[336881]

We have a different perspective.

I prefer the term soundstage, rather than the term headstage, because I can mentally project the overall sound picture into an imaginary mental space well in front of my head - representing a microscopic version of a concert hall stage (when using my Susvara or HD800 headphones). Also, the sound image placement within that microscopic soundstage is more representationally accurate than any soundstage imaging I have ever heard from a speaker system (either in my dedicated home listening room or a dealer's showroom).

Jeff.

You can bold "representationally" but the word that sticks out to me is imaginary.

 

[JeffMann]

You can bold "representationally" but the word that sticks out to me is imaginary.

The soundstage that exists in an imaginary space in front of one's head when using the Susvara headphones has to a mental imaginary phenomenon - because the earpieces of the headphones are at the level of the ears. When listening to speakers, the soundstaging is also imaginary if it exists beyond the level of the speakers (deeper than the level of the speakers).

Jeff.

 

[Currawong]

The binaural recordings aren't supposed to sound like you're in a concert hall. They are supposed to sound like you're sitting where the recording head is sitting.

 

[Dobrescu George]

The binaural recordings aren't supposed to sound like you're in a concert hall. They are supposed to sound like you're sitting where the recording head is sitting.

I always thouyght that they are somehow interesting, but as long as only a very few albums exist in that format, none of which are my type, binaural recordings are literally nothing to talk about

Can't wait for someone to make a metal album like that and see how it feels li,e

 

[JeffMann]

The binaural recordings aren't supposed to sound like you're in a concert hall. They are supposed to sound like you're sitting where the recording head is sitting.

I cannot understand why that would produce a "sound effect" where the angle between instruments on the extreme left and the extreme right is closer to 180 degrees (rather than closer to 90 degrees) - unless the recording head is placed very close to the musicians and where the musicians are simultaneously very widely spread-out from left-to-right.

If the recording head is placed directly in front of a string quartet (or jazz quartet), then that artificially wide soundstage phenomenon should surely not happen.

My idea of a well-recorded jazz quartet (piano, double bass, jazz singer and drums) are the following two jazz recordings.

Cecile McLorin Savant

https://www.amazon.com/Dreams-Dagge...3650755&sr=1-1&keywords=cecile+mclorin+savant

https://www.amazon.com/WomanChild-C...5&sr=1-1-spell&keywords=cecile+mclorin+savant

Jeff.

 

[Currawong]

That’s correct. The head is placed exactly as you describe. There are some photos around of the recordings being made.

 

[336881]

The soundstage that exists in an imaginary space in front of one's head when using the Susvara headphones has to a mental imaginary phenomenon - because the earpieces of the headphones are at the level of the ears. When listening to speakers, the soundstaging is also imaginary if it exists beyond the level of the speakers (deeper than the level of the speakers).

Jeff.

Through my speakers the soundstage does not sound imaginary. My speakers can throw instruments and voices feet. At best instruments and voices sound inches outside my head with headphones.

I usually say to each his own... Not this time... It is literally inches vs. feet. Detail is a different story. That I give to headphones by quite a margin.

 

[Currawong]

I found one of the threads about the albums with pictures.

https://www.head-fi.org/gallery/alb...ural-recording-sessions-november-2012.715068/

 

[JeffMann]

Through my speakers the soundstage does not sound imaginary. My speakers can throw instruments and voices feet. At best instruments and voices sound inches outside my head with headphones.

I usually say to each his own... Not this time... It is literally inches vs. feet. Detail is a different story. That I give to headphones by quite a margin.

I have the opposite experience. I can mentally position classical music instruments and opera voices in an imaginary space that is often >30 yards wide by >20 yards deep - when listening to my Susvara headphones. Good opera recordings by skilled balance engineers (eg. Decca engineers) can re-create opera scenes that can mimic what is happening on a "real life" opera stage in terms of the position of opera singers and extraneous noises (like closing doors, footsteps going up the stairs, or clashing swords in sword fights where the sword fighters move across the soundstage from side-to-side and also from back-to-front). However, I do believe that a mental capacity to mentally project the soundstage outside one's head and into an "imaginary" opera stage setting is partly dependent on experience (that is partly based on previous "real life" experiences with the recorded opera).

Jeff.

 

[JeffMann]

I found one of the threads about the albums with pictures.

https://www.head-fi.org/gallery/alb...ural-recording-sessions-november-2012.715068/

I noted that in those photos, that the double bass musician is situated a few feet in front of the piano and slightly to the right. If the Chesky recording is "musically accurate", then one should hear that identical positional relationship when listening to the final recording with headphones. Is that "true" for that Chesky recording.

Listen to this recording of a Betthoven piano trio with your headphones.

https://www.amazon.com/Beethoven-Ar...664557&sr=1-3&keywords=beethoven+trio+harrell

You should hear the violinist positioned to the left of the piano and slightly forward of the piano, while the cello should be situated just to the front and slightly to the right of the piano - presuming that your headphone-based audio system is capable of excellent soundstaging - and the overall sound picture should closely mimic (from a soundstaging perspective) what happens in a "real life" concert hall performance of that same musical piece.

Jeff.

 

[SilverEars]

Jeffmann, heaphones are facing your ears perpendicularly. It's like the speakers are on your left and right facing toward the head, unlike speakers(which is distance away infront of you). Also, each speaker provide sound to both left and right ears, whereas headphones only provide sound from one channel per ear. This makes the difference in imaging.

If you like the spacey sound of binaural, try this one. This sounds so spatial on my HE1000. My iems can't create such depth that HE1000 can.

 

[Christer]

Objects of desire.

 

[AnakChan]

How is it? DAVE has enough ooomph to drive the Susvara?

 

[Christer]

How is it? DAVE has enough ooomph to drive the Susvara?

Imho not with large scale realistic dynamic range symphonic music, like the two recordings shown in my post above.
The photo was taken before I started any serious listening when it became obvious that the little toy behind Susvara was needed as well.
That toy is the bargain WA 33 combo headphone amp.

 

[JeffMann]

Latest review of the Susvara - https://headfonics.com/2017/12/hifiman-susvara-review/

I agree with his impressions.

By the way, my Vioelectric V281 headphone amplifier is easily powerful enough to play the Susvara with great control and authority.

Jeff.