[gimlet]

I hope my question isn't too far up the stupid scale, but can someone explain to me (preferably like I'm 5) what "rooms" are in the context of this statement? : "All 149 Dolby Atmos listening rooms, 50 DTS listening rooms, as well as the 28 Auro-3D listening rooms included with the Reailser A16 have been tested and are fully functional with Omega 96 Pro!"

This puzzled me too - according to my A16 menu, it has 32 listening rooms for each of Atmos, DTSX and PCM, plus 12 for Auro-3D. Of course, each listening room can have multiple speaker layouts - so perhaps the statement is referring to listening room and speaker layout combinations? Maybe someone with more knowledge can comment.

 

[DenverW]

I appreciate the points you are making - they were front of mind for me also. Responding to your points above:

1. Warranty - The Smyths had the misfortune of launching a high-end product far below cost (in the kickstarter) and were then hit by a major supplier problem together with Covid. A short read on this thread will give you a sense of some people's understandable frustration. On the other hand, my personal experience of the product (now in constant use for almost 3 years) has been very solid. Only one hardware fault arose (red screen requiring re-soldering) which was promptly recognised and fixed by the Smyths within a couple of weeks. Rapid response to emails and no charge for the fix, even though I had owned the unit for 18 months.

2. Ease of use - I am a 63 year old who has some limited tech and audio background. Learning to use the A16 was a whole new challenge for me, but no more difficult than mastering a new PC back in the day (although the A16 has been far more reliable!). It isn't totally straightforward, and you do have to print and read the manual, as well as look at the YouTube setup videos. But, even with that up-front time investment, you get a huge payback in terms of possible new speakers, overall sound quality and a complete transformation in the headphone experience. I managed to short-cut the initial experience by avoiding PRIR and HPEQ measurements - using Sennheiser 800 headphones allows you to leverage the default Smyth settings. You may find, as I did, that the default BBC room PRIRs are perfectly acceptable as you start to experiment with the A16. So I was effectively listening to music and watching movies within a couple of hours, before moving to more advanced settings. Another option is the pre-measured PRIRs available from John at 3Dsoundshop - you can experience his speaker measurements for Dutch & Dutch, Genelec and Omega speakers and many others - all are excellent, especially the Omega 65 and 96.

3. Resale - I have been considering another A16 for my second home so scan the market regularly. First, there are very few out there for sale at any time, mostly through Head-Fi or other specialist sites. Smyth has a very limited dealer network (one in France and one in the USA, as far as I know). And typical prices seem to be the same or above equivalent hi-fi prices - so 70% or more of new prices, and even more in some cases. So I wouldn't expect the resale value to be a problem, as long as Smyth are in business, and hopefully much longer.

Conclusion - Honestly, this has become my most-used piece of hi-fi and home theatre kit, to the extent that I use it more than all my other 2 systems put together. Living in an apartment with a spouse who doesn't share my taste in music and films - it's a potential marriage saver! By the way, I also recommend the original Sennheiser HD800 as the main pair of headphones for the A16. The tonal flexibility and robustness of the HD800 headphones makes them ideal for the A16, and the bass quality is astonishing. Even a used pair with worn pads can be fully upgraded to new at a reasonable price - Sennheiser has a fantastic spare parts service. You will have a learning curve for sure - but it is well worth the time and effort.

That’s a great post, thank you a ton! James hasn’t replied to my emails so I ended up going a different route, but I’m still a preorder, and if he does get back to me I’ll potentially move forward in the future.

 

[zdjh22]

I hope my question isn't too far up the stupid scale, but can someone explain to me (preferably like I'm 5) what "rooms" are in the context of this statement? : "All 149 Dolby Atmos listening rooms, 50 DTS listening rooms, as well as the 28 Auro-3D listening rooms included with the Reailser A16 have been tested and are fully functional with Omega 96 Pro!"

There are no stupid questions!

If you look in Appendix A of your Smyth manual, and in the 2.15 firmware release notes, you will find, respectively, the industry standard (?) room definitions ("configurations", meaning speaker labels and layouts) for Dolby Atmos, DTS;X, PCM, and (in the 2.15 notes) Auro3D.

For example, there are 58 defined configurations for Dolby Atmos in 16 channel mode, and an additional 91 defined configurations in 24 channel mode, for a total of 149 possible configurations for listening rooms. Each of those configurations has particular sets of virtual speaker labels, and those speakers in turn have industry-defined positions (see Appendix B for azimuth and elevation angles, and whether a given virtual speaker label is supported in Atmos, DTS:X, PCM, or PCM Custom). Likewise there are 50 DTS configurations, 51 DTS:X configurations, 34 PCM configurations, and 28 Auro-3D configurations.

So what the Omega 96 Pro will include will be a tower or bookshelf PRIR measurement for (I presume) most of those speakers listed in Appendix B at the standard listed positions, which allows for you to setup a listening room matching anything appearing in Appendix A and the 2.15 Auro3D notes. Yes you can only "map" a certain number of listening rooms by type (Atmos, DTS:X, PCM, Auro3D) in your A16, but this means you can map to any industry-standard room layout, with the PRIR measurement having used a speaker at the correct azimuth and elevation angles.

