[Goldlion973]

Brilliant... glad I found you guys... kid cousins snapped the needle thin, ''lets put all the effort into the drivers and forget that pretty much everything depends on build quality'' wires on my IGrados and as I sat there in my car looking down at them I felt nothing but pity for the workers at grado mulling over the cost of decent supplies and a profit margin and decided to lend a hand....first thought to affix 3.5 sockets into them but as the headphones are plastic I decided otherwise as they would need to be housed inside the casing.... so I took the jack end off a two into one cable using the two female sockets and the short length of wire to attach to the speakers... made them extend so I now have two sockets to plug into... problem is I'm new to all this so have got myself into a bit of a twist...

At first I could only find a mono two to one cable and end... thought to use those hoping (excuse my novice-ness) to keep both channels independent of each other, thought that if I used a stereo cable into each ear they wouldn't pan from right to left when the music does and so on as each would carry both channels....? Anyway... ended up finding a stero two to one and using that and it seems as though I was right... they don't pan when playing my favorite Hendrix track they also cut off every now and then which is lame so I was hoping for some help...

Basically have little idea as to what I'm doing but noticed that in the mono two to one I had two sets of copper wires to play with when I opened them up, one I think is for grounding and the other two for each channel? On the stero cable I have two extremely thin red and white wires for each channel? Basically had no idea about so I soldered one set (grounding?) to one side of the speaker and the red and white into the other... plays for a while but as said, they don't pan and they cut out on occasion.... am thinking that the red and white are for each side but am not sure what to do with the main ''grounding'' wire.... with a plug it seems simple but direct to the headphones its got me baffed.

Will upload photos tomorrow... they pretty much work and look quite good as they are but sound wise they're failing me... need that panning action and cant be having headphones that cut off periodically.

Any help would be appreciated

Peace
Goldlion

 

[nickchen]

Quote:

Originally Posted by pdupiano /img/forum/go_quote.gif Wait a sec, I'm not saying that the grado quality is a crapshoot (ie, you get good/bad versions of the rs1 etc..) I'm saying that grado drivers come off the line more in terms of a bell curve. The average turn out to become the SR60/80, a bit higher the Sr125/225, a bit higher the SR325, then the RS1/2, and lastly the gs1k and the ps1k's.

I guess we have already understood you correctly on occasion of your 1st post. However, if that is Grado's real procedure, there must be indeed the better and worse versions of one model that so many people have experienced. Even if they have a person with bat ears doing the job of sorting the drivers, there will be spreads due to that person's physical and mental state on the respective day.

Other brands aren't that superior in that respect either. On one of our last kraut meets, we could compare 3 K701s, the differences in the bass section also were startling (and it wasn't the pads!).

 

[BoilermakerFan]

The drivers are not quite all picked from the same lot, the RS2 and up are built on different tooling with different materials, the SRs from their own. The bell curve applies to a point, but it's not quite that exaggerated, it's subtle. The RS1s are the mid point for the higher end, then the PS1Ks coils are wound with a different wire to really separate their sound sig and performance. The doping materials used on the GS1Ks and PS are different than the RSs too. The coil wire used on the 60/80s is probably a lower grade as well as a cheaper grade of Mylar for the cone, the 125s/225s/325s use the same wire and same magnets, then the production curves sort them into their respective models. Sorting is done after a short burn in to separate dud drivers, then they are matched on test equipment, not by ear. Production equipment and production processes have certain capabilities, but they do not vary quite as much as all the RS drivers coming from one lot of production from all the same materials. I would suspect if you are sorting into general groups, then the most popular selling headphone, either the 125s, or the 225s, becomes the main grouping. Let's use 225s for ease of explanation. If the 225s are the most popular, then the 325s are probably the upper 10-15% of the driver lot, the lower 20-30% would be the 125s. So even within a lot of sorted drivers for a particular headphone, you may see the large variations Nick has noted.

What makes H-F unique is that so many of us get together and audition equipment and a few have heard many different examples of the same headphone. But, we're still a minority of the total number of headphones produced and sold by Grado worldwide and most buyers don't care or will never hear more than one or two SR-225s. They probably hear the store demo, then their own when they get home. Any SQ differences are shrugged off as differences in gear and the new owner is typically happy.

I forget which OP noted the changes in the Grado cartridges, but you are correct to a point, the difference between two models is simply the top 5% are the next level up for that particular set, such as the Silver and Gold. The Blue and Red use the same wire, magnet, and stylus component, but once the Reds come to the surface, Grado tweaks the stylus on the Reds for even better performance. The Gold stylus will fit my Green cartridge and improve the performance, but the Green lacks the Gold's wire and magnets in the cartridge so it will never even approach the performance of a Silver simply because it cannot react to or pick up the much smaller detailed vibrations the Gold is capable of producing. That was from John himself during a 45 minute phone conversation. He told me to save my money and either buy a blue stylus for an upgrade or keep saving for a Silver cartridge which was very close in cost to just a Gold stylus. His recommendation of Silver over Gold was specific to my TT and setup too.

