Orthodynamic Roundup

[RetroE83]

miniDSP EARS arrived, had a complete brain fart, but seemed to have figured out the utter basics. Here's measurement of Chinese planars.





They weren't creating a seal with the EARS so there was severe bass roll off. Fixed it.

Here is Arya and Chinese planar comparison. Arya's have lambskin earpads which takes edge off of sharp treble, ime.

Spoiler: T50RP and YH-1 measurements

Really surprised YH-1's aren't more rolled off in lower frequencies... They are comparable to T50RP's kind of in measurement but don't sound nearly as bassy...

Great job on the Chinese planars! And yeah, I had a brain fart as well with learning the basics of the miniDSP

 

[GREQ]

miniDSP EARS arrived, had a complete brain fart, but seemed to have figured out the utter basics. Here's measurement of Chinese planars.





They weren't creating a seal with the EARS so there was severe bass roll off. Fixed it.

Here is Arya and Chinese planar comparison. Arya's have lambskin earpads which takes edge off of sharp treble, ime.

Spoiler: T50RP and YH-1 measurements

Really surprised YH-1's aren't more rolled off in lower frequencies... They are comparable to T50RP's kind of in measurement but don't sound nearly as bassy...

The horizontal and vertical scales needs to be massively adjusted on these graphs.
Everything in red needs to be cut out.
At a glance, everything just looks like a flat line.

It should be adjusted to look like the 'stretched' version below.

 

[khbaur330162]

Great job on the Chinese planars! And yeah, I had a brain fart as well with learning the basics of the miniDSP

Hey, thanks dude. They sound pretty good, but past two days I haven't been able to get over their soundstaging, it's just not projected in front of you like it is with my YH-1's, it's sort of hard left-right, almost inside your head. I have new earpads coming, maybe those will change things for the better, but fat chance, imo.

Yeah, haha, I was trying to calibrate the right channel with the SPL meter and was like "WHY DOES NOTHING MAKE ANY DIFFERENCE?!" and it turns out I had the ears facing me instead of away, so left was right, right was left, haha. Idiottttt. Trying to measure SPL in right driver with left microphone.

The horizontal and vertical scales needs to be massively adjusted on these graphs.
Everything in red needs to be cut out.
At a glance, everything just looks like a flat line.

It should be adjusted to look like the 'stretched' version below.

Ack. Ty for heads up. I tried editing the "Graph Axis Limits" but it's not really doing what it's supposed to? I looked online for a tutorial on how to do what you want me to do, but I'm not searching the right keywords or something, I don't really know what to search for. Is there an easy low down you can give me on how to do this?

 

[GREQ]

Ack. Ty for heads up. I tried editing the "Graph Axis Limits" but it's not really doing what it's supposed to? I looked online for a tutorial on how to do what you want me to do, but I'm not searching the right keywords or something, I don't really know what to search for. Is there an easy low down you can give me on how to do this?

Sure.
Just click on the Limits button and add your limits.
If it's not working you might be using a bugged/outdated version of REW. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

[khbaur330162]

Hrm. Okay it works, just fiddly, imo. I was able to get something. Is that correct now? I adjusted the upper vertical limit to what looked right, and then set horizontal sides to 20Hz and 20kHz more or less, didn't really mess with lower vertical limits. Looks like your stretched graph before, imo, but Idk if there's something still "wrong" with my measurements? Please let me know if I can tweak further or if this is fine. Ty again, GREQ, for heads up.

And comparison with Arya's again, this time with a little smoothing to make Arya's not so crazy.

Grrrr. YH-1's don't look nearly as nice anymore, and holy imbalance. I HATE how the center pins on these drivers can rotate and torque the diaphragm... I have a feeling something happened to the left driver because there's a WRINKLE in the diaphragm... like visible through the magnet perforations... Can't be good. Sadly, YH-100's are almost worse, they measure similarly all the way down to ~100Hz and then the left driver starts rolling off even harder than the right, it looks terrible, but I never noticed through listening.

Omg... "Falt Pads"... Supposed to be "Flat Pads."

But look at that little bass bloom on the YH-1's @ 125Hz!!! Haha. Who said circumaural center-pinched ortho's don't have any bass? Even better with ~4dB's of bass shelf. And holy natural soundstage, batman, this is what headphones should sound like. Go YH-1's go!

