[tdockweiler]

Quote:

 

 
4.  The stock cable is the same cable you can buy for about $15 on ebay and is stiff, its not the wisest choice for a cable styling that will be plugged into an amplifier some distance away.  Open the stock cable up and tell me I'm wrong. It was a poor cable all around, at least Hifiman realized and cared enough to almost IMMEDIATELY change it out for a really great cable.  As we all know , we want to pay $500-900 for a headphone that comes with a garden hose for a cable, right? lol
 

 
Wait..can you clear this up for me..they use a Canare cable and the only thing that's wrong with it is that it's too stiff? Canare is considerd a very high quality wire and just as good as this fancy pants $10/foot wire. Now, I'm not a fan of Canare for most headphones, but it's still good. I like canare for the brighter headphones and hate it with the HD-600/650.
 
If any company used Canare or Mogami on a headphone, I'd be happy. Give me that over generic stock wire anyday.
 
What brand of wire does Hifiman use now? I know it was Canare in the past or do they still use it?
 
IMO everyone should use Mogami

 

[rhythmdevils]

Quote:

 
I think I would have an idea of what a favorite song should sound like if I'd have listened to it thousands of times. It's not a case of me putting on a song for the first time or listening to it on a colored headphone. This is stuff that i've heard over and over since 1932. Probably on dozens of speakers and headphones.
 
When I listen to a favorite CD I don't want it to change dramatically. I usually know it inside and out. Some minor variation is OK. For fun I often do prefer slightly forward sounding vocals.
 
I think you mentioned that crappy recordings should never have any fatiguing or harsh treble peaks on a truly flat headphone or speaker. I don't agree with this at all really. There's maybe dozens of poorly recorded/bad tracks in my collection and they sound like crap on 95% of speakers and headphones. I just have a hard time believing it's really the headphones fault like you say.
 
When I want to enjoy all my garbage tracks, the HD-600 or HD-650 is what I would pick and it's not because they're flat. I think it's pretty well know that the HD-600/650 are fairly good at making poor recordings sound decent. I wish I knew why. I think it's just that they're not very revealing. Somewhat, but not like my KRK or Sextett.
 
It's not big deal and sure we can agree to disagree. I just don't think the HD-600 is as neutral as everyone says. To me, it's actually just as colored as the HD-598! You don't see anyone using an HD-598 as a neutral studio headphone! On graphs it appears that the 598 is flatter than the HD-600. What's funny is that the 598 sounds more balanced sounding than the HD-600 to my ears.
 
BTW FYI none of my headphones are any more colored than the HD-600 to my ears. I would say the KNS-8400, DJ100 and my Sextett are the ones that are slightly colored, but only due to their forward mids. I would say the DJ100 is about as colored as the Sextett I have..which isn't very much. The DJ100 is my only "fun" headphone, but still quite balanced sounding.
 

 
That is my belief yes.  Not a popular one on this forum, but most people listen to headphones that have resonant peaks which make problems in recordings sound much worse than they should. 
 
Have you seen the DJ100 and Sextett measurements?  Not even close to accurate.  The Sextett does still manage to sound good somehow.  But it's not accurate.  I haven't heard the DJ100. 
 
I don't like the DT-880 much.  FWIW, "revealing" as it's used on this forum doesn't mean accurate or neutral, if anything it means it's not.  IMO. 
 
To be clear, in the last few posts there's nothing personal here.  I'm just talking about headphones.  Not people.  And I don't own the LCD-2, I sold mine, I was just disagreeing with the reasoning. 

 

[swbf2cheater]

You guys are being far too literal and did not read what I actually typed.  I said it did not plot extremely well, it wasn't special.  I never once said it plotted poorly so your justifications are mute points flapping in the breeze, points you made up just to justify your purchases.  Sad I had to explain that out for some of the readers here...
 
Soundstaging qualities are very important to me, but thats cool if you don't care about it. Opinions are just opinions.  I want my sound to be as realistic as possible, large, spacious, just like my ears actually pick up on real sounds.  I guess I am the crazy one though, wanting a soundstage that produces sound the way my ears naturally pick up things.  How dare I want such a thing! Death to the Stax 007, 009, ATH WX series, HD800 and the JVC DX1000! You guys should send them all angry emails and blast them for attempting to create a vast sound signature compared to most other headphones, one that doesn't sound like you are in a tanning bed or a coffin, something that produces audio that can reach outward into infinity or at least the way my ears hear something that is distant. ROFL I love this forum, most ideals are completely opposite of what normal consumers want or would stand for.  Take that LCD2 out and let normal people listen to it, let them use it with games, movies, tv, their favorite music, let them wear it for a few HOURS while they have to lug about a Lyr or a giant brick of a portable rig to get the best out of it....then tell them its $800 and might even need a 3rd party cable for extra money. 
 
