Orthodynamic Roundup

[kalbee]

Calipers and/or rulers are unheard of in this industry, of course! That's not how we take measurements.

 

[Tyll Hertsens]

Just wanted to let you guys know that try as I might, I haven't managed to get the Ortho contest article finished today, and have somewhere to be tonight. It's almost done though, so it should be up around noon mountain time tomorrow.
 
 

 

[nick n]

Was out grabbing a quad shot Intelligentsia Black Cat Analog americano, and walked across to the London Drugs to see about the Shure550. There was one box on the shelf so I looked at the side and it seemed to have a life sized picture that fit within the box dimensions, so out came to typical measurement tool I use= whatever i have in my pocket. In this case the Cowon D2.  IF the box photo is life sized as i think it was, then at least the rough measurement of the pads diameter is, drum roll please, about 88- 89 mm roughly. I have yet to find a pad replacement in the range of 85 mm, so I would opt for the 90mm size.
 
That's assuming assumptions are correct. I could buy one and return it but that's a needless hassle and wouldn''t feel right.
 That's a respectable size.
 
ALSO I am SORELY tempted to create an updated modern Yamaha, bring the HP-1000 up to date with this shell. Tell me it doesn't remind you of a modern version. ( go ahead I won't mind ) Strip out the guts and external mic, somehow cram the HP-1 Yamaha driver inside the 40mm area. Roll some pads. Wipe off the white writing. Replace it with HP-10,000. Maybe put MARCO bellini on the side haha
Not sure I wish to fork over the $85-100 for the shell though.  It may well happen, and it could give me the headroom to do a proper damping scheme inside.  Will quit drooling about the idea by next year, possibly

Hopefully someone has one in the local used site dirt cheap.
From past experience though the wireless sets always have a less than ideal cup interior, but maybe the circuitry is inside the wider parts at the bottom of the headbands. I do think it's definitely one of the classier looking cans I have seen in a long while, besting the Philips L1 even. It's the shiny top. Damn shiny things with matte black finishes.
Why oh why did I have to notice this.


I noticed they have the angled driver housings:
Only issue may be the large space there inside the pads that may need taming or shrinking.

 

[Vaughn]

Quote:

Only issue may be the large space there inside the pads that may need taming or shrinking.

I might have a possible solution for that. Last night I was tackling this very problem in my T50 experiment. First I stuffed some small supra aural pads in the chamber. This helped to some extent but the treble was really awful. A pair of XB500 ear pads came to the rescue with their semi open cell memory foam. I cut them diagonally and stuffed them behind the 840 ear pads. This improved the sound enormously, although there are still some issues going on with the treble I need to sort out. Back chambers are lined with creatology foam and stuffed with raw wool fiber. I drilled a 1/4" port in the cups and backed it with the black filter material in the original cups. I'm definitely getting the soundstage I was after, now I just need to sort out that treble. It looks like that memory foam wouldn't compress enough but it actually does. It is a lot less dense than the typical memory foam you see in pillows and mattresses. 
 

 

[nick n]

oh hey that's a good idea. I have some assortments of foams I could try out.
 Do you find the 1/4 port enough? For some reason I had settled on a 5/32 port after some trial and error with things, those are in very small cavity wooden sets though. Not sure how it would translate into a larger rear space. As well I think from what i have read, that if you have wool and things of that nature in there it lessens the need for a larger port.
Those are looking better each time you post them. Love the look and colour scheme. They do look like they are an off-the-shelf pair!

 

[Vaughn]

Quote:

oh hey that's a good idea. I have some assortments of foams I could try out.
 Do you find the 1/4 port enough? For some reason I had settled on a 5/32 port after some trial and error with things, those are in very small cavity wooden sets though. Not sure how it would translate into a larger rear space. As well I think from what i have read, that if you have wool and things of that nature in there it lessens the need for a larger port.
Those are looking better each time you post them. Love the look and colour scheme. They do look like they are an off-the-shelf pair!

Thanks Nick, it really helps to have a stash of headphones to pull parts from

 I really just ball parked the port size. I was estimating from what I had gleaned from the T50rp thread as well as from previous TP clones I had made. The bass is quite good right now, I just wish I could get the treble as good. It isn't obnoxiously bad (like it was with the supra aural pad inserts) but it does become fatiguing after a while. The good part is that even as they are right now they really sound very good with the majority of the  music I listen to (electronic, ambient). 

