Orthodynamic Roundup

[ludoo]

Quote:

Originally Posted by dBel84 /img/forum/go_quote.gif I would be curious to see if a selection of your amps all give you the same bass resonance - this may suggest a driver defect ( either very loose or somehow damaged over time?? )

In my limited experience, a very loose driver is the best thing you can hope for in a Yamaha. Well, actually two very loose drivers.

 

[ludoo]

Damping of the two YH-100 I have here is slowly progressing. The YH-100 sound now like the big brothers of my HP-3: very similar sound signature, with more soundstage and a fuller sound. The only thing my HP-3 do better is deep bass, as they go lower and have more of it.

I might still change something, as the YH-100 are possibly still a touch underdamped, but I think I'm on the right track. Very very nice phones.

 

[ericj]

Quote:

Originally Posted by ludoo /img/forum/go_quote.gif Damping of the two YH-100 I have here is slowly progressing. The YH-100 sound now like the big brothers of my HP-3: very similar sound signature, with more soundstage and a fuller sound. The only thing my HP-3 do better is deep bass, as they go lower and have more of it. I might still change something, as the YH-100 are possibly still a touch underdamped, but I think I'm on the right track. Very very nice phones.

Carefully observe the position of the felt that lines the vents.

Yamaha cut the strips so thin that they only just barely cover the vents, but then molded the plastic so that nothing keeps them from being pushed further into the cup.

It's very easy to have undamped vents on a yh-100 and not see it.

iirc facelvega solved that problem by installing strips of thick self-adhesive felt just under the vents, to prevent the original felt strips from sliding down.

 

[ludoo]

Quote:

Originally Posted by ericj /img/forum/go_quote.gif Carefully observe the position of the felt that lines the vents. Yamaha cut the strips so thin that they only just barely cover the vents, but then molded the plastic so that nothing keeps them from being pushed further into the cup. It's very easy to have undamped vents on a yh-100 and not see it.

You are spot on: the biggest difference in my latest damping is two layers of very thick felt damping the vents, after having removed the black strips. It's a lot of work, as it requires cutting several donuts as large as the baffle with a hole of the same diameter as the driver, then fashioning new strips out of them, then punching the holes for the small posts on each strip. Then you have to fit them on the posts so that they don't move when you close the cups. But the sound difference with the previous damping attempts is huge, so it's well worth it.

 

[wualta]

Thanks to ericj for remembering to point out that important but easily-overlooked... point. And to think that at one time I was running my #1 YH-100 without vent felt. Tsk tsk tsk. Eric, have you still got Ol' Numba One?

sacdlover, as your master dBel84 has mentioned, the bass/lower mid resonance you hear is the natural resonant frequency of the diaphragm. Yamaha let it resonate unmolested, but it will be your task to molest it and molest it good.

In other words, what you're hearing is the normal, out-of-the-box sound of a Yamaha Orthodynamic, and it sounds that way because it's an underdamped planar with a heavy diaphragm. As ludoo said, that dark sound is exactly what you want, because the damping process will quash the bass/mid hump and leave you with killer bass extension, but, and this is the good part, killer bass transient response too. The top end will turn killer as well, with a little help.

The reason you hear flaws in recordings which somehow don't register is due to two things: one, the inherent linearity of the planar-magnetic drive, which gives a smooth response with a rolled-off top end, very mellow but revealing-- no canyons in the response curve for stuff to hide in.

But two, the flaws don't register because the transient response of the system is compromised (see above). Good transient (aka impulse) response is like a very sharp lens on a camera. Semi-bad transient response, especially if there's only one big broad peak (in the mid-bass in this case) and not a whole pointy battalion of them all over the spectrum, is like a sharp lens with Vaseline smeared on it for a soft-focus effect. Great for women of a certain age; flattering but not very, um, truthful. The sound is airbrushed. Low-pass filtered, if you will, which despite the metaphor doesn't affect the treble, since the peak is on the opposite end of the spectrum.

Have I managed to make it clear as.. as Vaseline?

You can tune an Orthodynamic and get several plausible and enjoyable headphones out of it, everything from very mellow and laid way back (the way it is now) to extremely detailed, almost psychotic. It's a nice DIY adventure.

Can't say much about the cable on the YH-2, but ericj's experience has been that the Orthos that aren't TOTL do suffer from some cost-cutting.

Keep taking photos as you go. I like the deep reds you got in those last two. I wish the YH-2 looked like that in real life.

.

 

[smeggy]

Quote:

Originally Posted by HeadphoneAddict /img/forum/go_quote.gif Smeggy - how do the new Pro 30 sound? I see they arrived today.

They're not here yet, nothing in the mail. I looked up the tracking info and it just says 'Status: Electronic Shipping Info Received'

 

[HeadphoneAddict]

Quote:

Originally Posted by smeggy /img/forum/go_quote.gif They're not here yet, nothing in the mail. I looked up the tracking info and it just says 'Status: Electronic Shipping Info Received'

Sorry, I was looking up the tracking results for my Super Fat Cat modded Stax SR-001 portable, sent back for further upgrades and bigger caps.

