[Amish]

So I've decided on a pair of LCD-2C's, but that puts my budget for an amp/dac under 200. I've been really interested in the Topping MX3's for their really great functionality and ability to output to speakers as well, but I've heard some reviewers that aren't Zeos saying the distortion levels are quite high, and the unit itself isn't reliable.

In my budget, I could also pick up an Aune X7S, but that wouldn't leave me any money for a DAC. And, I'm also not too sold on using balanced, nor do I feel like I really have a good grasp on how to use balanced.

My question would be if it's worth it to get the X7S simply for it's performance, and stick with it's regular headphone out, while pairing it with just the internal dac of my 2016 MBP 15 for now, and upgrading to a better dac in the future? Or would the Topping MX3 be enough for now, and later down the line I can add an additional amp, and use the Topping as a preamp (set at 0db). Or should I get a JDS Atom or MP Liquid Spark, and spend the remaining $100 on a DAC.

Thanks!

You seem like you don't really know what you want. Maybe hold off on the amp and dac for now and save up money. Those headphones can run off of MBP for now. The MBP can be used as a dac for now anyway (like you said) and then just buy a better amp to power the headphones.

Honestly I'd save up more money and get a nice dac/amp combo down the road. If you really need something now then just get the x7s

 

[awcamaro]

You seem like you don't really know what you want. Maybe hold off on the amp and dac for now and save up money. Those headphones can run off of MBP for now. The MBP can be used as a dac for now anyway (like you said) and then just buy a better amp to power the headphones.

Honestly I'd save up more money and get a nice dac/amp combo down the road. If you really need something now then just get the x7s

You're right about me not really knowing what I want. I haven't really had the opportunity to test out dac/amps, so I'm not positive what I should be spending my money on or if I should be saving up. The reason I'm taking the plunge for the 2C's is because I had the chance to visit an audio store during a trip to NYC, and after trying several pairs from the 990's, 660's, 1990's, some Hifiman stuff, I absolutely fell in love with the 2C's. I figure it'd save me money in the long run to go for something I know I love, instead of messing around with things that almost get me there, especially since I have the budget for it. Problem is in the store, I was listening to them off the iFi Micro iDSD BL's, which are $600, and definitely puts me over budget. They didn't really have any cheaper amps in store, nor were they very adamant about recommending anything from JDS or Schitt.

I guess it just seems wrong to be listening to the LCD's off a MBP, but I suppose to more experienced audiophiles, it's equally wrong sounding to be listening to them off cheap amp/dacs. But saving up for a better dac/amp combo does make sense. Any way I can get a better sense of what I want/need, especially if I don't really have any access to audiophile stores to test out dac/amps?

Thanks!

 

[Amish]

Yeah I hear you man. Starting off with the headphones you love is awesome. The MBP might not do them justice but at least you own them now.

One thing that happens to a lot of people just getting started is they settle for the gear they can afford then quickly realize they want something better. Ultimately they end up spending more than if they just bought what they really wanted early on, hence my suggestion to save up.

The X7S is a decent little amp so I figure you can't go wrong with it. But if you really liked that iFi Micro then you will most likely always have that in the back of your mind.

I wouldn't worry about a dac since the MBP can handle that well enough. Just put your money into a good amp. Or a good amp/dac combo unit.

No matter what you do, good luck! You already have a head start since you bought the headphones you really dig. This hobby can get expensive that's for sure.

To answer your question, if you can't test the equipment then its a hard one. Reading a lot of reviews might help, finding people that use your headphones and seeing what they use might help. Nothing beats testing the equipment yourself. I mean if enough people love something there is a good chance you will too. No guarantee but it can help.

 

[awcamaro]

Yeah I hear you man. Starting off with the headphones you love is awesome. The MBP might not do them justice but at least you own them now.

One thing that happens to a lot of people just getting started is they settle for the gear they can afford then quickly realize they want something better. Ultimately they end up spending more than if they just bought what they really wanted early on, hence my suggestion to save up.

The X7S is a decent little amp so I figure you can't go wrong with it. But if you really liked that iFi Micro then you will most likely always have that in the back of your mind.

I wouldn't worry about a dac since the MBP can handle that well enough. Just put your money into a good amp. Or a good amp/dac combo unit.

No matter what you do, good luck! You already have a head start since you bought the headphones you really dig. This hobby can get expensive that's for sure.

To answer your question, if you can't test the equipment then its a hard one. Reading a lot of reviews might help, finding people that use your headphones and seeing what they use might help. Nothing beats testing the equipment yourself. I mean if enough people love something there is a good chance you will too. No guarantee but it can help.