 

[nick n]

ooops 1/4 is larger than the 5/32, (1/4 = 8/32 ) I always mix that up.  Thing is I didn't want to push it any further because it would be irreversible without opening them back up and waiting for wood filler to dry.
On those two Alder pairs if there was any more bass it would be too much imho.
 
You could always get a cheap bunch of different grommets for the ports and see how it changes, that's be best and easiest.
 
 
So am I correct in thinking the drivers ARE reversed?   Anything notable about that orientation?  What was it about that  which made you mount them that way. Was it easier due to the part of the housing on that side being more flush?

 

[Vaughn]

Quote:

So am I correct in thinking the drivers ARE reversed?   Anything notable about that orientation?  What was it about that  which made you mount them that way. Was it easier due to the part of the housing on that side being more flush?

The drivers are reversed. Nothing notable, it sounds identical to forward orientation. I did that so I could dispense with a separate baffle. Your right the driver only has a mating surface on one side (previously the front), the other side is too irregular.
 
Ok, I've just had something of a breakthrough

 I decided to try the headphones with just the memory foam donuts in place and no 840 pads. Treble issue completely gone, along with deep bass. Those pads were just completely murdering the treble in this particular configuration. I decided to try the foam donuts with Beyer Dt770 pads and this setup is a clear winner. I have lost a very small amount of bass weight (I think) but playing something like Portishead's "It Could Be Sweet" and it seems pretty hefty. The treble is improved dramatically

 

 
Meh, might have been a little too over enthusiastic. There are definitely still some issues to sort out, but this configuration does seem to alleviate the treble spike.

 

[khbaur330162]

Vaughn: Mad kudos. You pretty much did everything I'd ever dream of doing to my T50RP's, but better, and in like... a day and a half. They look siiick. Really nice job.
 
Name 'em.
 
 
Nick: I've been eying those too. Pads look perfect, build looks nice. Not much to complain about, imo... They're advertised on Yahoo! Japan, too, so they've pretty much been relentlessly taunting me. Guess I'm not the only one really digging the look of these.
 

 

[kalbee]

Makes me really want to try them out...! How does the smaller cups/enclosure sound compared to before? The inside shape at least is not as irregular.
 
Just finished my own custom earpads for my HP-1 today as well! Easily said, as long as I don't know how to sow inwards like the way the stock pads are done (has to be machine done) and until I can learn how to cut foam, I'm not gonna get far. Looks funky, sounds terrible! Those are not treble peaks I got, that's a plateau!
Terribly overstuffed these things, and had to do a design change midway. Turns out way too thick and not soft enough compared to stock pads. Comfort is okay but the ear drums would say otherwise. Cannibalized a pillow for stuffing.
 
Well, soon for a mkII pad.
 
 
Oh and I might have understood why there's an extra flap on the underside of the stock HP/YH-1 earpads... its to keep a flatter and more regular shape so that the part stuck by double sided tape would not be disturbed when on the ears. And as safety blanket to get better seal.
 
 
**EDIT** seems by rolling tissue papers and stuffing them under the raised part of the earpads a good part of that treble plateau was tamed... got myself a somewhat smooth hill with max at 500Hz too. Any other ideas I can try before going to mk2?

 

[nick n]

Quote:

Makes me really want to try them out...! How does the smaller cups/enclosure sound compared to before? The inside shape at least is not as irregular.
 
Just finished my own custom earpads for my HP-1 today as well! Easily said, as long as I don't know how to sow inwards like the way the stock pads are done (has to be machine done) and until I can learn how to cut foam, I'm not gonna get far. Looks funky, sounds terrible! Those are not treble peaks I got, that's a plateau!
Terribly overstuffed these things, and had to do a design change midway. Turns out way too thick and not soft enough compared to stock pads. Comfort is okay but the ear drums would say otherwise. Cannibalized a pillow for stuffing.
 
Well, soon for a mkII pad.
 
 
Oh and I might have understood why there's an extra flap on the underside of the stock HP/YH-1 earpads... its to keep a flatter and more regular shape so that the part stuck by double sided tape would not be disturbed when on the ears. And as safety blanket to get better seal.
 
 
**EDIT** seems by rolling tissue papers and stuffing them under the raised part of the earpads a good part of that treble plateau was tamed... got myself a somewhat smooth hill with max at 500Hz too. Any other ideas I can try before going to mk2?

oh awesome!  Yeppers the overstuffing is easy to do, keep it minimal and hold em to a flat surface then press your heap to them also to check.
 
