[o0genesis0o]

I don't understand how you could consider that "non-offensive treble". I guess our ears are just night and day because I hear a lot of sibilance and thinness that causes me physical discomfort

To be fair, it does have very little energy in the usual offensive regions (3k, 6k). Treble returns with vengeance from mid treble up though. Maybe both of you are right in your own way.

 

[PixelSquish]

Bonneville is the first CFA IEM I demoed, and I love the sound signature instantly. I am still debating which will be my next purchase and Bonneville is very high on the list. One thing I like about Bonneville is the non-offensive treble. The bass is more mid-bass focused but that is what uniquely appealing to me as most of the IEMs focused on sub-bass, for the sake of not bleeding into Mids.

I have a black Bonneville for sale and can also be bundled with the Shure TW2 for an excellent TWS creation.

 

[thaslaya]

I will have to check some of those out - never heard any of them. Thanks

Probably because they are all under $300

 

[thaslaya]

It's of course personal in term of how we hear IEMs, but also I am old .

I'm glad you love them and I wanted to love them too believe me. I still think they are amazing with orchestral arrangements but I hardly ever listen to that genre so it'd be a waste on me

 

[wolfstar76]

I have a black Bonneville for sale and can also be bundled with the Shure TW2 for an excellent TWS creation.

I noticed that, but I need to compare with some other choices. The only thing I am not immediately pulling the trigger is that Bonneville (though still very different) overlaps with my Z1R, I am still trying to figure out what I really want for my next IEM: continue with my favorite signature, or adding something missing in my collection.

 

[Neweymatt]

Let's talk about cables...

Last week I purchased the controversial CA Trifecta after having a pleasant surprise when demoing the IEM. I can understand why some people have mixed or negative feelings about this IEM. At a first glance and just out of the box, with the given cable and eartips, the sound can be a little overwhelming specially in the high frequencies, causing an impression of lack of separation and definition, while the bass overshadows all the rest.

I read A LOT about the Trifecta since the crafting and proposal got me really interested and I noticed several comments about tweaks that can really transform this IEM. And when this happens, it just changes the hobby for many.

Well, I am extremely happy to inform that after playing with different eartips and shifting between the original cable and the PW Audio Orpheus, I finally found a solution that brought me as close to my ideal sound signature as I never been before: and I mean that by even comparing my portable rig to my stereo hifi system and Planar Magnetic Headphones. My final solution didn't come cheap, but all the aforementioned systems costs more than 10 times the price of my portable set.

The final piece to complete my system (N30L DAC and CA Trifecta / Aroma Jewel IEMs) is the 8 wire cable Beat Audio - the Orbit Saga. First of all I would like to give Andrew and Leo at MusicTeck a big shoutout for letting me test the product with my gear. They are always extremely helpful and professional!!

Lets address the elephant in thew room - yes, it is an expensive cable, but it does what no other component in the system ever did. Also, I won't discuss the argument that cables don't make a difference, because in my experience with both speakers and Headphones, I have always noticed improvement with some high quality products. With the BA Orbit Saga is not different: it is almost as if I changed a chip inside my DAC, or attached a separate power supply or even improved the drivers of my Trifecta. Quoting their website, "Even though some may be doubtful, all frequencies are improved with sparkling and airy treble, smooth and sweet vocal, and deep and powerful bass. Moreover, you can experience a whole new level of soundstage and clarity." This is EXACTLY what the Orbit did to my rig.

After listening to this cable (and still listening now, while I write this, with a huge smile on my face), I felt compelled to do a quick comparison between the Orbit and the Orphy which I also own. My objective is to help those who are interested but can't find information or reviews about the Orbit Saga, considering that for the price this is definitely a niche product.

1) Packaging

The unboxing experience with the BA Orbit Saga is pretty similar to opening a jewel box, which should be expected for the price range. Inside the lacquer wooden box comes a beautiful and interesting glass sculpture of a folded cable that will be definitely seating in my office and a raw piece of the metals used in the cable. Its important to observe that the cable doesn't come with a smaller case to store and transport it as it usually happens with cables in this price range. The Orpheus in the other hand offer a very simplistic unboxing experience but offers a metal square case to store the product.



2) Build Quality

I believe the Orbit Saga is the most well made cable I ever touched: the build quality is impeccable: the terminations are golden plated with elegant designs and laser engraved logo. The color of the materials inside the cable is beautiful to look at and despite being a thick 8 wire cable, it is quite lite and flexible - much smoother than the Orpheus.





3) Sound

Both cables are exceptional choices and above this price point the perceived improvement is relative. I was very happy with the Orpheus and never imagined that a cable could improve the sound even more. In fact I've been using the Orpheus with the Jewel and the N30L for quite some time and was very happy with the transparency and signal optimization across the board, especially on the treble. The only negative point of the Orphy for me is the microphonics and how hefty the cable is.