Up to 32 different Atmos, DTS:X, PCM, or Auro-3D rooms can be configured from PRIRs and stored, prior to loading into an A16 preset. But each of the rooms can have up to 149 Dolby Atmos listening "modes" (industry-defined Atmos room configurations), 50 DTS listening modes, and 28 Auro-3D listening modes.

Does all that make sense?

 

[zdjh22]

There are no stupid questions!

If you look in Appendix A of your Smyth manual, and in the 2.15 firmware release notes, you will find, respectively, the industry standard room definitions ("configurations", meaning speaker labels and layouts) for Dolby Atmos, DTS;X, PCM, and (in the 2.15 notes) Auro3D.

For example, there are 58 defined configurations for Dolby Atmos in 16 channel mode, and an additional 91 defined configurations in 24 channel mode, for a total of 149 possible configurations for listening rooms. Each of those configurations has particular sets of virtual speaker labels, and those speakers in turn have industry-defined positions (see Appendix B for azimuth and elevation angles, and whether a given virtual speaker label is supported in Atmos, DTS:X, PCM, or PCM Custom). Likewise there are 50 DTS configurations, 51 DTS:X configurations, 34 PCM configurations, and 28 Auro-3D configurations.

So what the Omega 96 Pro will include will be a tower or bookshelf PRIR measurement for every one of those speakers listed in Appendix B at the standard listed positions, which allows for you to setup a listening room matching anything appearing in Appendix A. Yes you can only "map" a certain number of listening rooms by type (Atmos, DTS:X, PCM, Auro3D) in your A16, but this means you can map to any industry-standard room layout, with the PRIR measurement having used a speaker at the correct azimuth and elevation angles.

Up to 32 different Atmos, DTS:X, PCM, or Auro-3D rooms can be configured from PRIRs and stored, prior to loading into an A16 preset. But each of the rooms can have up to 149 Dolby Atmos listening "modes" (industry-defined Atmos room configurations), 50 DTS listening modes, and 28 Auro-3D listening modes.

Does all that make sense?

I should add that my own measured PRIRs included speakers at various room positions that map well to given pieces of music. For example, an old quad recording might want 4 identical "big" speakers in the corners. I've had to record many PRIRs where I sit in various weird positions to get my particular set of speakers at my desired positions (aziumuth and altitude). In the A16 you can pick a speaker from any PRIR and assign it to a given label in a listening room that you use in a preset (you may have to change the speaker label to match). This new Omega 96 version will give me a bunch more speakers in a wide variety of positions to add to my listening rooms.

 

[GalaxyFolder]

Oh thanks, that was very cleared

 

[mei09891]

Are your headphones plugged directly into the A16? If so, do you have it set to High Gain?

The best advice I have seen is to use a standalone headphone amp with a digital feed from the Smyth. That way you aren't constrained by the volume limits or potential clipping caused by the built-in headphone amplifier in the A16. There are a lot of options in the market - some are mentioned earlier in this A16 thread.

Thank you both! I'm using HD800s with gain setting to low. Sony TV volume output set to maximum with standard dynamic range. Through previous discussions though not totally understand but maybe due to high impedance of HD800s so a high gain might be a better choice? But isn't high gain increased the volume but also increasing the risk of clipping?

 

[gimlet]

Thank you both! I'm using HD800s with gain setting to low. Sony TV volume output set to maximum with standard dynamic range. Through previous discussions though not totally understand but maybe due to high impedance of HD800s so a high gain might be a better choice? But isn't high gain increased the volume but also increasing the risk of clipping?

My understanding is that high gain relates to the analog stage of the Smyth headphone amp, so less risk of digital clipping. I use medium gain for my HD800s - they go loud without clipping.

 

[mei09891]

My understanding is that high gain relates to the analog stage of the Smyth headphone amp, so less risk of digital clipping. I use medium gain for my HD800s - they go loud without clipping.

Appreciate! I will try to increase the gain later tonight.

 

[gimlet]

Recommend that you move the gain switch before turning on your A16 - otherwise you may get unpleasant noise in your headphones.

 

[sander99]

My understanding is that high gain relates to the analog stage of the Smyth headphone amp, so less risk of digital clipping.

That is correct.

Recommend that you move the gain switch before turning on your A16 - otherwise you may get unpleasant noise in your headphones.

Yes.

@mei09891: I also recommend to switch the automatic volume limiter on again, and never switch it off.

 

[dsperber]

While playing UHD movie "Alita" via PS5 through Sony X95K, I've noticed auto volume limiter working behind and always decrease volume to about 64 around and it is too quiet for me. So I turn off this feature then the volume finally becomes stable but sometimes clipped. Does anyone know how to fix this problem?

Have you adjusted the "Max HP Volume" in "Audio Settings", as shown on page 37 of the user manual?

I've increased my own "Max HP Volume" (for just my User A, which is all I ever use) digital output volume to 89. This allows me to increase the A16 digital volume above the default 79, if for some reason that's appropriate or I feel necessary, if the incoming level of your source is abnormally low. And I don't ever get clipping, likely because the incoming signal is probably very low in the first place. Kind of depends on your source level, which is really acting as a "preamplifier" feeding the A16. So you should consider adjusting the output level coming from the PS5?