The tooling to make the Prestige line of cartridges and the SR line of drivers is the same for their intended products, but the materials used such as the wire, magnets, or Mylar can be (and is) varied for the desired results, or at least varied to try to obtain the desired results.

What do you call the person who graduates from medical school with the lowest GPA? Doctor. What do you call the person who graduates medical school with the highest GPA? Doctor. Both met the minimum requirements to earn a doctorate or medical degree. Now, who do you want performing surgery on your heart?

Unfortunately, finding the top of the class n a Grado headphone model isn't so easy...

 

[nickchen]

Where did you get that knowledge from?

 

[BoilermakerFan]

Quote:

Originally Posted by nickchen /img/forum/go_quote.gif Where did you get that knowledge from?

It's general practices in manufacturing, combined with a lot of info John shared with me when we discussed the phono cartridges. I was really surprised how much info he volunteered as it related to manufacturing cartridges. The same principles apply to headphone drivers, computer CPUs, etc...

 

[scar]

phew! what an amazing thread. i have actually read through almost all of it, just skipping about posts 80-150 since that was a long time ago! a round of applause for all the talent here at H-F! i've learned so much already, thanks!

i notice this thread is mostly concerned with upgrading the prestige series 125 and 225. are there any worthwhile mods for rs1i?

 

[limpidglitch]

Quote:

Originally Posted by scar /img/forum/go_quote.gif phew! what an amazing thread. i have actually read through almost all of it, just skipping about posts 80-150 since that was a long time ago! a round of applause for all the talent here at H-F! i've learned so much already, thanks! i notice this thread is mostly concerned with upgrading the prestige series 125 and 225. are there any worthwhile mods for rs1i?

Most Grado mods works with RS1i, it's just that some cheap black plastic has a lower modification threshold than some fancy mahogany. Basically it's a bit scary messing with them since they're so expensive.

Basshead and other pad related mods on the other hand are pretty low-risk

 

[pdupiano]

I finally got around to doing the mesh mod on my gs1k's that I've put off all summer... sad really
Here's a side by side pic, the one on the left has the original mesh the one on the right has a painted McMastercarr mesh. I also found out that if you have a gs1k mesh that's a little discolored (a nick or two and the silver shows.. oh and it shows), you can just "pencil it in" using a black marker, or a bit of touch up paint. You can also take the whole thing out and repaint it.

This one is with the mcmastercarr grills installed

I'm trying to debate whether or not to use a detachable cable for the gs1k's and if I want to use a 1/8" plug or use the sennheiser pugs for it.

 

[les_garten]

Quote:

Originally Posted by pdupiano /img/forum/go_quote.gif I finally got around to doing the mesh mod on my gs1k's that I've put off all summer... sad really Here's a side by side pic, the one on the left has the original mesh the one on the right has a painted McMastercarr mesh. I also found out that if you have a gs1k mesh that's a little discolored (a nick or two and the silver shows.. oh and it shows), you can just "pencil it in" using a black marker, or a bit of touch up paint. You can also take the whole thing out and repaint it. I'm trying to debate whether or not to use a detachable cable for the gs1k's and if I want to use a 1/8" plug or use the sennheiser pugs for it.

Nice! Do you have a link to the site where you got the mesh? I like the looks of that. Also a brief discussion of how you got them apart and changed out the mesh would be nice.

 

[pdupiano]

Sorry mate, I wish I had more info other than it was from Mcmaster carr. I bought the mesh and a pair of sr60's from JLai a few months ago. He wanted to mod his sr60's but was never able to complete the job. I got the sr60's and modded them and useed the remainder mesh to mod the gs1k's.

As for opening the gs1k's I think we had this discussion before, a lot of patience. It took me a while to take off every bit of glue in front of the drivers, but it was well worth it since the drivers came off perfectly. It's a lot of work, I'll be the first one to admit it, but trust me its well worth it. The pictures of my gs1k cups are still in the DIY forum, you can see for yourself, every bit of glue was picked out.

 

[bass_nut]

Quote:

Originally Posted by migui912 /img/forum/go_quote.gif Alright. I already acknowledged your point that covering the cups isn't the best way to prove anything. But maybe you didn't see that. I asked that if I did remove the screen and thus making it more freelowing and perceived better SQ, then what? Doesn't that mean that it was the screen that made a difference and not the cups? We're already past "covering the cups" so you're no longer obliged to bring those up again. The question I'm asking now is what now if removing the screen gives a perceivable change in SQ? Because IMO, that simply says that it's the screen that matters and not the cups.

