[krismusic]

And you sound so much like a shill for the Smyth, that I did consider not responding to you at all...



"My sense of entitlement"?

You seem to be very conveniently forgetting one basic and fundamental aspect of this whole crisis:

Smyth Research itself makes this promise in every Welcome message they send out to buyers/backers :

"You are now a valuable customer to us and we will update you every two weeks on the development of the Realiser A16."

Those are the exact words from the e-mail I got from James Smyth when my deposit was paid...

However, it is Smyth Research who are far from living up to their end of even that modest promise. I have been a pre-orderer for nearly one year now, and I have received only one update, from Smyth, one which I officially have to request from Smyth after hearing about it from others on this site... Mind you I have not mentioned delays in the production schedule itself, which most people can understand... Just bad communication habits

If you haven't noticed there are backers/and buyers here who are already giving up on this project, and despairing about the prospect of ever seeing the A16 come to fruition, because of the dismal communication practices of Smyth Research... I for one do not find their suspicions and anguish to be misplaced

All others and I are trying to do, is attempting to hold Smyth Research to their own word, i.e. their own promise to keep us informed (which they have dismally failed at), and yet I am the entitled one?

I am "entitled" because I fo not want to give them a free pass for breaking their own word over and over again?

Tell me why I shouldn't call you a shill, an accomplice, an enabler of very dishonorable customer relations practices?

Shill is a very specific term and I assure you completely inappropriate in my case. I have no connection with Smyth other than being a backer.

 

[sahmen]

Shill is a very specific term and I assure you completely inappropriate in my case. .

So is the word "hysterical", as it applies to myself and others who are asking for better communication,

 

[sander99]

Come on guys, there is no need to escalate here. Everyone can choose for him- or herself to join or not to join the action. I haven't really decided yet in how far a want to join, because I also certainly don't want it to become a pestering campaign. But we can discuss that in the new thread.

 

[pcfi]

Smyth Research itself makes this promise in every Welcome message they send out to buyers/backers :
"You are now a valuable customer to us and we will update you every two weeks on the development of the Realiser A16."
Those are the exact words from the e-mail I got from James Smyth when my deposit was paid...

Yes, I got the same email after my pre-order as well. If we're going to be specific about definitions here - it wasn't a promise, it was a statement of intent and it was made after your pre-order (though I agree that it wasn't a great idea to say it if they weren't going to do it.)

and yet I am the entitled one?

You're entitled to a Realiser A16 when the product is ready to ship. You seem to think you're entitled to make demands about how Smyth run their business/communcations. You aren't.

Obviously you're entitled to contact them and let you know how you feel about their lack of communications, but yes: Organising a campaign to repeatedly bombard every Smyth email address you can find (and those of their business partner) comes across as a childish, entitled temper tantrum.

Regular communications won't make the A16 come any faster - so I'm failing to understand why it's so important. What information is actually missing? We know that the units are essentially built and ready to go, but they are still working on refining firmware, obtaining certification and the Exchange web site. If there is no material update to these (they aren't finished yet), then what exactly do you want them to update you with? What they had for lunch?

...this whole crisis...
very dishonorable customer relations practices?

You pre-ordered a product in development, when the manufacturer specifically warned about the possibility of development delays and this is a crisis?

See: hysterical.

Money speaks louder than words. If you feel this strongly then it's a good thing the A16 hasn't shipped yet - you still have time to cancel your pre-order.

 

[sahmen]

Yes, I got the same email after my pre-order as well. If we're going to be specific about definitions here - it wasn't a promise, it was a statement of intent and it was made after your pre-order (though I agree that it wasn't a great idea to say it if they weren't going to do it.)



You're entitled to a Realiser A16 when the product is ready to ship. You seem to think you're entitled to make demands about how Smyth run their business/communcations. You aren't.

Obviously you're entitled to contact them and let you know how you feel about their lack of communications, but yes: Organising a campaign to repeatedly bombard every Smyth email address you can find (and those of their business partner) comes across as a childish, entitled temper tantrum.

Regular communications won't make the A16 come any faster - so I'm failing to understand why it's so important. What information is actually missing? We know that the units are essentially built and ready to go, but they are still working on refining firmware, obtaining certification and the Exchange web site. If there is no material update to these (they aren't finished yet), then what exactly do you want them to update you with? What they had for lunch?



Money speaks louder than words. If you feel this strongly then it's a good thing the A16 hasn't shipped yet - you still have time to cancel your pre-order.

Whatever! So now a promise is not a promise? Remember the word "shill"? I'm done with this.

 

[Richter Di]

Come on guys, there is no need to escalate here. Everyone can choose for him- or herself to join or not to join the action. I haven't really decided yet in how far a want to join, because I also certainly don't want it to become a pestering campaign. But we can discuss that in the new thread.

