[spatzi]

Doing sound sound comparisons on the same music between x5 with headphones (AKG q701's) and headphone out of my iPad Air, which is streaming flac files off my PC using the IOS Jriver remote app. The ipad sounds as good or better than the x5. How is this possible?

First of all, I don't understand how the stream quality can sound this good. Aren't you supposed to lose sound quality when streaming through wifi?
Second, is the iPad Air headphone out amp really that good? Is it better than previous iPads?

I am shocked at the quality I am getting just listening through the iPad Air using jremote app. I didn't think it would be anywhere near the quality of listening to flac direct off the x5. In fact, it is so good, I may just use my ipad for music around the house as I have access to all 700 gigs of my music from the pc instead of only 90 gigs on the x5. The advantage with the iPad Air is that jremote app is much easier for music organization and playback than the x5. Of course, I have to leave the pc on to do this, and at night, pc noise is too loud to really listen to music without disturbing others in the same room.

 

[krayziehustler]

I've never dropped my X5 but this thing has a really bad paint job. I can see many spots where the steel color is showing and the black is rubbing off. I call them Battle Scars

 

[Ripvanlink]

Ok, just got my X5 in, I can't say I was surprised on the EQ that there was a difference in volume between neutral and all the presets, it wasn't huge, but certainly noticable.  The sender forgot to include the digital coax adapter, which isn't a huge deal because I have no need to use it, plus have the one from my X3, but I figure it couldn't hurt to at least ask if they can mail it out, assuming they come across it.  Right now I'm listening to Rachmaninoff's 2nd piano concerto being played by Richter in '51, I really should order a better copy of this piece given it's my favorite classical piece.  I've heard Richter's '59 recording of this piece is possibly the best ever done.

I see no reason I'd ever take this X5/E12 brick on walks with me, but it sounds quite good for an initial listening.  My X3 is now most certainly my walking Dap, with my rockbox clip+ for some highly portable sweetness...  plus I have my a200p for streaming off my phone...  I have too much stuff.  BUT I REGRET NOTHING!  NOTHING!
BTW, is the beta fw well received so far

Trying to decide if I should update now, or give 2.0 a try first.

Well, the seller contacted me and is ordering a replacement coax adapter for me. I should remember to leave a great rating!

I have an odd sense of humor also and am rather fond of Rachmaninoff. I wish I could help you with the Richter recordings but am not familiar with it but at least with the '59, you'll get stereo, right? With the Symphonic Dances though, I can offer my opinion on the best recording. It's the one on Turnabout with Donald Johanos and the Dallas Symphony Orchestra, however, that's from Vinyl, I can't vouch for the SACD one....yet, though I am thinking of buying it soon. The vinyl is from my long-gone Jadis tube amp days when I experienced the best recording of anything I ever heard, from the gorgeous performance to the great air in the recording with the amazing presence and separation of orchestral instrumentation. I wonder how it will sound with my wonderful X5 which I now proudly possess and the K10 I am intending to get, saving up my rare sheckels for 3 months.
Anyway, I'd just like to tell you, Rachmaninoff is one of my 4 favorite composers, along with Paul Hindemith, Arthur Honegger and Eduard Tubin.
I have the 2.07b fw installed and it's working well w/o any hickups but I am still having a hard time going from the music that's playing back to the choice of TF1 &2. If I press and hold the top left button, I don't get there but merely to the folder song choices and I have to experiment each time to get there. It happened with 2.0 and has not changed. Otherwise, some selection options have improved and I recommend it as safe.

 

[nmatheis]

Doing sound sound comparisons on the same music between x5 with headphones (AKG q701's) and headphone out of my iPad Air, which is streaming flac files off my PC using the IOS Jriver remote app. The ipad sounds as good or better than the x5. How is this possible?

First of all, I don't understand how the stream quality can sound this good. Aren't you supposed to lose sound quality when streaming through wifi?
Second, is the iPad Air headphone out amp really that good? Is it better than previous iPads?

