[DefectiveAudioComponent]

Quote:

Thanks DAC. I had already read your post on the PMB (Didn't know one was yours) and kind of convinced me to buy them. I was able to get the other two drivers alive again by cleaning the edge of the gold ring and the driver itself to re-established contact. I also added another spacer in the middle to get a better contact and so far they are working fine.

So it was just dirty? I never thougth of just cleaning it.... well done

 

[joelpearce]

I'm glad you were able to get those going again.

 

[marcan]

Is it possible to make an open design with t50rp drivers?

 

[BobSaysHi]

Quote:

Is it possible to make an open design with t50rp drivers?

I'm certainly going to try once I get mine. 
 
Another question. I've read through maybe 50 pages atm, and I used the search feature.
 
Has anyone tried using angled t50rp drivers? Every angled driver I've ever heard sounded a little more natural comparatively. I'm going to build a CNC machine, so an angled driver hopefully shouldn't be the hardest thing to produce. Hopefully. The CNC is just an idea and a list of parts atm.

 

[maverickronin]

Quote:

Another question. I've read through maybe 50 pages atm, and I used the search feature.
 

 
I'm planning on doing that soon.  So far angled pads work a lot better than flat ones.

 

[Armaegis]

I did like the angled drivers in mine, though it was with an angled cup rather than angled drivers. For me, it sounded better when I put some padding between the "far" edge of the padding and the earcup, taking out that empty space. I should take some pictures of that.

 

[BobSaysHi]

Quote:

I did like the angled drivers in mine, though it was with an angled cup rather than angled drivers. For me, it sounded better when I put some padding between the "far" edge of the padding and the earcup, taking out that empty space. I should take some pictures of that.

Please do. It would interest me greatly, and I'm sure others would like to see too.
 

 

[Armaegis]

Angled driver cups...
 
Here's the side close to the ear...

 
here's the side "far" from the ear... the white ring (which is my driver housing) actually touches the back of the cup. I have zero clearance... negative clearance actually.

 
With the pads on, that's a 1cm swath of empty space that doesn't do the sound any favours. I wound up just folding up a piece of tissue paper and wedging it in to fill up that space, which actually worked quite well. I don't have a picture of that, but I'll try to remember to take one later. I also taped over those four ports above and below the driver opening. I might try opening up one of them and see if I can recover some soundstage without losing that punch that I gained.
 
There's a pseudoport on the bottom, but I've tried covering it up but it doesn't really do anything. I figure that's because my cup isn't exactly sealed, so the extra little crack there doesn't make a difference.

 

[BobSaysHi]

Thanks for the pics. Interesting.
 
I've come to the conclusion that this is my favorite headphone modding thread on headfi. I'm around page 500 right now, but I skimmed like 90% of the posts looking for info that I could use.
 
I have another question. It seems as though you guys recommend using several different types of cloth/felt. Should I just buy as much as I can, or is there a specific type that's recommended? We used to have a fabric shop right down the street, but they closed down several years ago. I'll probably have to order from Amazon.
 
Also, thanks a lot for this thread guys, really helpful.

 

[GrandZechs]

I may give this angled driver a try since I have a ton of space to work with.

 

[joelpearce]

You really should try to find a fabric store that you can go to in person if possible.  For me, there are a few types of felt that you should have: cheap acrylic craft-store felt, which is actually the best for many applications, and a nice, real wool felt.  Speaker Grille cloth is also a nice thing to have on hand, because it allows you to create dust protection without much acoustic impact.
 
Quote:

Thanks for the pics. Interesting.
 
I've come to the conclusion that this is my favorite headphone modding thread on headfi. I'm around page 500 right now, but I skimmed like 90% of the posts looking for info that I could use.
 
I have another question. It seems as though you guys recommend using several different types of cloth/felt. Should I just buy as much as I can, or is there a specific type that's recommended? We used to have a fabric shop right down the street, but they closed down several years ago. I'll probably have to order from Amazon.
 
Also, thanks a lot for this thread guys, really helpful.