 

[GREQ]

Hrm. Okay it works, just fiddly, imo. I was able to get something. Is that correct now? I adjusted the upper vertical limit to what looked right, and then set horizontal sides to 20Hz and 20kHz more or less, didn't really mess with lower vertical limits. Looks like your stretched graph before, imo, but Idk if there's something still "wrong" with my measurements? Please let me know if I can tweak further or if this is fine. Ty again, GREQ, for heads up.



And comparison with Arya's again, this time with a little smoothing to make Arya's not so crazy.




Grrrr. YH-1's don't look nearly as nice anymore, and holy imbalance. I HATE how the center pins on these drivers can rotate and torque the diaphragm... I have a feeling something happened to the left driver because there's a WRINKLE in the diaphragm... like visible through the magnet perforations... Can't be good. Sadly, YH-100's are almost worse, they measure similarly all the way down to ~100Hz and then the left driver starts rolling off even harder than the right, it looks terrible, but I never noticed through listening.

Omg... "Falt Pads"... Supposed to be "Flat Pads."


But look at that little bass bloom on the YH-1's @ 125Hz!!! Haha. Who said circumaural center-pinched ortho's don't have any bass? Even better with ~4dB's of bass shelf. And holy natural soundstage, batman, this is what headphones should sound like. Go YH-1's go!

Soooooooooo much easier to read now
Thanks!

 

[RetroE83]

Hi all,

I’m new here, but I’ve been following this thread for a while now, gaining inspiration and insight on modding ortho headphones. This forum has been very helpful to say the least.

I thought I’d share some photos of my modded Realistic Pro30. I transplanted the drivers to a Marshall Major headphone chasis, added 2 pieces of 1mm craft felt of varying diameters behind the drivers, mass loaded the cups with blue tac, and affixed Chinese made aftermarket earpads for a Sennheiser PMX200 using blue tac. Unfortunately, I don’t have a measuring rig, but in my opinion the sound is night and day different from stock: I’d say the sound is a bit akin to my Sennheiser HD580 with tighter bass and a little less veiled treble; imaging and separation of instruments is quite good.

Not greatest channel matching.

 

[khbaur330162]

What in the world? How does a little SFI produce so much low end? Had to measure the ATH-2's after seeing your Pro30's...

Spoiler: ATH-M2 photos

Here is Audio Technica ATH-2 (stock housing, lambskin earpads for ESW9's, I believe) and Fostex T10 (stock housing, damping dBel modified). See? Little 40mm planars don't do that, haha.

On another note. I installed Paxmate into Chinese planars and it seemed to help with the sibilance, note the lower 4.2kHz peak. It just took the edge off of things, which is a double edged sword, maybe things don't sound as hyper sharp anymore, but it's more pleasant. Here's new Chinese planar measurement.

I actually really like the way these measure. They sound like how they measure, too. Never heard anything this detailed before except Arya, although I haven't heard a LOT; mainly referring to lower end Hifiman products like Sundara. I wish I had RP-18 to compare because I think these are more detailed than even those. I'm speaking to a guy through Reddit and he is going to try and build the Chinese planars more or less exactly how I built them: same frames, same drivers, Idk what pads he's using and I'll try to help him tune them... We will see what a second opinion is of these headphones hopefully.

 

[Philimon]

Little 40mm planars don't do that, haha.

Depends on implementation. Tiny IEM drivers go down to 20Hz, which are sealed and close to eardrum. Every vintage ortho Ive tried modding can get flat down to 20Hz easy enough. Supraurals can be very difficult to get a seal with minidsp EARS. @khbaur330162 if you look around you’ll find lots of other’s measurements in this thread and some kindly organized like @GREQ ’s collection that demonstrate complete bass extension. T10 modded by @dBel84 Im sure measures remarkably linear from 20-20 with a good seal. Overdamping or underdamping from modding can cause bass to diminish however but I doubt that’s the case here.

 

[GREQ]

Depends on implementation. Tiny IEM drivers go down to 20Hz, which are sealed and close to eardrum. Every vintage ortho Ive tried modding can get flat down to 20Hz easy enough. Supraurals can be very difficult to get a seal with minidsp EARS. @khbaur330162 if you look around you’ll find lots of other’s measurements in this thread and some kindly organized like @GREQ ’s collection that demonstrate complete bass extension. T10 modded by @dBel84 Im sure measures remarkably linear from 20-20 with a good seal. Overdamping or underdamping from modding can cause bass to diminish however but I doubt that’s the case here.

SFI is also a weird one.
From memory, the Realistic Pro 30 was easily the bassiest SFI I heard in it's stock form - and also the most closed-back.

Buried in this thread should also be one or two mods where SFI's were transplanted into portable closed-back on ear headphones.

