception that the speed is giving it.

The midrange of the A12t is a little warmer than that of the A18S - vocals have some more body, while the A18S has taken some of the A18t DNA, with more precise, reference vocals - I'd say the A18S is pretty much 60% A12t and 40% A18t in that part of the FR. They're pretty comparable once again though, any differences that I'm describing here would be an exaggeration so I can better highlight them

The treble is the main deviation to my ears - the A18S is a little brighter, a little airier and a little sparklier. I love that both IEMs have extremely clean treble that at no point gets peaky or sibilant, but at the same time has insane extension and upper treble presence. They have almost identical treble in the sense of tuning, the A18S just has a little more of it in the upper registers

Technical ability I sort of covered already - the A18S stretches a little wider and delivers on some more detail and has just slightly higher resolution all in all (at least in terms of what I'm hearing here)

The big question... Which do I recommend when and do you upgrade from the A12t and what the **** was the point of all of this

If you own the A12t already, and would really like some more out of it, or a little more treble... I guess if you really want it, I can see it kinda being worth it. It's not going to be a night and day difference though

If you own the A18S already, there's little point in an A12t

If you own neither, you can kinda get 95% of the way to an A18S (while getting like, 110% dynamics) with an A12t... If you're on a strict budget an A12t + a DAP or a cable might be a more worthwhile purchase than a straight up A18S

Excellent and decisive review. The A/U12t are so well known and respected that you just get straight to the point, which is exactly what you did. I'm also glad you were more mature and restrained about your comparison (unlike the initial hype suggesting the A18s 'blows the A12t away).

One point - I've heard from a number of users that switched from the U12t to the A12t that their first reaction was 'where's the treble' and it's interesting that's one of the first things you alluded to. If you ever get a chance to hear the U12t, I think you'll find it even closer to the A18s by virtue of its slightly brighter and airier treble. Might be worth your while to demo it for the sake of completeness.

 

[mvvRAZ]

Excellent and decisive review. The A/U12t are so well known and respected that you just get straight to the point, which is exactly what you did. I'm also glad you were more mature and restrained about your comparison (unlike the initial hype suggesting the A18s 'blows the A12t away).

One point - I've heard from a number of users that switched from the U12t to the A12t that their first reaction was 'where's the treble' and it's interesting that's one of the first things you alluded to. If you ever get a chance to hear the U12t, I think you'll find it even closer to the A18s by virtue of its slightly brighter and airier treble. Might be worth your while to demo it for the sake of completeness.

Thank you!

I've actually heard the U12t, but it was a while back, and 64 universals do not work for my ears whatsoever so I'm actually thinking of completely removing all of them from my ranking list. Just working off memory here (and it has been an year since I heard the U), I remember it striking me as an IEM with somewhat dry and unexciting treble

Quantity wise I think the A12t might have less, but the quality of the treble feels improved. I'll see if I can hunt a demo U12t down but I don't think I'm generally speaking the most reliable person to review 64 universals considering they don't want to stay in my ears

 

[mvvRAZ]

Excellent and decisive review. The A/U12t are so well known and respected that you just get straight to the point, which is exactly what you did. I'm also glad you were more mature and restrained about your comparison (unlike the initial hype suggesting the A18s 'blows the A12t away).

One point - I've heard from a number of users that switched from the U12t to the A12t that their first reaction was 'where's the treble' and it's interesting that's one of the first things you alluded to. If you ever get a chance to hear the U12t, I think you'll find it even closer to the A18s by virtue of its slightly brighter and airier treble. Might be worth your while to demo it for the sake of completeness.

Wait I just realised, are you talking about aminus' impressions?

He sent in his A12t for 64 to look at it and there was an issue with some of the drivers. They've since resolved it and if I recall correctly he mentioned his A12t is a lot more in line with the U12t now. I need to check his thread to see where it's at, or he can pay us a visit @aminus

 

[DavidS11]

A12t, A18S, and you totally could've made it in showbiz

As usual, to state my bias upfront, I am a bit of a 64 fanboy....

"Dear Vitaliy, I wrote you but still ain't callin"

The A12t and A18S showed up today, and boy was I excited. There's always a certain Xmas morning feel to trying on your new customs for the first time, not knowing whether it's going to be a sweater that your crazy aunt made or that RC car you kept on staring at in the mall so your mom would notice. This time around it was the RC car - the CIEMs fit extremely well - after a little over an year, 64 and I finally managed to nail the canal thickness

The build quality.... oh lawd almighty. Both CIEMs have the recessed sockets as I requested since those feel much better and the cable barrels look far nicer - apparently it was quite challenging to fit those on my A18S, but 64 managed - cables just fit much nicer in them and I'm less worried about bending or breaking the pins. The look is simply out of this world, I'm still trying to capture the abalone in all its glory - this is the closest I've gotten so far, but well, I'm sure there's more skilled photographers in this thread