Quote:

Originally Posted by migui912 /img/forum/go_quote.gif <snp> That statement was said to further prove les_garten's point that the more freeflowing the screen is, the better. Hence, covering the cups with one's hands makes the headphone sound worse.

huh ?! you were the one trying to prove increase airflow for better SQ through your reverse method (plugging the cups/decreasing airflow), not me.... i simply suggested removing your sr80 screen to increase airflow instead of the reverse way you did... now if you are interested with SQ change through cups mods maybe you should grab wood or metal cups for your sr80 and share your findings ?

 

[scar]

Quote:

Originally Posted by limpidglitch /img/forum/go_quote.gif Most Grado mods works with RS1i, it's just that some cheap black plastic has a lower modification threshold than some fancy mahogany. Basically it's a bit scary messing with them since they're so expensive. Basshead and other pad related mods on the other hand are pretty low-risk

thanks. is there anything to be gained from re-cabling? the cable is UHPLC copper. what is "basshead"?

 

[insyte]

Quote:

Originally Posted by BoilermakerFan /img/forum/go_quote.gif The drivers are not quite all picked from the same lot, the RS2 and up are built on different tooling with different materials, the SRs from their own. The bell curve applies to a point, but it's not quite that exaggerated, it's subtle. The RS1s are the mid point for the higher end, then the PS1Ks coils are wound with a different wire to really separate their sound sig and performance. The doping materials used on the GS1Ks and PS are different than the RSs too. The coil wire used on the 60/80s is probably a lower grade as well as a cheaper grade of Mylar for the cone, the 125s/225s/325s use the same wire and same magnets, then the production curves sort them into their respective models. Sorting is done after a short burn in to separate dud drivers, then they are matched on test equipment, not by ear. Production equipment and production processes have certain capabilities, but they do not vary quite as much as all the RS drivers coming from one lot of production from all the same materials. I would suspect if you are sorting into general groups, then the most popular selling headphone, either the 125s, or the 225s, becomes the main grouping. Let's use 225s for ease of explanation. If the 225s are the most popular, then the 325s are probably the upper 10-15% of the driver lot, the lower 20-30% would be the 125s. So even within a lot of sorted drivers for a particular headphone, you may see the large variations Nick has noted. What makes H-F unique is that so many of us get together and audition equipment and a few have heard many different examples of the same headphone. But, we're still a minority of the total number of headphones produced and sold by Grado worldwide and most buyers don't care or will never hear more than one or two SR-225s. They probably hear the store demo, then their own when they get home. Any SQ differences are shrugged off as differences in gear and the new owner is typically happy. I forget which OP noted the changes in the Grado cartridges, but you are correct to a point, the difference between two models is simply the top 5% are the next level up for that particular set, such as the Silver and Gold. The Blue and Red use the same wire, magnet, and stylus component, but once the Reds come to the surface, Grado tweaks the stylus on the Reds for even better performance. The Gold stylus will fit my Green cartridge and improve the performance, but the Green lacks the Gold's wire and magnets in the cartridge so it will never even approach the performance of a Silver simply because it cannot react to or pick up the much smaller detailed vibrations the Gold is capable of producing. That was from John himself during a 45 minute phone conversation. He told me to save my money and either buy a blue stylus for an upgrade or keep saving for a Silver cartridge which was very close in cost to just a Gold stylus. His recommendation of Silver over Gold was specific to my TT and setup too. The tooling to make the Prestige line of cartridges and the SR line of drivers is the same for their intended products, but the materials used such as the wire, magnets, or Mylar can be (and is) varied for the desired results, or at least varied to try to obtain the desired results.

Very interesting info here

At least now there is an explanation on why the drivers look the same, yet sound differently.

Quote:

Originally Posted by BoilermakerFan /img/forum/go_quote.gif What do you call the person who graduates from medical school with the lowest GPA? Doctor. What do you call the person who graduates medical school with the highest GPA? Doctor. Both met the minimum requirements to earn a doctorate or medical degree. Now, who do you want performing surgery on your heart? Unfortunately, finding the top of the class n a Grado headphone model isn't so easy...

Grades don't matter in the operating room. Id rather get operated on by the surgeon that has a lower morbidity/mortality rate regardless of his rank during graduation. And for open heart surgeries, the anesthesiologist and perfusionist play very important roles

 

[limpidglitch]

Quote:

Originally Posted by scar /img/forum/go_quote.gif thanks. is there anything to be gained from re-cabling? the cable is UHPLC copper. what is "basshead"?

Bass-head mod (tape on the circumference of the bowls):

There is no general consensus on head-fi in regard to the practice of recabling headphones. There is however what seems to be a general agreement on that the stock cable grados are delivered with isn't all that bad, especially compared to similarly priced headphones from other manufacturers. This all results in (depending on how deeply you believe in it) that to sonically improve on a Grado you have to invest comparatively more.
On the other side, if you just want to do an aesthetic upgrade it can be done quite easily and cheaply.

 

[03029174]

Hi, ive got a quick question about the rods. Do they just glue into the plastic frames that attach to the cups? Im thinking about replacing them with something shinier. Has anyone removed them before? They seem to be at a slight angle
Thanks