 

[RetroE83]

Depends on implementation. Tiny IEM drivers go down to 20Hz, which are sealed and close to eardrum. Every vintage ortho Ive tried modding can get flat down to 20Hz easy enough. Supraurals can be very difficult to get a seal with minidsp EARS. @khbaur330162 if you look around you’ll find lots of other’s measurements in this thread and some kindly organized like @GREQ ’s collection that demonstrate complete bass extension. T10 modded by @dBel84 Im sure measures remarkably linear from 20-20 with a good seal. Overdamping or underdamping from modding can cause bass to diminish however but I doubt that’s the case here.

SFI is also a weird one.
From memory, the Realistic Pro 30 was easily the bassiest SFI I heard in it's stock form - and also the most closed-back.

Buried in this thread should also be one or two mods where SFI's were transplanted into portable closed-back on ear headphones.

I remember Wualta mentioning in a old, buried post that SFIs had the potential to produce thumpy bass.

In the stock housing I was already impressed with the overall sound; it didn’t have the subbass my modded version has. My modded pair also seems to sound less, congested, cleaner (as in separation and distinction of instruments, sound sources), a little less in head in terms of soundstage. The treble isn’t the most resolving but it isn’t fatiguing.

 

[Philimon]

Yamaha YHD-series > YH-series
Treble sounds much cleaner.

YH-2 was my fav because had the cleanest (less ringing) and smoothest treble vs YH-1, HP-1a, YH-100. Still, it was a little rough damped or no. YHD-3 pretty fatigue free damped or no.

For further comparison put YHD-3 driver into YH-2 enclosure. Literally snapped into place. Still cleaner upper mids thru highs damped or no. Bass comparison hard to say which is greater. Both damped or no are limp compared to THX00.

Ive only used YHD-3 in current state a very short while but may prefer overall due to smooth highs vs THX00 dynamics.

This is my second YHD-3. First one I got was my first vintage ortho. I figured it was low tier Yamaha so gave away to make room for other vintage ortho. But now I think it’s best Yamaha driver besides very probably YHD-1. Someone sell me YHD-1 please? Trade for TRX00 ebony in used condition.

YH-2 driver left, YHD-3 driver right:

 

[khbaur330162]

Yamaha YHD-series > YH-series
Treble sounds much cleaner.

YH-2 was my fav because had the cleanest (less ringing) and smoothest treble vs YH-1, HP-1a, YH-100. Still, it was a little rough damped or no. YHD-3 pretty fatigue free damped or no.

For further comparison put YHD-3 driver into YH-2 enclosure. Literally snapped into place. Still cleaner upper mids thru highs damped or no. Bass comparison hard to say which is greater. Both damped or no are limp compared to THX00.

Ive only used YHD-3 in current state a very short while but may prefer overall due to smooth highs vs THX00 dynamics.

This is my second YHD-3. First one I got was my first vintage ortho. I figured it was low tier Yamaha so gave away to make room for other vintage ortho. But now I think it’s best Yamaha driver besides very probably YHD-1. Someone sell me YHD-1 please? Trade for TRX00 ebony in used condition.

YH-2 driver left, YHD-3 driver right:

Dude, you're the second person to say YH-2 has better treble than YH-1 and stuff. What the heckkkk, treble is so nice on them, imo. I heard a YHD-something years ago and thought it sounded like an average 40mm ortho: SFI, ATH-2 and the like. Maybe need to revisit? I wonder what they sound like in an angled baffle.

 

[Philimon]

Dude, you're the second person to say YH-2 has better treble than YH-1 and stuff. What the heckkkk, treble is so nice on them, imo. I heard a YHD-something years ago and thought it sounded like an average 40mm ortho: SFI, ATH-2 and the like. Maybe need to revisit? I wonder what they sound like in an angled baffle.

Maybe YHD do sound like SFI. Never tried SFI but apparently maybe I should because Yamaha YHD are much harder to come by.

You can find some CSD plots on that other site. The higher up in Yamaha you go the more they ring it seems. Fwir there has been no YH1000 or YHD CSDs.

 

[Philimon]

@khbaur330162 youve had a lot of headphone experience so I trust your opinion. We just hear a little differently, normal. Id say Im extra sensitive to treble peaks. I like warm headphones in general because they warm over treble quirks. Yeah, I looked in your profile. See you also own(ed) a PPAS by FallenAngel. That dude was just spotted posting on that other friendly site. He was just trying to give away some old headphone parts. Such a nice guy.