Stitchin inwards is really easy for the inner part.  :
* Place the two halves together like they would normally be ( both good sides facing out )
* Grab the two "tops" and then fold them over so you get a scrunched part of what you would see if you were living cozily inside your new pads
* Make the typical knot at the end of the thread and after lining up the edges of the inside holes run the first stitch through them
* repeat again after lining up a little bit more of the inside inner seams. Just gradually work your way around that way, keeping the stitching as even and not too far into the edges, because after you get all the way around you will adjust them and see that WOW  it's sewn up on the insides!
 
* All I do after that is cut a ring of not too thick foam and slide in around so it's sitting between the pieces and sew around the outer edges from the outside evenly.
 
Remember that depending on how thick the foam will be, with the two halves you cut, one ( the bottom side ) will be the exact dimensions roughly of the mounting diameter, say in that case 70mm , and because you want to have the top arching a bit higher on the earside part, that circle should be a bit bigger (  not too much ) to allow it to expand over the foam, That will allow the top earside to bulge over the stuffing of your choice, just don't use too many cranberries or poultry seasoning....  Have a look as you stitch around the outer edges you will have to slightly bunch up a bit of the top larger side other wise it will at the end be a huge warped mess ( compensating for the larger outer diameter of the top leather ring.
Both center holes can be the same size, but also because you will lose a bit to the folded back stitching from the inside( however far in from the edge you stitch the interior hole ), cut those  holes a hair smaller than what you want to end up with.
 
Does that help? It's what I have found easiest. This avoids stitching a thing that you have to cram foam into after.    I'll post pics. have to do another one now.
 
AND cutting foam is easy too. All you need is one of those smaller exacto knives with a sharp/brand new blade on it. Just work your way slowly around the outside of it to cut the height in half, after you slice out the basic dimensions. I find it easiest to press it down with a tin lid or something that's actually the same diameter of what you want then trace around it.
 Sharp thin bladed exacto is the way to go there.
 
I honestly think the reason there is an extra flap there on the bottom is that they sourced the original pads from something that would otherwise have used that flap to go around something originally. It's whatever the oem pad manufacturer had. I found that on a couple things. If you use decent thin double sided tape it won't matter, so don't worry about incorporating that into a hand sewn pad setup. Too confusing at this point.

 

[kalbee]

Thanks for the tip! Yes, pictures would be lovely, will look forward to that!
Funny because the original cutout of the pad size I made on cardboard was including some space for the inward stitching, but since I had problems visualizing it I gave up and stitched inwards--resulting in an ultimately smaller opening. I was kind of too hung up about trying to sow part way and then flipping it over; the simple usual way, which was not possible for a inner donut.
Then for the exterior since both upper and lower were the same exact size, I had added an extra 1 cm strip on its outer ring. Though seriously, 1cm was way too much.
 
And for some reason, using a knife instead of scissors for the foam never crossed my mind. At this rate of braindeadness I will surely fail any exams in the near future.
Is there a relative extra thickness I should be following? as in height uncompressed (before sandwiching in pleather) and 'compressed' (once sandwiched in pleather). Or is 1:1 the way to go? With the teased out 70% polyester 30% cotton pillow fill I used, I employed something along the lines of 4:1 ratio and it is unsurprising that it's overfilled.
 
T'was a really fun experiment anyway. I just need to build on my sewing speed.

 

[khbaur330162]

Quote:

Have a look as you stitch around the outer edges you will have to slightly bunch up a bit of the top larger side other wise it will at the end be a huge warped mess ( compensating for the larger outer diameter of the top leather ring.

I find counting your stitches and simply imagining the stitch distance to be slightly longer for the larger diameter fabric helps in this regard (i.e. 2 "orthogonal" stitches, one offset at desired angle, repeat). As Nick said, don't go crazy, otherwise it'll be a bunched up mess and you won't get all the way around before you run out of material. That, or steal maverickronin's pattern and just have a separate "depth" section to end up with something like the O2 pads. Did that for my T50RP's way back when and they are pretty nice despite my using cotton. 

 

[kalbee]

Advice taken

 

[khbaur330162]

Whoa, sorry, totally missed your question. My bad. I really couldn't answer you with much confidence. I hope Nick can. My guess would be that because these pads are as thin and small in diameter as they are 1:1 might still be overstuffed. Let's see what he has to say.
 
Edit - You'll probably eat into this ratio with your stitching, though. Could work out.