[vid]

Wualta puts it well.

 

[JadeEast]

Quote:

So is your perception of a sound wave via the ear an abstraction of reality, a model.

Sure, we know that dogs hear higher frequencies than humans do. I think perception is a tricky thing to talk about when it comes to what we considered to be real. 

 

[bruma]

I like to have two similar headphones, before I start any kind of modding: it is a similar aproach to the statement of vid, because the aim of keeping control of the changes you made is really important to avoid going round in circles. The development of a satisfying damping strategy with the hp-1 would have been impossible without this method - and I like the real thing (frozen to the last stage of modding) even more than a measurement.

 

[ludoo]

Quote:

I like to have two similar headphones, before I start any kind of modding: it is a similar aproach to the statement of vid, because the aim of keeping control of the changes you made is really important to avoid going round in circles. The development of a satisfying damping strategy with the hp-1 would have been impossible without this method - and I like the real thing (frozen to the last stage of modding) even more than a measurement.

 
I completely agree. Without a reference headphone it's impossible to judge mods. My first successful damping job was done against a Stax headphone I had, and once they managed to sound better they then became my reference phones for all the other mods.

 

[nick n]

Quote:

 
Because I am deliberately limiting how far down the rabbit hole I go. It's like when I start playing with amp designs on paper and slap something together on a breadboard, I start wondering about etching my own boards but then stop and tell myself... "no, this way lies madness".

 
Hey Nick, with the T10 when I still had it I was quite happy with the stock sound, but did fiddle with a very simple arrangement. A piece of your fuzzy velour cut in a circle to fit in the recess behind the driver, held down with a piece of micropore tape across the entire opening. Actually I think I liked it with just the tape. Cleaning the diaphragm is a good idea too.

I do have a slight issue with the left side the odd time needing to get volume cranked for it to engage but then it's fine. I should clean it though.  Did your set not have the stock yellow rockwooly disc there at the rear of the driver? If so you put the velour junk after or before that?
 
 
The way they are damped now is just barely enough I find, closer to stock with a tiny boost overall I would say.
 
 
 
Only reason I will do the measurements with the tiny mic is to make sure the channels are balanced right to left. That and to see generally if my impressions correspond roughly with the FR curve.

 

[kalbee]

Only reason I will do the measurements with the tiny mic is to make sure the channels are balanced right to left. That and to see generally if my impressions correspond roughly with the FR curve.

This is why I do measurements.
Also to visualize how X material will affect the sound. I like it visual

 

[Armaegis]

Quote:

I do have a slight issue with the left side the odd time bneeding to get volume cranked for it to engage but then it's fine. I should clean it though.  Did your set not have the stock yellow rockwooly disc there at the rear of the driver? If so you put the velour junkafter or before that?
 
 
The way they are damped now is just barely enough I find, closer to stock with a tiny boost overall I would say.
 

 
I had a lot of dirt in mine, probably just from age and degradation of the materials around it. When I took the magnets out, there were hard black specks all over the diaphragm. The wires connecting to the diaphragm element were also rather corroded. 
 
I brushed off what dirt I could, then carefully used a piece of scotch tape to pick off the rest. Easier if you can separate the membrane from the metal rings, but that might be easier said than done. In my case I also smoothed out the membranes.
 
I left the stock yellow rockwool in there. I trimmed a piece of velour to fit within the plastic ring holding the magnet down, then just held the whole thing down with a big piece of micropore tape. I later took out the velour but left the tape just to protect the driver. My set actually produced surprisingly good bass all the way down to 50Hz without much further tweaking. 

 

[FuglyPhones]

I have owned TDS-7 headphones for a while now and would like to share some thoughts with all you who are interested in orthos.
 
First of all I have to say that these are the only orthos that I have owned so I really can't compare to them to other orthos. I have owned quite a few dynamic headphones. Currently I have Denon AH-D5000 (LA mod1 with angle pads), UE6000 and Ergo AMT (not dynamic!). So these are the ones that I really can compare TDS-7 to.
 