I agree with keeping our cool and not fighting each other. We are in this wait together.

Some of asked the question of entitlement. As Kickstarter backers and pre-order buyers I think we are like early investors. As such we could be a helpful sounding board for the developer when they actually use us as such. We are also their biggest fans and are very willing to convince others about the product, but only if we feel the product will be realized in a timely manner.

Regular communications won't make the A16 come any faster - so I'm failing to understand why it's so important.

In my experience regular communication updates are often helpful for project managers to keep them on track.

 

[VandyMan]

We are not all in this together. There are people here posting threats, insults against Smyth, and worst of all, insults against other Head-Fiers. I want nothing to do with it. I would not sign my name to anything signed by a couple of posters here, particularly the fellow who suggested bringing a gun to CanJam LA, who I see posting his nastiness again.

Emailing Smyth, posting complaints to HeadFi/Facebook/Kickstarter, by all means, please do. Joining a campaign with this lot to make demands of Smyth? Count me out.

 

[JohnEW]

Everyone who has ordered an A16 should know by now how erratic the Smyth communications can be. I know that they said that they would send out e-mails every fortnight but that has not happened. We have also had expected delivery dates which has passed. Not good communication on their part I agree but on Kickstarter they have given updates. (Not always every 4 weeks) shown images and every update gives a bit more information about the position of the product. Nobody likes delays but there may be a completely innocent reason for the delays. The Kickstarter update June 2018 did detail the work that still had to be done, the amount of programming and testing may have taken more time than expected. There may be delays in the certification process. We may not get updates on a regular timescale , but they finally do come through Kickstarter, and usually informative on the production and delays of the A16.

 

[mrtim6]

To the headfi members who are suggesting a joint email approach is unreasonable, nasty or whatever other comments you made.

I hardly call wanting what we were promised- “updates every fortnight” which Smyth advised as unreasonable.
I was also sent emails from the Smyths saying the A16 would ship in September 2017 and then December 2017 and so on.

I and anyone else who has paid their money has the right to be informed of progress - especially if the vendor has said THEY will send email updates. They will be shipping on such and such date.

I’m not demanding, I’m asking for the Smyths to honour THEIR written promises nothing more.

There has been a fair bit of negativity in this thread, however when it comes down to it the above points are the essence of what’s going on. If that is not fair then I suggest you stop commenting on this thread as your comments are also of zero benefit to anyone.

 

[Sanctuary]

Regular communications won't make the A16 come any faster - so I'm failing to understand why it's so important. What information is actually missing? We know that the units are essentially built and ready to go, but they are still working on refining firmware, obtaining certification and the Exchange web site. If there is no material update to these (they aren't finished yet), then what exactly do you want them to update you with? What they had for lunch?

See: hysterical.

Exactly. But for some, any information, no matter if it's actually relevant seems to be better than no information. There didn't seem like there was much left to do other than what they already told us they were doing anyway. Finishing the UI, and then sending it in for certification. If we haven't received a notice about either yet, then it's likely that neither has happened yet...

Causing a disruption isn't going to make those events happen any sooner. If we didn't hear anything closer to the end of this month, then I'd be getting crappy, since it was another missed "deadline", but they haven't missed it yet other than sending out regular updates. But that's a ship that has sailed a long time ago anyway. This is nothing new.

 

[VandyMan]

If that is not fair then I suggest you stop commenting on this thread as your comments are also of zero benefit to anyone.

Interesting how quickly you went from we are all in this together to my way or the highway. This is the kind of talk you expect us to put our names behind?

 

[krismusic]

This is getting silly. I Suggest that anyone who wants to email Smyth does and anyone who doesn't does not.

 

[mrtim6]

Interesting how quickly you went from we are all in this together to my way or the highway. This is the kind of talk you expect us to put our names behind?

Don’t put words in my mouth - I did NOT EXPECT you to put your name behind anything... Nor did I ever say “my way or the highway”
I SUGGESTED comments that are of zero benefit are basically derailing this thread.

I SUGGESTED we have a consensus requesting for Smyths to provide progress updates no more no less. I invited all to make their suggestions known.

Your free to do what you want.

What positive suggestions do you have?

 

[VandyMan]

Don’t put words in my mouth

You will note that I did not put any part of what I said in quotes. I was characterizing your comments, not quoting them.

Your free to do what you want.

I'm so relieved. Thank you!

What positive suggestions do you have?

You should request a refund. I know for a fact that the Kickstarter units were sold at a loss. I suspect many of the early pre-order units were as well. It should be no problem getting a refund. If you try and they turn you down, please let us all know.

 

[musicday]

Still over 3 weeks left of this month. Lots can happen. Let's stay calm and wait for an update and hopefully shipping will begin in September as mentioned by Smyth earlier.