The Orbit Saga has an even more revealing, micro-detailed tuning. It is like the opposite of Orpheus, improving the resolution and the retrieval of details, being complementary to the sound characteristics of PWAudio cables. With the Trifecta, the Orbit Saga addresses all the normal complaints of the IEM (lack of resolution, separation and too much treble) and adjust the wild characteristics of the Trifecta, keeping and improving its unique cavernous bass impact, now with more control and speed. All of a sudden, it is like the the cable bring the IEMs a few inches far from the ears, giving a bone chilling sense of space and air. If you use an airy IEM (as the Trifecta is) the synergy is godlike. I would love if everyone who didn't enjoy the Trifecta in the first experience could try it with the BA Orbit Saga and experience an unique portable hi end analog music experience!


All the characteristics from the system were improved simultaneously - all frequencies, speed, imaging, air, soundstage. It brings lifelike feelings to the music. My rig got particularly interesting because the N30L is not a flat or V shaped DAC, but its very musical. Aligned with the analog mids of the Trifecta and the final transformative adjustments across the spectrum caused by the BA cable, this system achieved a whole new level of performance - its maybe the better sounding system that I ever listened to (for my preferences).

I am a drummer and for me its very difficult to find a system that reproduces correctly the impact of a snare drum or the proper punch with control from a bass drum. This particular chain reproduces the sound not only of drums but also piano, orchestra, voices and even electronic music with dynamics and impact that one can experience in a live concert - and its pretty mindboggling at some points considering that such small drivers are inside the ear and at the same time sounding as if they are punching you in the chest. And this wasn't happening with that intensity, before I added the BA Orbit Saga to the chain. Not even with the Orpheus. So in the end, its pretty clear which cable is the best



At this price ($7,299.00 for the 8 wire) it is difficult to recommend the purchase of such product. But if you have the chance to experience it or the funds to include it in your chain, believe me: it can as transformative and pleasant as buying a brand new TOTL IEM or a DAC!

At the risk of standing on the 3rd rail (again) that is the Trifecta conversation, having to pair a 6k or 7k cable with a 3k IEM to get acceptable sound from it doesn’t make a lot of financial sense to me.

I get that in this hobby there’s plenty of folks with more dough than I’ve got for exotic cables etc, but I’d much rather take that 10k and get 2 or even 3 IEMs that sound amazing with the cables that come with them in the box.

 

[theveterans]

I like the bass on the Bonneville even if it's somewhat bloated and bleeds into the mids. The mids need to be more forward for my liking. The treble is super thin and sibilant though and that's what really ruins it for me. I can eq it down to be more bearable but a $1400 product shouldn't NEED eq to sound good.

I perceive the Bonneville completely differently from yours. Bass never bloated, mids just rightfully leveled for me with incredible layering and nuance riving 3k and up IEMs IMHO, treble is thick and refined (not thin and sibilant). Maybe you just have a bad synergy with tips, cable and DAP. For context, I use Pentaconn Corier Brass tips (tightens the sound A LOT revealing Bonneville's inner refinements all throughout from subbass to upper treble) and Effect Audio Cleopatra Octa (3D soundstage expansion, dynamics, slam, timbre transformation/refinements) cable along with AK SP2000 Cu DAP (still a very resolving DAP).

Also I don't EQ to fix an IEM shortcomings. I prefer to do the physical/analog way (DAP, cable and tip roll) which never fails in tweaking the sound of any IEM.

 

[KuroKitsu]

Wondering if there are treble-heads in this thread .

You called?

It's a bit more nuanced than that though. Otherwise I would have liked the Ragnar

At the risk of standing on the 3rd rail (again) that is the Trifecta conversation, having to pair a 6k or 7k cable with a 3k IEM to get acceptable sound from it doesn’t make a lot of financial sense to me.

I get that in this hobby there’s plenty of folks with more dough than I’ve got for exotic cables etc, but I’d much rather take that 10k and get 2 or even 3 IEMs that sound amazing with the cables that come with them in the box.

At a roughly 30% of an iem's value (My own limit). 6-7k cables would be roughly accepted when flagships are in the 20k range.

Pssst, I claim royalties on that idea UM. Send cheques to my Paypal

Granted, I'm guilty of having dropped $3K recently on a cable so now I'm gonna have to drop 10K on a UM iem now.

I also will now have more cables than iems now so uh yes I do have a bit of a cable addiction

 

[thaslaya]

I perceive the Bonneville completely differently from yours. Bass never bloated, mids just rightfully leveled for me with incredible layering and nuance riving 3k and up IEMs IMHO, treble is thick and refined (not thin and sibilant). Maybe you just have a bad synergy with tips, cable and DAP. For context, I use Pentaconn Corier Brass tips (tightens the sound A LOT revealing Bonneville's inner refinements all throughout from subbass to upper treble) and Effect Audio Cleopatra Octa (3D soundstage expansion, dynamics, slam, timbre transformation/refinements) cable along with AK SP2000 Cu DAP (still a very resolving DAP).