TDS-7 was completely unmodified (except new termination to 6.3mm plug)  when I bought them from one really nice Belarus guy who is also a member of this forum. At first, I used my Matrix M-Stage amp to drive the TDS-7. Sound was OK but it seemed like it came through a thick curtain. Bass was good but mids and highs were both somewhat muffled. TDS-7 is also very uncomfortable in stock form.
 
They obviously needed modification but I wanted to keep the original look and all the modifications needed to be reversible. I don't want to ruin these vintage beauties.
 
My first goal was to improve the comfort. I bought some cheap Sony pads and attached them on top of the old ones. I also stretched the headband as much I could. This improved the comfort a lot. I had one extra HD650 headband padding that I attached to the leather band of TDS-7. It fitted perfectly and increased the comfort even more. 
 
I damped the ear cups with dense memory foam but that didn't improve the sound too much if not at all. I kind of forgot the TDS-7 after these mods and concentrated to my other headphones as the sound quality didn't please me enough.
 
This week I decided to try them with my KingRex T-amp. I soldered a new cable and ended it with 4-pin XLR. I also removed the memory foam from the ear cups and padded everything with dynamat. I'm really pleased with the results.
 
Bass response is almost identical with my Lawton modified D5000. Highs are well extended and not sibiliant at all (although I hardly ever suffer from sibliance). Mids are what really separates these from the D5000. Mids are so much more present with the TDS-7 and makes them sound much more balanced through the whole spectrum. TDS-7 seems to be also much faster headphone and it has wider soundstage. I don't know yet which one I like the most. TDS-7 might be more balanced but I quite like the warm and easy sound of my D5000 as V-shaped as it might be. One thing I hate is sloppy and uncontrolled bass (as unmodified D5000) and I'm happy to say that either one of these headphones doesn't suffer from that.
 
Ergo AMT is superior on the mids and highs but the lack of low end response is a big problem with the AMT. AMT is only good with music that doesn't have the deepest bass and doesn't require much impact. But oh boy the AMT is good when it's used with music that suits it's profile (mainly jazz and blues in my collection).
 
Here is some pictures of my TDS-7. Sorry for the bad quality. I'm not a photographer and these are taken with my N8:
 
Here you can see the HD650 headband padding.

 
 
Here are the Sony pads on top of the original ones:

 
 
A look of the ear cup:

 
 
Here is the dynamat treated ear cup from inside. Dynamat is applied also to the rear of the plastic that is attached to the frame. I like how they use the headband to transfer the signals from the left cup to the right one. No extra wires needed as the wires are attached straight to the frame

 

[TiEx]

Nice write-up FuglyPhones. I would like to add that you released out only half of the beast that TDS-7 hides inside this clumsy looking body. As already told TDS-7 are driven a lot better by speaker amplifiers, that are intended for 8 Ohm load. Remember that there are few other modifications to take them step above. And that is open back structure (some guys have cut out a window in the back of the cup and panel attached to headband and then installed some grill for the looks). Second is to get rid of wool inside the driver. Take a look at the picture above, there are wool peaces in top and bottom openings in driver frame. After removing them you will get double effective driver surface area. According to modders reviews this action improves bass and treble extension. Also with open back design damping must be a thin wool like layer with small center hole at the back, or experimenting with something similar. Changing old cord for a good quality OFC one is also a plus. The only questionable mod is earpads. Many people experimented with very different sizes, forms and materials with different results.
 
Take this with a pinch of salt. This is only theoretical knowledge gathered in russian forums.

 

[vid]

Audio-Technica ATH-2100
http://s16.postimage.org/8zpb06ntx/IMG_0438.jpg
http://s16.postimage.org/hj8oxxw6d/IMG_0439.jpg
http://s16.postimage.org/edo37qdk5/IMG_0440.jpg
http://s16.postimage.org/pej8cr5t1/IMG_0441.jpg
 
?