Thanks for the advice! I failed to mention, one of the things that drew me into the Topping setup was the fact that it has great remote control functionality. I've been working on the layout of my setup, and right now it's gravitated towards being a "living room" esque setup (I live in a studio, so more like couch+coffee table+tv esque setup). The dac/amp would probably be situated on the tv stand, so being able to control it from the couch, as well as the ability to switch between headphones and speakers would be a great plus. It probably won't be migrating to the coffee table due to the fact that it'll probably also be plugged into the PS4 and TV.

I'd like to do most of these longer listening sessions here instead of at my desk where I'm constantly standing and moving around between my computer and drafting table. At the couch, I'd probably be listening from the laptop or phone (LDAC), or watching a bluray with the headphones. I have powered speakers so I don't really need the speaker amp of the MX3 so I've been looking a lot into the DX3 Pro's and all the issues that came with them. Got me into a rabbit hole of headphone impedance vs output impedance, number crunching and what not.

Related question - so I've heard mixed things about the 1/8 or 1/10 rule with headphone and output impedances, and that planar's aren't really affected by this. (DX3 Pro got downgraded to a 10 ohm output impedance when Topping released the new, more "reliable" unit). And I haven't found much anecdotes of people using the DX3 Pro's with LCD's.

Any thoughts?
And thanks again!

 

[PascalT]

Hey all, been out of the game for a while but just went through my storage unit and found a pair of lcd-2s! I thought I lost them in a move. I sold my dac/amp a while back... I'm looking to get back in it

I used an mhdt Havana as an amp before and loved the smooth, warm and rich sound. That was 4-5 years ago and I'm sure there's some newer recommendations in that department of sound signature.. what are yours? My budget is up to $2k. I've seen in this thread recommendations for the violectric v200 and the Kenzie.

Thks!

 

[Lohb]

Hey all, been out of the game for a while but just went through my storage unit and found a pair of lcd-2s! I thought I lost them in a move. I sold my dac/amp a while back... I'm looking to get back in it

I used an mhdt Havana as an amp before and loved the smooth, warm and rich sound. That was 4-5 years ago and I'm sure there's some newer recommendations in that department of sound signature.. what are yours? My budget is up to $2k. I've seen in this thread recommendations for the violectric v200 and the Kenzie.

Thks!

It might be too low ticket that you immediately dismiss it, but Emotiva basX A-100 has the "vintage amp sound" and you can remove jumpers on the front to divert the speaker taps watts output to the 6.3" for older LCD-2s that needed more headroom than the newer stuff.
It was not avail. 4 years ago...you'll have lot more money for a better DAC at the amp price, as I said elsewhere recently. They have
a 30 days return policy maybe if in a country that ships it domestically..

 

[Amish]

Hey all, been out of the game for a while but just went through my storage unit and found a pair of lcd-2s! I thought I lost them in a move. I sold my dac/amp a while back... I'm looking to get back in it

I used an mhdt Havana as an amp before and loved the smooth, warm and rich sound.

How did you use that as an amp? That's a dedicated DAC.

The Violectric v200 is a solid choice for sure.

 

[PointyFox]

The V200 would be fine for the LCD-2, but not for anything sensitive like IEMs. It introduces low level transformer hum.
I'd recommend what I'm going with which is the ADI-2 DAC which is also an amp. It has great measurements and output, but what sets it apart is all the built in features, like a built in parametric EQ PER CHANNEL.

 

[NitePhlight]

recently joined the club myself - picked up a pair of used LCD2F, Fazor edition not for a terribly specific reason but my understanding is that they're (a little) easier to drive than other versions (and also i'm a sucker for the rosewood!).

this is my first major upgrade from a super transparent entry level setup with ODAC > Gilmore Lite (OG /w dedicated power supply) > AKG 7XX. still love the impressive soundstage and separation with this setup, but i'm looking to explore a more musical setup. the LCD2 seemed like a good bridge to cross, and is a potential endgame component from what i hear.

thus far i've been driving them with the same DAC/Amp combo above, and the output seems sufficient? i certainly want to allow ample time to adjust before forming any strong opinions, but i can't help but feel that the ~1W drive power isn't doing these cans justice. the thing is, i'm not sure if it's some preconceived bias or perhaps a taste for these legendary headphones that I have not acquired yet. even more likely is the fact that i am not comfortable enough yet with the circuitry and science to articulate what is missing.

Specs stated on the latest LCD2 F:

Minimum power requirement >100mW
Recommended power level >250mW

So yeah I'm sure they work fine with say 250mW per channel but do they come alive at that power? Do you really get the most out of them? Not in my opinion. I would prefer at least 1 watt per channel myself.