 

 

[gurubhai]

Quote:

The biggest problem with open back orthos is the sound is always plasticy. It's hard to describe but the sound resembles what it might sound like if made of flimsy plastic. It loses solidity, resonates badly due to no loading and generally sounds wrong.
 
Only the LCD2 and the original wharfedale don't suffer this, even the HE5LE has it a bit and I added some damping to mine to tighten them up a bit. Most other orthos I've heard are vented/semi-open for good reason, the original open ones like the T50 and T30 have this same 'off' quality. This is also one of the reasons a lot of the older models are so difficult to damp well, it's a fine balancing act. Most of them also like close ear coupling or again, the sound quality plummets. They truly are a royal pain to get right and it's not in the least bit surprising they went into a long hiatus with only Fostex quietly flying a small, almost unnoticed banner, and even then for a small niche market.
 
Orthos need a good dose of costly R&D to do well and even though Fostex did a great job of the driver, they did a poor job of optimizing the overall package and failed completely to exploit an eager consumer market. I guess a good part is that even though efficiencies have improved, they are still inefficient compared to the general consumer phone and altering that was probably something even they didn't want to take on head first so they stayed in the pro audio market where it's not really a problem, perceived or otherwise.
 
I would say that attempting to modify an existing driver for true open operation will prove frustrating but that shouldn't stop an ortho head from trying. I did for a long time and probably will again when time allows.

That's odd. I never had any plasticky sound from the open back orthos that I have heard  : LCD-2  or mylar NADs.
But then, I don't hear any of the 'reverb' issue from the LCD-2 that some have been reporting. So, I guess ii could be attributable to my 'tin ears'.
 
I usually associate  a plasticky treble with dynamic cans. Orthos would get the plasticky treble sound only when over-damped, at least that's been my experience.
 
I find it quite fascinating though that you had issues with a T50 but not with LCD-2 Since I find them tonally pretty much the same with LCD-2 improving on bass & providing a wider soundstage.
The other minor differences are with LCD-2 having a slightly recessed upper mids( I like that, reduces sibilance) & a peak at around 9-10k ( I don't like this as it leads to excessive cymbals).

 

[wualta]

I'm with gurubhai on this-- I don't find my T50v1 to be plasticy (or obviously resonant), and I don't understand Smeggy's comment about "loading" being responsible for this-- could it be he was listening to a driver that was entirely unloaded, by which he perhaps meant undamped? As long as a diaphragm is coupled to the side of a person's head, it's loaded, however minimally, so I don't think he meant it that way. Smeggy, could you elaborate?
 
Mostly the problem is getting the treble up-- audition a YHD to see what I mean.
 
While we're on the subject of "reverb": It's impossible for true acoustic reverb to happen in something the size of a headphone, so it's difficult to know what people are hearing. Possibly the faults in the impulse response, which would show up on a waterfall plot or Tyll's simpler "spike" test.  It's hard to snub a diaphragm down completely without ruining something else, as we know. It's also possible that the Audeze people have reached the engineering equivalent of the Point At Which No Good Deed Goes Unpunished, which is to say that everything else is so good that even the tiny faults that normally are swamped by other bigger faults show up and drive listeners crazy. Maybe now people can hear reflections off the clamped edge of the diaphragm-- in which case it's acting like, yes, a plate reverb unit from the old analog days! Though not a very good one. Might sound.... plasticy. But that's just a guess-- Tyll would have his hands full trying to measure that.
 
I also vote for angled drivers. Every experiment I've ever run has convinced me it's the way to go, and all my favorite 'stats have angled drivers (ECR-500, Lambda).

 

[marcan]

Angled driver is imporant with stats and planar because they are very directive.

 

[Armaegis]

These are lousy pictures, but this was my super simple method of filling in the blank space from the angled driver cups...
 
In this first picture you can see the gap from the driver to the back of the earpad. At the center of it, maybe 1cm deep and high.

 
Roll up some tissue paper, and voila...

 
I think ideally, I should cut a piece of foam to fill up that entire space between the baffle and pad (see earlier post above) and give the sound a more direct route to the ear.