I am shocked at the quality I am getting just listening through the iPad Air using jremote app. I didn't think it would be anywhere near the quality of listening to flac direct off the x5. In fact, it is so good, I may just use my ipad for music around the house as I have access to all 700 gigs of my music from the pc instead of only 90 gigs on the x5. The advantage with the iPad Air is that jremote app is much easier for music organization and playback than the x5. Of course, I have to leave the pc on to do this, and at night, pc noise is too loud to really listen to music without disturbing others in the same room.

1. FLAC is pretty low bandwidth (less than 1mbps) compared to your network speed (usually 20+mbps), so you shouldn't have any quality drop unless you've got a lot of signal interference.

2. Newer Apple products are known for clean headphone out and will sound good. I'd bet the X5 had more detail retrieval through good phones. What phones were you using for the comparison?

 

[spatzi]

1. FLAC is pretty low bandwidth (less than 1mbps) compared to your network speed (usually 20+mbps), so you shouldn't have any quality drop unless you've got a lot of signal interference.

2. Newer Apple products are known for clean headphone out and will sound good. I'd bet the X5 had more detail retrieval through good phones. What phones were you using for the comparison?

I did some reading and can now see that there is no sound quality loss when streaming. I always thought a direct wired connection must give better sound than any form of wireless. I am using akg q701's.

 

[Chris J]

Its not about the maximum power supplied, but the quality of the amplification at each voltage and each power output level. Just take a look at the powerful amps like the sr-71a, the rxmk3b+ and the duet, for the alo and the duet, even when running balanced the maximum output power is nowhere near that of the e12. Does this mean, however, that they are poorer amps? No it doesn't. In fact they are often considered among the most powerful amps, the alo especially.This is because of the ability of the alo and the duet to handle higher voltages and power outputs with less distortion as compared to the e12 and thats what matters.

This part.
It's rather contradictory.
Is the ALO more powerful than the E12, or isn't it?
Not too sure what you mean by the ALO or the Duet have less distortion.
The E12 apparently has 0.005 % THD, how much lower do you want it to be?
Granted, they don't reference the THD spec to any load or power level.

 

[Chris J]

I have an odd sense of humor also and am rather fond of Rachmaninoff. I wish I could help you with the Richter recordings but am not familiar with it but at least with the '59, you'll get stereo, right? With the Symphonic Dances though, I can offer my opinion on the best recording. It's the one on Turnabout with Donald Johanos and the Dallas Symphony Orchestra, however, that's from Vinyl, I can't vouch for the SACD one....yet, though I am thinking of buying it soon. The vinyl is from my long-gone Jadis tube amp days when I experienced the best recording of anything I ever heard, from the gorgeous performance to the great air in the recording with the amazing presence and separation of orchestral instrumentation. I wonder how it will sound with my wonderful X5 which I now proudly possess and the K10 I am intending to get, saving up my rare sheckels for 3 months.
Anyway, I'd just like to tell you, Rachmaninoff is one of my 4 favorite composers, along with Paul Hindemith, Arthur Honegger and Eduard Tubin.
I have the 2.07b fw installed and it's working well w/o any hickups but I am still having a hard time going from the music that's playing back to the choice of TF1 &2. If I press and hold the top left button, I don't get there but merely to the folder song choices and I have to experiment each time to get there. It happened with 2.0 and has not changed. Otherwise, some selection options have improved and I recommend it as safe.

What do you think of the Mercury recording of Byron Janis playing the 3rd Pno Cto?
I'm no expert, but it's one of my favourite classical performances.

 

[WCDchee]

This part.
It's rather contradictory.
Is the ALO more powerful than the E12, or isn't it?
Not too sure what you mean by the ALO or the Duet have less distortion.
The E12 apparently has 0.005 % THD, how much lower do you want it to be?
Granted, they don't reference the THD spec to any load or power level.