Also I don't EQ to fix an IEM shortcomings. I prefer to do the physical/analog way (DAP, cable and tip roll) which never fails in tweaking the sound of any IEM.

Unfortunately this is just a tour unit so I have only a short demo period and thats with the stock inclusions. Also I only have 1 other MMCX cable which is 4.4 so I did get to try balanced but it came with a $50 iem so its not a great cable (I hate MMCX connection). Eh I don't have to like everything even expensive iems. I'm happy to have the opportunity to hear and review them.

 

[Rockwell75]

I don't understand how you could consider that "non-offensive treble". I guess our ears are just night and day because I hear a lot of sibilance and thinness that causes me physical discomfort

I found it quite non-offensive also. Zero sibilance, not thin. Music library, source, ear geometry, tips, personal sensitivity etc. can also all have an effect. Arguing with someone about who is "right" when you hear an IEM differently has never been very productive. People often hear things differently for a variety of reasons.

Edit: FWIW all the IEMs I've ever owned and loved have sounded fine with their stock cables. I submit to cables affecting sound to a degree-- I have never known a cable to fundamentally alter the character of an IEM to the degree that it can covert it from not good to good or great. For me, cables are mostly aesthetics. YMMV.

 

[thaslaya]

I found it quite non-offensive also. Zero sibilance, not thin. Music library, source, ear geometry, tips, personal sensitivity etc. can also all have an effect. Arguing with someone about who is "right" when you hear an IEM differently has never been very productive. People often hear things differently for a variety of reasons.

Edit: FWIW all the IEMs I've ever owned and loved have sounded fine with their stock cables. I submit to cables affecting sound to a degree-- I have never known a cable to fundamentally alter the character of an IEM to the degree that it can covert it from not good to good or great. For me, cables are mostly aesthetics. YMMV.

Just to be clear at no point in this discussion was I trying to argue or infer the way I heard it was "right" or the way anyone else hears it is "wrong". I was simply pointing out that we are hearing it completely opposite of one another.

 

[Leonarfd]

I for one adore the Bonneville, easily became my faovorite IEM that I really cant live without. When I reviewed Bonneville I give it a subjective score of 5 star on head-fi, this was easy for me to decide on as almost no other IEMs have given me the same amount pure joy.

Already had a talk about @thaslaya in PM about Bonneville, very different than how I perceive the Bonneville. But that is okay, we are sensitive to different things and IEMs is dependent of how our ears are (none are the same)

There is also the bias for what one is used to, most IEMs coming out are tuned very different than Bonneville.

I often hear the arguments about muddy/bleed bass into the mids, then I hear the IEMs myself and think this is sounding good and how it should be. The bass tuck style that I guess is very normal from Moondrop that also many other brands tune with, this sound unnatural to me and not as fun and full sounding. Bonneville is not following the tuck style at all, and since the bass is quite agile it doesn't sound to thick or slow. There is some coloration and more in amount, but that's what makes it so fun and lively.

I hear no sibilance at all when listening to the upper mids and treble, there is good bite on the treble so stuff like cymbals have good sizzle. But never harsh, some music that has a lot of treble emphasis can get tiresome to me. Often it occur more on electronic music and never with acoustic instruments.

If there is one thing, brighter females do lack some bite and energy and this also goes for some instruments. But I dont see it as a downside, more of tuning choice. In return music like death metal have good body and clarity without being to shouty or energetic.

I also love the fun and bold color design, and for others it's the safe black.

 

[Rolu]

I was wondering if the Sony DMP-Z1 is still the unbeatable king of portable/transportable player.. or is a similar performance (but maybe with a different tonality) now achievable with for instance Sony's own WM1Z/M2 as source paired with recent TOTL portable amps such as Brise Tsuranagi, Mass Kobo 475, iBasso PB5

Lotoo Mjolnir maybe?

 

[thaslaya]

there is good bite on the treble so stuff like cymbals have good sizzle. But never harsh,

I think it's this sizzle that I am perceiving as harsh and sibilant. Maybe I'm just more sensitive to it which is very likely. Don't get me wrong I'm glad you and anyone else love them but they just aren't great to my ears and that's ok.

 

[Rolu]

Sometimes when I pick up the Trailli for a longer listening session, the lack of a vent starts annoying me just a little bit.
And while I take them out of my ears to break the seal and shove them back in, I think to myself "Should I just get rid of these?".
Later when I listen to another earphone, I realize exactly what i'd be giving up, and I chuck that stupid idea right out of my mind.