With multiple devices from source to your ears, each of which potentially has its own volume control, it's sometimes challenging to find the proper combination of values for the series of components. I myself don't use the A16's headphone amp or "gain". I have an optical output feeding SVS digital 2.0 stereo PCM optical output from the A16 to an external Audio-GD NFB9 DAC, which in turn feeds analog XLR to my Stax SRM-007tII headphone amp, which supports my Stax SR-009 headphones.

The DAC has a digital output volume control which I've got set to near-max (i.e. "line") of 46 out of 47. The SRM-007tII amp has a rotary output volume control which I've got set to "2 o'clock" (with 7 being lowest and 5 being highest and 12 being mid-point).

I've found that these combined available volume settings, along with establishing an initial volume level of 70 for all of my presets:

typically produces proper and comfortable normal listening volume through my headphones, without my having to adjust anything... ever. Maybe occasionally up a bit (to A16 volume of 71 or 72, maybe 73 or even 74 if the source is low, and sometimes dropping it down to 69 or 68 if it's too loud). Never do I recall going further out of that range. And I cannot recall experiencing "clipping" since the very first days of my A16.

Sure, it obviously varies based on the source device and source content you're are watching at the moment. And even with instantaneous bursts of outrageous sound occasionally. But I've got a Roku Ultra, ATV4K, Shield Tube, Oppo 203 feeding discs + cable HDTV (from Windows Media Center HTPC), and Zapperbox M1 as well as SiliconDust Flex-4K boxes for OTA/ATSC 1.0/3.0 HDTV, being all of my various sources feeding audio to my A16. I've got lots of digital sources, all operating at their "default" volume output levels whatever that might be (and it is generally not even adjustable). And this combination of settings and multiple volume levels has turned out to be fine and adequate for everything. I haven't experienced clipping since my early days of learning about all of my equipment a few years ago. And I haven't adjusted the two volume controls on the DAC (46) and headphone amp (2 o'clock) since I can't remember when.

I suspect your PS5 output is too "hot".

 

[VandyMan]

Sony TV volume output set to maximum with standard dynamic range.

This does not sound right. Setting the TV volume to max may well trigger clipping.

If you are not using ARC, you should be going PS5 -> A16 -> TV. The A-16 controls the volume and the TV just gets a video signal.

If you are using ARC, it can be PS5 -> TV -> A16, but the TV should know that the A16 is controlling the volume (my LG does anyway).

I suspect your PS5 output is too "hot".

I don't think it is the PS5. Others have said they use it. Besides, does it even have a volume control?

Have you adjusted the "Max HP Volume" in "Audio Settings", as shown on page 37 of the user manual?

Those settings are unrelated to his issue with clipping.

 

[sander99]

I've increased my own "Max HP Volume"

As VandyMan said, unrelated to the problem. The automatic volume lowering is triggered by digital clipping and has no relation to this manually set maximum.

I suspect your PS5 output is too "hot".

No. If the PS5 output was lower then the digital clipping would start at a higher (digital) volume setting of the A16 but at the same netto analog output level (using the same gain setting).
Increasing the gain setting is the way to get a higher output level before clipping starts. (And if that is not enough then an external amp or DAC/amp is a solution).

@dsperber: you may wonder why @mei09891 gets clippin at a much lower A16 volume setting than what you use but that can also be related to the HPEQ and PRIR that he is using, see next quote:

At what volume setting the clipping starts depends on many things. How loud are the virtual speakers? What frequencies are lifted by how much in the overall process, for example because the measured speakers/room had peaks, or the headphone had dips that needed to be EQd up, what frequencies are present at what level in the input channels? That is why it is hard to predict, if all above combines in an "unlucky" way the clipping starts at a lower volume level.

 

[mei09891]

Many thanks to @gimlet @dsperber @VandyMan and @sander99

---

This is the way I connect these device:

1. PS5 connected to Sony Bravia.
2. A16 output HDMI connected to Sony Bravia eARC, so Bravia will detect A16 as AV receiver.

I've just increased the gain as @gimlet recommended, tested with Alita, no clipping anymore!

This does not sound right. Setting the TV volume to max may well trigger clipping.

The setting in Bravia is "PCM digital audio output volume" which set to maximum by default. Not sure if I should change this setting, I thought the audio source volume should set to maximum to avoid distortion by gain afterward.

 

[VandyMan]

The setting in Bravia is "PCM digital audio output volume" which set to maximum by default. Not sure if I should change this setting, I thought the audio source volume should set to maximum to avoid distortion by gain afterward.

Glad you were able to resolve the clipping issue. That setting may be fine because according to Sony it only applies to the optical digital output, not HDMI output. You can confirm that your TV is not messing with the source audio by playing something in Atmos from the PS5, and then checking that you A-16 shows that it is getting Atmos. If that works, you are all good. For best results, you really don't want the TV to modify the audio before it is sent to the A-16.