Before we get to the comparison post, a little on the A12t

I've spent some 12 hours with it since I received it yesterday with only brief pauses to refresh my A18S memory to be able to deliver on a better comparison between the two, but either way, I guess you could say that these are partially initial impressions of the A12t but also after 10-12 hours my impressions of something are in a decently final shape

In the interest of full disclosure, 64 was able to extend me a 25% discount on the A12t cause they were offering 20% anyways and you know, loyal customers yadda yadda. If I am to evaluate the A12t at the 15/1600$ price point it's currently resting at, it's barely even fair. I've expressed some very warm sentiments towards the Sony IER M9 - I find the A12t has a few similarities in how tonally correct it is, but in a slightly darker and warmer signature which resolves those "almost sibilant" moments the IER M9 has every now and then. It has a natural signature, with amazing dynamics, a large soundstage, and amazing treble extension but with a bit less air due to the less present treble.

To me the A12t is an IEM that strikes an extremely optimal balance between pleasant and technical - it is pleasant enough for me to enjoy my music without thinking about what I'm listening to, and it's technical enough for me to not get bored several days in. Again comparing to the IER M9 (another IEM that I think is highly technical), the A12t stretches wider, retrieves more detail and has better separation. The dynamics might just be the best of the entire 64 lineup

And onto the A12t vs A18S! When the A18S was first released most of the questions I was seeing was A18S vs A18t, but soon after that it became clear that the A18S had taken more from the A12t than any other monitor 64 has made, and realistically, that's true

Just after receiving the two CIEMs yesterday I started AB-ing them and um... at first I could barely tell them apart. The A18S and A12t are very, very similar in a lot of ways, and on certain parts of certain tracks I legitimately struggle to tell them apart if I am not actively thinking about what I'm listening to. That's why I changed my methodology this time around, and spent a straight 5-6 hours with the A12t to sort of burn it into my brain, get really accustomed to its signature, and then swapped back to the A18S to see what stands out to me as different

Mind you, the fact that I had to do that shows just how much of a resemblance there is between the two

I can't say the A12t is a straight up dark monitor, but it's certainly very treble neutral.. maybe a touch dark, especially compared to a treble monster like the Fourte or the U18t, but those I consider plain bright. The A18S takes the upper-treble focus of the A12t and takes that a bit further, giving it a more exaggerated sense of air and space - when you couple that with the even wider staging, you can see how the A18S presents itself as a natural upgrade to the A12t

The bass on the A12t is a little slower and more DD-like. It's not a full on DD sound like the Legend X or even the Sultan or the Thummim, but it certainly gets pretty close - some of the closest any BA has gotten I suppose. The A18S on the other hand is punchier, more focused and better placed within the soundstage - you can tell exactly where each drum hit happens. I think the speed and punchiness of the A18S gives me the sense of more bass even though they're definitely quite comparable in terms of quantity. I personally hear some more subbass on the A18S, but it might be the same perception that the speed is giving it.

The midrange of the A12t is a little warmer than that of the A18S - vocals have some more body, while the A18S has taken some of the A18t DNA, with more precise, reference vocals - I'd say the A18S is pretty much 60% A12t and 40% A18t in that part of the FR. They're pretty comparable once again though, any differences that I'm describing here would be an exaggeration so I can better highlight them

The treble is the main deviation to my ears - the A18S is a little brighter, a little airier and a little sparklier. I love that both IEMs have extremely clean treble that at no point gets peaky or sibilant, but at the same time has insane extension and upper treble presence. They have almost identical treble in the sense of tuning, the A18S just has a little more of it in the upper registers

Technical ability I sort of covered already - the A18S stretches a little wider and delivers on some more detail and has just slightly higher resolution all in all (at least in terms of what I'm hearing here)

The big question... Which do I recommend when and do you upgrade from the A12t and what the **** was the point of all of this

If you own the A12t already, and would really like some more out of it, or a little more treble... I guess if you really want it, I can see it kinda being worth it. It's not going to be a night and day difference though

If you own the A18S already, there's little point in an A12t

If you own neither, you can kinda get 95% of the way to an A18S (while getting like, 110% dynamics) with an A12t... If you're on a strict budget an A12t + a DAP or a cable might be a more worthwhile purchase than a straight up A18S

Great post and thank you for the helpful A18s and A12t comparisons / impressions. I am thinking of getting a 64 custom and this really helps with my pending decision (thinking of going for the A12t).

Just a question regarding the recessed sockets that you mentioned. My understanding from what I’ve read, all 64 custom comes with non-recessed sockets as standard, except for A18s and N8 which only comes with recessed sockets. (recessed mean the pin holes are further inside the shell, not sure if I got it right). Can I ask if you special request for A12t to be changed to recessed sockets Or is it the other way round for the A18s? Also, do 64 normally allow request for changing the sockets type or this is only for your special case only? Thanks.

 

[arijitroy2]

The reason I sold the U12T was I found it lacked the treble energy that I was looking for. It made quite a few tracks lackluster.