Zishan Z4 - DAP with Dual DAC ES9038Q2M | Dual AMP OPA1622 | USB 32-bit + DSD | Bluetooth LDAC 24-bit | Balanced 2,5/4,4 | LO/PO 3,5mm

[PiR2]

I have a proposal on how to fix Bluetooth noise. In my case works flawlessly.

The solution:

ZiShan, propose to place the black antenna far away from the 9038IC and battery.

My theory (to be verified by other users) is that: the distance between DAC and antenna doesn't matter. The interference between the concentric wire and the antenna is more important in that issue. The concentric wire terminals (or rather a lack of terminals lets to another dipole forming. It is essential to keep all dipole sources aligned parallel, so it is much better if the antenna is placed, as illustrated above.

 

[PiR2]

FYI
Unfortunately, I also experienced poor QC in ZiShan.

I found several cold solder joints: one of the GND in SD stocked, one of the two terminals on the lower volume button (these two aren't serious because each has a redundant connection). The serious one was related to the F1C100s chip, which led to crackles and noises in my Z4 and sometimes silenced on balanced output.

 

[Setmagic]

@PiR2 Thank You for post. I will check Your method tomorrow. If it's work that will be very helpful. This is additional ant glued to battery?

Yes QC is really bad. I have 4 Zishans devices. And 2 of them had defective from factor. 1 very serious - charging port don't work and impossible to fix it. I just replaced all charging section for new one.
Second one was minor, but still causes shortcuts due to bad soldering as well. Just one capacitor was to close housing and causes shortcuts who turn off device.

But in soldering and modifications Zishans are really bullet proof design from factor. They have protections in boards circuits from overload or too big voltage.

 

[NIKK0]

Hi All,

Just received my Z4, firstly MUCH THANKS to all the posts in this thread - otherwise I'd have no idea how to use this device (came with zero instructions and can't find any other than THANKFULLY here). So much appreciated

A couple of very dumbass questions (have applied V0.1FW)

1) I'm playing via a powered amp & speakers (cheapish older gear, so no balanced connections) - in lieu of balanced options, would I be correct in assuming the best option is the 3.5 LO? Believe this is direct from the DAC and superior to the 3.5 PO as I'm not using headphones. Based on my unbalanced gear it seemed using the balanced outputs was of marginal/if any benefit & would just diminish playback life/battery (plus I don't have the balanced cables onhand).

2) Assuming I'm using the 3.5 LO direct to my amp, would best results come from playback with the volume on the Z4 at maximum (100). So that in theory the strongest signal is received and minimal amplification is done at the amp stage or should I have the volume on the Z4 at a lower level (default is 40) and just adjust the amp to get desired end volume?

3) Are folks finding best to have the EQ on or off? And also any digital filter 'best'? I've just left at default 'fast'...

Thank you in advance and again thanks for this thread & your support for it.

 

[Mr.HiAudio]

an interesting note: when charging, the saturation of the indicator changes (that is, it lights up lighter, less light, lighter, less, etc.)

 

[PiR2]

@NIKK0
I'm also the new owner of Z4. I bought it for possible upgrades and improvements in SQ.

Since the ZiShan employs two DAC chip ES9038Q2 in the mono mode, it is better if works as a balanced source.

Under the following link, you can learn a bit about how to deal with the unbalanced gear.

 

[NIKK0]

@NIKK0
I'm also the new owner of Z4. I bought it for possible upgrades and improvements in SQ.

Since the ZiShan employs two DAC chip ES9038Q2 in the mono mode, it is better if works as a balanced source.

Under the following link, you can learn a bit about how to deal with the unbalanced gear.

Thanks for the reply - good article, as mentioned from what I'd read there was marginal benefit of using it in the manner you linked with an unbalanced amp. Do you feel there would be a noticeable benefit? As please don't get me wrong, what i read may well have been incorrect. Conflicting info makes such thing unclear.

 

[PiR2]

^^^

Benefits come not from the connection but the implementation of the DAC used in Z4.
The unbalanced option in Z4 switches off one of the DAC chips and limits the GND lines.

Edited: I'm not sure about the above anymore...

 

[PiR2]

This is additional ant glued to battery?

Yes, I received Z4 with this kind of antenna glued to the battery.

 

[Setmagic]

Hi All,

Just received my Z4, firstly MUCH THANKS to all the posts in this thread - otherwise I'd have no idea how to use this device (came with zero instructions and can't find any other than THANKFULLY here). So much appreciated

A couple of very dumbass questions (have applied V0.1FW)

1) I'm playing via a powered amp & speakers (cheapish older gear, so no balanced connections) - in lieu of balanced options, would I be correct in assuming the best option is the 3.5 LO? Believe this is direct from the DAC and superior to the 3.5 PO as I'm not using headphones. Based on my unbalanced gear it seemed using the balanced outputs was of marginal/if any benefit & would just diminish playback life/battery (plus I don't have the balanced cables onhand).