Ahh my applogies. I mean that the e12 can technically output more power. And perhaps my usage of terms was wrong. My apologies for that again. What i meant was that at the different voltages and power levels, the alo and the duet can output a signal that is probably technically cleaner and of better quality than the e12 resulting in a sound thats better to most of us. So i'm pretty sure that the degradation of the signal through the e12 would be more than that through the duet and the alo. Again i understand that my use of terminology might be wrong. Sorry about that!

 

[mrsmith1284]

What do you think of the Mercury recording of Byron Janis playing the 3rd Pno Cto?
I' m no expert, but it's one of my favourite classical performances.

Are you referring to the album where he plays 3 with the LSO and 2 with the Minneapolis Symphony? If I had to have ONE album on a deserted album, that's the one I take.

 

[Chris J]

Ahh my applogies. I mean that the e12 can technically output more power. And perhaps my usage of terms was wrong. My apologies for that again. What i meant was that at the different voltages and power levels, the alo and the duet can output a signal that is probably technically cleaner and of better quality than the e12 resulting in a sound thats better to most of us. So i'm pretty sure that the degradation of the signal through the e12 would be more than that through the duet and the alo. Again i understand that my use of terminology might be wrong. Sorry about that!

On the other hand, the E12 is the cheapest of the bunch.

I guess we can assume the other amps you listed sound better for many reasons that don't show up in the basic specs (THD, bandwidth, SNR) the manufacturers crank out!
I've never heard those other amps, but I do know that the Matrix M Stage is a better sounding amp (well, in my opinion!)

 

[WCDchee]

I did some reading and can now see that there is no sound quality loss when streaming. I always thought a direct wired connection must give better sound than any form of wireless. I am using akg q701's.

I actually have the same sentiments i think that wile many DAPs perform well compared to many of the android phones they often aren't that much ahead of the iPhones I'm audio quality. I personally know makers of top level iems who refuse to bring around another DAP on too of their iPhone simply because they don't find the slight improvement worth the trouble. For me, the x5 works because i have a good line out

 

[Poimandres]

Getting ready to use my X5, copying files with the included USB adapter. Is there any pop with ciems (like the jh13fp) when turning the X5 on and off with the phones plugged in?

I charged the X5 initially via my USB 3 port, it seemed to want to load a driver then didn't. When I came home I installed the dac driver which forced me to turn the x5 on. I switched between dac and USB storage modes but could not see a way to eject the x5. Do I simply power it off? It had no micro sd card in it.

 

[Chris J]

Are you referring to the album where he plays 3 with the LSO and 2 with the Minneapolis Symphony? If I had to have ONE album on a deserted album, that's the one I take.

Ummmm, I have those on vinyl....
So I have two albums.
I guess that's how it was released on CD? 2 and 3 together?

To answer your question: Yes, the #3 with the LPO, Pno Cto #2 with the Minneapolis.
Good choice for a pair of desert island discs, though!
.....assuming I can take a few to a desert island........!

I was just listening to the 3rd earlier tonight, very beautiful, a fantastic interpretation.

 

[xp9433]

.... while many DAPs perform well compared to many of the android phones they often aren't that much ahead of the iPhones in audio quality.

WCDchee
I am sure that if you have compared the X5 as the driving force fed a good digital signal (CD quality at least) to any iPhone you will agree that the difference in SQ is quite marked. The X5 is considerably better either on its own as a DAP or taking the feed from say laptop/fidelizer/jRiver.
iPhone or Android phone direct to headphones did not compete, IMO, when I made the comparison.

 

[WCDchee]

On the other hand, the E12 is the cheapest of the bunch.

I guess we can assume the other amps you listed sound better for many reasons that don't show up in the basic specs (THD, bandwidth, SNR) the manufacturers crank out!
I've never heard those other amps, but I do know that the Matrix M Stage is a better sounding amp (well, in my opinion!)

Yea i do think that there are technical parameters which reflect sound quality which arent reflected by manufacturers!