@Amish thanks for this post - leads me to believe i'm not crazy, but do you think that the full potential of these headphones is currently limited by just the amp, or could the ODAC be contributing to the somewhat anemic sound? i'm not quite ready to explore the dedicated DAC rabbit hole just yet, but i do also own an LG V40 which houses a Sabre ES9218P - will probably test this out as an alternative later.

you also mentioned that you exclusively use tube amps with your cans - i was recommended for pairing the Shiit Lyr 2 or Cavalli Liquid Fire (a bit out of my price range though). these both appear to be popular hybrid amps, more than enough power but would these be enough tube for your tastes?

 

[ucan]

Nitephlight: I'm using 'demo' version (or customer return or something) LCD-2 F's that I got for half the list price. While I don't listen to headphones much compared to my speaker set-up, I like to have the option. So, I am not looking to spend a huge amount on a dedicated headphone amp set-up, just an add-on to what I already have (without any cable swapping). I use a Schiit Saga tube amp with my powered monitors which has two pairs of OUTS. I find it simple to keep an iFi iCAN headphone plugged permanently into the second pair of OUTS. I just connect my LCD2's into the iCAN and turn off the monitors if I want to listen without disturbing anyone around me. Sounds pretty good to my untrained ear, although I don't really do any serious comparing. The two set-ups (monitor/headphone) in this case are as follows:

1. Windows 10 running JRiver 25 (with some EQ'ing) > iFi iGalvanic3.0 (USB decrapifier) > iFi IDAC2 > Schiit Saga > Neumann KH120 monitors
2. Windows 10 running JRiver 25 (with some EQ'ing) > iFi iGalvanic3.0 (USB decrapifier) > iFi IDAC2 > Schiit Saga > iFi iCAN headphone amp > LCD-2 F

 

[Amish]

@NitePhlight Well exclusively might be not the right word but yes I'm a tube guy. Most of my amps, dacs, preamps and even my cd player are all tube. I do have a couple of SS amps though and have owned a bunch. I think a hybrid amp would be perfect for the LCD2 and the last one I owned was the Garage1217 Ember II and it was KILLER with the LCD2.The Cavalli would be great with the LCD2!

Yeah I like hybrid amps so I'd be down for one or two. I've drifted from hybrids to straight tube amps but I think a good hybrid offers the best o both worlds. Good power and added dynamics along with a more lush and smooth sound (depending on tubes of course).

Personally I am not a Schiit fan. No hidden meaning or hate here just not for me.

 

[smoothb0re]

@NitePhlight

For a less expensive option I would recommend checking out Xduoo's TA-10 if you don't have a balanced dac, and TA-20 if you do. 10 is a tube hybrid dac/amp combo, 20 is a balanced tube hybrid amp. Both sound wonderful with the LCD2, especially after some tube rolling. The drop.com Cavalli LCX and LCX+SDAC is also a fantastic, affordable option, and the amp has a certain tubeness to it.

 

[dasmodul]

Please chime in what your best amps are for this headphone or educated guesses compared to previous ortho experiences.

Ray Samuels Dark Star. I used to have this combo and it was legendary.

 

[BobMonkhouse]

I just got my Gilmore Lite Mk2 yesterday and listened to it last night for a couple of hours. So, what follows are first thoughts. For the first time, I didn't feel I wanted to EQ my LCD-2f 2019. This amp could be everything I needed because it sounded equally impressive with my HD 6XX and AFO. And it didn't get much different switching between OL DAC, Modi 3, and Topping DX3 Pro. Its sounded definitely more satisfying than my Atom amp which reveals more the differences between the DACs. I don't know now how much these less expensive DACs hold the full potential of the Mk2. Saying that, I still see myself enjoying a lot the different sound of my Ember 2 with those headphones.

 

[Lohb]

I just got my Gilmore Lite Mk2 yesterday and listened to it last night for a couple of hours. So, what follows are first thoughts. For the first time, I didn't feel I wanted to EQ my LCD-2f 2019. This amp could be everything I needed because it sounded equally impressive with my HD 6XX and AFO. And it didn't get much different switching between OL DAC, Modi 3, and Topping DX3 Pro. Its sounded definitely more satisfying than my Atom amp which reveals more the differences between the DACs. I don't know now how much these less expensive DACs hold the full potential of the Mk2. Saying that, I still see myself enjoying a lot the different sound of my Ember 2 with those headphones.

Stock tubes on Ember 2 ?