2) Assuming I'm using the 3.5 LO direct to my amp, would best results come from playback with the volume on the Z4 at maximum (100). So that in theory the strongest signal is received and minimal amplification is done at the amp stage or should I have the volume on the Z4 at a lower level (default is 40) and just adjust the amp to get desired end volume?

3) Are folks finding best to have the EQ on or off? And also any digital filter 'best'? I've just left at default 'fast'...

Thank you in advance and again thanks for this thread & your support for it.

1) best to use line-out for additional desktop out ofc, balanced is no need to implement.
2) You can use whatever volume You want but in reasonable range I think is 10-100 but best stay with 25-100.
I was tested 3,5 LO with my AD3 amp without volume control and play very well from 18% on Z4 without any distortion or noise.
3) Better to turn EQ off when is not used. Digital filter You can just choose freely maybe fast sharp ones are best according general fidelity. It's don't mean "sharp" sound signature but more micro details.
You can read it in internet.

 

[NIKK0]

1) best to use line-out for additional desktop out ofc, balanced is no need to implement.
2) You can use whatever volume You want but in reasonable range I think is 10-100 but best stay with 25-100.
I was tested 3,5 LO with my AD3 amp without volume control and play very well from 18% on Z4 without any distortion or noise.
3) Better to turn EQ off when is not used. Digital filter You can just choose freely maybe fast sharp ones are best according general fidelity. It's don't mean "sharp" sound signature but more micro details.
You can read it in internet.

Hi SetMagic, much THANKS to you and also PiR2 for your replies - they've very appreciated as this is a bit of a new area for me and so very much learning as I go.

RE: 1) Yes, it goes without saying that as with many areas hifi appreciation is very subjective and a personal preference - so folks will swear certain things make a difference for them while others say no way. In a relatively basic consumer setup - the info I read stated that a balanced source to unbalanced amp, would be of very little benefit.

I suppose the caveat here is that the Z4 does, as PiR2 pointed out also give the additional benefit of applying the 2nd DAC when you use the balanced outputs - so whilst the 'balancing' of the signal might be of questionable benefit, perhaps the 2nd DAC (even the factory stock D9038 one's I have) might be of benefit over the LO.

Perhaps getting a basic 2.5 or 4.4 balanced -> 3.5mm stereo adapter like this, might be a simple way to see if there's any benefit to this?

2) Good to know - my (very LIMITED) understanding was to always try and keep the signal/source strength as strong as possible and then you amplify it as little as required, hugely simplistic I am sure but with generally more distortion etc coming in the secondary phase. The Z4's internal diagram seems to show that when using the LO the signal does not pass through the OPA1622 amplifier chip - so I'd theorise setting the audio signal output to maximum (100) would be best but this might be a very flawed premise.

EDIT: As I suspected I believe this is flawed, when I max out the Z4 at 100 volume - my amp shows and 'overflow' warning - it seems best results gotten from having the Z4 at 40-70 range and then adjust as needed through amp).

3) Will do re: turning off EQ.

Much thanks again for your assistance (and that of others).

 

[Setmagic]

@NIKK0 adapter won't help, don't buy it.
Balanced Vs single ended dosent matter in general for that kind of equipment as portable player.
Balanced can help between DAC and AMP for precise grounding to avoid loop of ground in some extreme situations only. Not in general at all. Differential is not a miracle technology for Hi-End. Everything is about design! If manufacture decided to go for dual DAC and dual amplifier working fully in differential (balanced) it's very important to use it that way for best quality of amplification instead single ended in same equipment. For example headphone 3,5 out in Z4 is not good design.
Aux 3,5mm is fine! And also good quality.
There is no need to worry about 100% of power as well. This is only a gain you can use 25% as well and use Z4 as volume controller if You really need this. You are using internal DAC volume control.

 

[NIKK0]

@NIKK0 adapter won't help, don't buy it.

Setmagic, much thanks - appreciate your advice and ALSO that you took the time to explain it for me - Understand and that correlates with what I'd read - thank you.

 

[Setmagic]

@PiR2 can you remove battery and take high quality picture of PCB this latest version of Z4?
It will be very helpful.
Mine is V5 Yours is V6.

Zishan boss answered: USB-C spdif coaxial for Z4 will be available soon.

 

[rx170ec]

@PiR2 can you remove battery and take high quality picture of PCB this latest version of Z4?
It will be very helpful.
Mine is V5 Yours is V6.

Zishan boss answered: USB-C spdif coaxial for Z4 will be available soon.

Wow, thanks I am so excited to connect my zishan for E30. I’m looking forward to it