Get back to me and let me know their facial expressions when you tell them that.  LOL

 

[Currawong]

swbf2cheater: Who cares?
 
Noting the topic of this thread, I reckon there's nothing wrong with arguing the LCD-2s were overrated.

 

[swbf2cheater]

36 pages of users apparently cared enough to debate the topic.

 

[obobskivich]

Truly overrated? (And I may have replied to this thread years ago before my hiatus); Denon AH-D2000. Come at me bros. :veryevil:

No but in all serious-ness, it's not so much that they're bad, it's that they're handed out like Ritalin at an elite middleschool. They don't do anything particularly spectacularly, and aren't perfect in any regard, but get pushed as the be-all end-all of headphonedom. Erik made a point about the 701 on the first page, and that's how I feel about the D2000. I don't, however, think Denon made anything BEFORE them that was world-shattering.

 

[Currawong]

I was asking "Who cares?" about your "most ideals are completely opposite of what normal consumers want or would stand for" argument.

 

[Katun]

Quote:

Truly overrated? (And I may have replied to this thread years ago before my hiatus); Denon AH-D2000. Come at me bros.

No but in all serious-ness, it's not so much that they're bad, it's that they're handed out like Ritalin at an elite middleschool. They don't do anything particularly spectacularly, and aren't perfect in any regard, but get pushed as the be-all end-all of headphonedom. Erik made a point about the 701 on the first page, and that's how I feel about the D2000. I don't, however, think Denon made anything BEFORE them that was world-shattering.

 
I think that would be my vote too.

 

[Croozer]

Yawn.

This is nothing but opinion and you know what they say about those.

 

[dallan]

Yeah, in my years and meets i never even bothered listening to Denons, now others are comparing them to the TH900s and i have no frame of reference. Oh well......

 

[swbf2cheater]

Quote:

I was asking "Who cares?" about your "most ideals are completely opposite of what normal consumers want or would stand for" argument.

 
My ideals? Since when do normal people wear $800 headphones around with giant portable rigs, or purchase Amps to run their poorly designed and expensive headphones?  These are not my ideals no matter how many users try to make that fact look like its my own idea on how things are.  Thats solid fact.  No normal human, no sane person would stand for such inefficiency today, no normal person would ever be caught dead paying $800 for and LCD2 when its so large and bulky.  Only the blinded audiophile world will do so, we are all ignorant to things other people see as absolutely unacceptable.  Because of those unacceptable things that actually do exist inside the LCD2, my point is absolutely valid and justified.  My ideals are based on fact which are relevant to this very thread, Currawong.  Especially so in the case of the LCD2. I definitely understand why an Audiophile would not enjoy me saying the LCD2 was poor in any way, shape or form.  Hobbyists who pay $800 for the headphone + an expensive source and amplifier will defend their purchases to the death even when the rest of the world sees that as absolutely insane.  
 
So, to answer your question:  Normal and new users care about my point.  You and other audio experts do not really care.  Thats great and all, but you forget head fi is not locked and secured with a password only elite audiophiles can read.  Everyone can read this forum.  When you google anything about headphones, this web forum appears on the front page most of the time.  For that reason, everyone is entitled to read more than just the audiophiles outlook on things.  If only the Audio experts opinions mattered, we'd be carrying houses on our heads with a Lyr strapped to our back because "audiophiles" don't really care about faults a sane person would think twice about and end up trying to avoid.  Almost none of you stand up for yourselves and demand better things,more sets will be produced in the near future that will be large and inefficient because you guys don't really at all care about it.  You ruin it for any normal person trying to get into the hobby who want Bose comfort with great sound quality.  Designers will continue to produce insane things normal people look at as absolutely silly because a ton of users on this forum are too afraid to tell them to stop.  You want to use an amplifier?  You want to use giant bulky headphones?  Well, I'm happy for you then because thats your future, you refuse to stand up to them and demand something nicer.  People stood up to Hifiman and they listened, their cable was crap on the HE500 and HE6, they changed it HAPPILY because of the public audiophile outcry, they knew it was bad, they swapped it for something really nice.  Did Audeze do that?  Nope.  Why?  Because you didn't ask them to.

 

[TMRaven]

Hifiman uses Canare too iirc.  I can agree on D2000 being overrated to some extent.  I really think it's overhyped though.  It literally is the most recommended headphone I've seen the last half year.  I still think it's better sounding than a lot of headphones though.

 

[kiteki]

Yeah, in my years and meets i never even bothered listening to Denons, now others are comparing them to the TH900s and i have no frame of reference. Oh well......

 
I certainly hope not, since my D5000 does not compare to the T5p.

 

[TMRaven]

I expect rhythmdevils to come in and go on a tangent about the tesla headphones' horrid ringing issues.  Luckily at the end of the day everyone's happy with what they find to sound the best, including beats users.

 

[rhythmdevils]

<%^&$ Tesla rant>