 

[nick n]

what the ATH-2100???
 
VID can you upload those directly to this thread in case the links you provided fade away. puhleeeeze.

nevermind I got it. Edited down to avoid issues? shhhh keep it quiet.

 

 

 
 
 
I will counter that set of pics with this....
 another ????:
A sighting of the SANSUI L-33

 
 

 

 
 
 As far as I am aware there is a confirmed Sansui L-55 ortho, I could not find hide nor hear ( yeah play on words there ) of this elusive beast in any catalogs etc . What strikes me is that even the L-55 is labeled as a DYNAMIC yet it is confirmed to be orthotic in physiology.
Where does this particular beast hide ( nocturnal closet habitations? ), what is their secret environment , and what amount of population still exists out there?
 
This seems to be eerily similar to the L-55, what gives? Will the world actually believe this sighting out in the wild is an ortho or will it come down to a dissection. The cryptophonology hunt continues.
 BTW this currently up at that site of germanic origin  No pay-buddy.

 

[wualta]

Whoa! Orthotistical!

 

[vid]

Quote:

what the ATH-2100???
 
VID can you upload those directly to this thread in case the links you provided fade away. puhleeeeze.

nevermind I got it.

 
Problem is, they're not my pictures; so it would be (a) against Head-Fi's terms of service, and (b) copyright infringement. One small version of a picture might be fine, but not all of them I don't think. But saying that, the guy would probably agree to have them uploaded if someone asked.

 

[FuglyPhones]

Quote:

Nice write-up FuglyPhones. I would like to add that you released out only half of the beast that TDS-7 hides inside this clumsy looking body. As already told TDS-7 are driven a lot better by speaker amplifiers, that are intended for 8 Ohm load. Remember that there are few other modifications to take them step above. And that is open back structure (some guys have cut out a window in the back of the cup and panel attached to headband and then installed some grill for the looks). Second is to get rid of wool inside the driver. Take a look at the picture above, there are wool peaces in top and bottom openings in driver frame. After removing them you will get double effective driver surface area. According to modders reviews this action improves bass and treble extension. Also with open back design damping must be a thin wool like layer with small center hole at the back, or experimenting with something similar. Changing old cord for a good quality OFC one is also a plus. The only questionable mod is earpads. Many people experimented with very different sizes, forms and materials with different results.
 
Take this with a pinch of salt. This is only theoretical knowledge gathered in russian forums.

Thanks TiEx for these tips. I'm driving the TDS-7 with my KingRex speaker amp which I believe is just fine with the 8 ohm load.
 
I have seen those open pack mod picks in some Russian forum but I don't want to go that far. I'm not willing to cut any holes to the structure. 
 
I will definitely try to remove that wool from the drivers. What about the round opening in front of the drivers? Would it be better to expose the whole driver?
 
Edit: Don't open the drivers on these if you are not 100% confident about what you are doing. There are some nasty loose magnets that brake the membrane more than easily. I bricked mine Unfortunately I can't comment how removing the wool affects the sound
 
Please let me know if somebody has spare membrane for TDS-7. I can also sell these to someone as spare parts. The other membrane is still fine.

 

[bruma]

I have a question to all of you, who have some SFI experience:
does it make sense to make a driver out of three SFI's - 2 of the 8 ohm tweeters, respective their magnets with the holes, plus the diaphragma of the 32 ohm dipole?
The reason that I ask is that the 8 ohm 2 in 1 SFI that I made is the "nearest headphone to the electostats" in terms of transparency and clarity of all other headphones that I listened so far. but they lack in bass too much. The reason for their precision could be the stronger magnets - they have also a higher sensitivity as tweeters than the 32 ohm types (which have smaller and weaker magnets). this results in a better control of the diaphragma.
my idea is that the 32 ohm diaphragma could exert a higher dynamic force against the strong magnets and get more extention = bass.
any comments are welcome!