But I did ship the Pro 30, dropped them off at the post office parcel drop box inside the building while the counter was closed for Veterans Day. It should have been logged in by now.

[edit - now I am worried, I dropped it off Tuesday and it is priority mail, but they didn't log it in on wed or thursday. Why would that be? My daughter was with my and can verify that I put it in the parcel box inside the post office.

 

[smeggy]

Looks like it's in a Seattle depot now so all is well in the world

I'm posting yours out tomorrow.

Quote:

Originally Posted by HeadphoneAddict /img/forum/go_quote.gif Sorry, I was looking up the tracking results for my Super Fat Cat modded Stax SR-001 portable, sent back for further upgrades and bigger caps. But I did ship the Pro 30, dropped them off at the post office parcel drop box inside the building while the counter was closed for Veterans Day. It should have been logged in by now. [edit - now I am worried, I dropped it off Tuesday and it is priority mail, but they didn't log it in on wed or thursday. Why would that be? My daughter was with my and can verify that I put it in the parcel box inside the post office.

 

[ericj]

Quote:

Originally Posted by wualta /img/forum/go_quote.gif Thanks to ericj for remembering to point out that important but easily-overlooked point. And to think I was running my #1 YH-100 without vent felt. Tsk tsk tsk. Eric, have you still got Ol' Numba One?

I still have it - though with strut and earcup from a donor frame courtesey of mr. tice.

I had been bringing it to work for a few weeks and came to the conclusion that i didn't damp it hard enough, and maybe it needs a reflex dot as well.

At some point I'll try to look over what some others have done with theirs, but I'm buried these days and it's the last of a long list of projects.

 

[mypasswordis]

Fostex update: Fostex finally emailed me, after I contacted an online dealer about trying to source parts. The email they address they used was parts@fostexusa.com, which now seems fairly obvious. Hooray for Fostex!

 

[wualta]

Quote:

Originally Posted by ericj /img/forum/go_quote.gif I had been bringing it to work for a few weeks and came to the conclusion that i didn't damp it hard enough, and maybe it needs a reflex dot as well.

I know what you mean. To me, the YH-100 was never finished. A very Zen headphone. I'd be thrilled with it for awhile, then one day... Ah. It can be better.

And so it went.

Dot, yes.

 

[ericj]

Quote:

Originally Posted by wualta /img/forum/go_quote.gif I know what you mean. To me, the YH-100 was never finished. A very Zen headphone. I'd be thrilled with it for awhile, then one day... Ah. It can be better. And so it went. Dot, yes.

Yeah, I'm much more satisfied with how my YH-3 turned out.

And of course yamakoax needs to be revisited. I found the appropriate brass tubing to make the koss frame fit the stax cups better, just need the time to cut everything.

If other orthoists have any appreciation for german techno, i recommend the bootleg of Kraftwerk's set at Tribal Gathering in 1997 as a good benchmark. Very sharp transients, and bass notes that hit like a large block of wood against the side of your head. Perhaps not superdeep bass, but deep enough.

Was enjoying the heck out of it with the YH-3 + CK2III amp a few hours ago.

 

[Faust2D]

Not Ortho related but still should be of interest to the ortho crowd.

Just got a copy of Stereophile magazine from winter of 1971/72. J.G. Holt wrote two reviews about SR-3 and Koss ESP9, but he also wrote a very interesting short article about headphones listening. I updated wiki with it: Koss Electrostatic Line Overview - Wikiphonia

 

[HeadphoneAddict]

Thanks for that link!

 

[wualta]

Quote:

Originally Posted by ericj /img/forum/go_quote.gif Yeah, I'm much more satisfied with how my YH-3 turned out.

Interesting. What results did you get from the YH-3 that were superior to the YH-100 specifically?

I should point out that the YH-100 has this weird ability to keep on getting a little better as you tinker with it, but it's not an easy 'phone to tame to one's complete satisfaction-- partly because its capabilities are very high, and any flaw is unacceptable.


Quote:

Originally Posted by Faust2D /img/forum/go_quote.gif J.G. Holt wrote two reviews about SR-3 and Koss ESP9, but he also wrote a very interesting short article about headphones listening.

You can see why Stereo Review's Julian Hirsch, in comparing the Superex (which he didn't know was a Stax in disguise) to the Koss, said the Superex/Stax sounded almost as good for much less money.

No US dealer network in 1971? That explains all the SR-3 OEMs. It's also interesting that the importer for the review was Electrostatic Sound Systems, better known as ESS, the company that brought the Heil AMT mid-tweeter (and the first AMT headphone) to the world. Before they met Oskar Heil, they were selling transmission-line speakers with 'stat tweeters.

It's also good to be reminded that the ESP/9 is that old. Not very many sources (none of them "consumer" grade), much less headphones, were at its level back then. Imagine a world without personal computers, no cell phones, no fuel injection and no decent tires, and you can maybe catch a glimpse of how bad sound reproduction in the average home was. You were better off listening to FM radio. Or reading a book like Kerouac's The Dharma Bums and dreaming of going to Italy to meet stylish women wearing sunglasses on Vespas. Or meeting Vespas wearing stylish women, either way.