[Maxvla]

I've not heard the DAC1, and until I just looked it up, I didn't realize it had balanced XLR output. Great unit for the price I would say. I'd look up some reviews here for impressions.

 

[seldenr]

The DAC1 gets great reviews, and there are several affordable "balanced" sources out there, but whether they are truly balanced, or merely convert single ended to a balanced output just behind the rear plate...
 
Someone made a good point about my Ayre C5xe (yes, retail is around $6,000) with a $600 amp, so I thought I better explain.  It may be a bit of a mismatch, but as I mentioned, I have been a crazy audiophile for a while (did I mention the lack of brains?), so I had the Ayre with the Avantgarde Duo Omega speakers through an ARC Ref 3 preamp and an Art Audio PX25 amp (not only off the charts sound-wise, but one of the more beautiful pieces out there, thus my avatar).  I was "encouraged" by the family to turn the "music room" into a "game room" so sold the rest of the system, but kept the Ayre for use with a smaller audio system in my study.  Since I am a novice at all things headphoneI thought I would try a less expensive headphone amp to see if I would make more use of my headphones.
 
Ok, I know, TMI, but thought it was a good point about not making much sense to use such a good source (and I think it is an unbelievable source, especially with DVD-A discs) with a "less expensive" amp, and I did not want to appear even less smart than I already do!
 
Thanks for the help so far.  You guys are terrific - more helpful and MUCH more friendly than on some of the other audio sites.  Much appreciate the help!!!

 

[Maxvla]

Is the DAC1 not truly balanced? That would be disappointing.
 
Sorry you had to sell off all that amazing gear.

I can, however, picture some high end headphones, orthodynamic or electrostatic, and associated amp, in your future. The phones you mention will last you a while, but ultimately I think you won't be satisfied. One great way to test the waters with gear is to attend meets held by head-fi members. You can find meets forming up here: http://www.head-fi.org/forum/list/24  What part of the world are you from?
 
Most speaker guys think headphone amps are a joke, literally, but they do make a massive difference in most cases. Obviously the entry level amps help a little bit but not much, then as you get more power and voltage swing going your difference potential increases dramatically.
 
Welcome to the site. I'd say the traditional greeting, 'Sorry about your wallet' but it appears you are working off a budget from your sold gear, which I'm guessing will pay for most any headphone system under the sun with money left over.

 

[seldenr]

Ok, you gave me a good chuckle, and thank you for taking time to give me good information.  I live in Katy TX, (Houston).  A few months back I was trying to organize a canjam, but business interrupted.  I would still love to attend one, so I will check your referenced site.  Thanks for that. 
 
After sampling some 10 to 12 amps in my house for the Avantgardes I very much realize the importance, and difference, that a well designed and system matched amp can make.  So I do not mean to underplay its importance.  I think my intent is to do just what I did in my home system - start small and grow it.  I find I appreciate the end result more that way, and the journey is fun! 
 
In any event, sorry to all for hijacking this thread.  In an attempt to get back on track, I have another question.  This thread is comparing the Little Dot VI to the Woo6, which is a good comparison price-wise, but would it not be a good idea to compare the new VIII to the Woo 2, since it is also an OTL design?  I realize the cost is a bit different ($880 shipped for LD vs $1050 for Woo 6), but they are "close enough for jazz", right?
 
I also understand the LD VIII (8) is not recommended for Grado or headphones under 120 ohm.  Thoughts on the comparison and limitation of the LD regarding low impedance?  Yes, there is that difference in power, but I have used enough SET and solid state amplifiers to realize that power specs are all but meaningless.
 

 

[Maxvla]

Texas, huh? I had a feeling. You should join us in Dallas in late January for our meet if you can make the drive (I'll be driving from the other direction, Oklahoma City). We haven't scheduled it yet, but it's usually one of the 2 last Saturdays of the month. I'd love to meet you and show you the gear everyone's brought.
 
Regarding the VIII vs Woo 2, the difference is single ended and balanced. The LD uses solid state rectifiers, whereas the Woo uses tube rectifiers. There are still enough differences that you can't really compare them if you were trying to align the technologies. As Audiogalore stated earlier in the thread, the best comparison to the MKVI or MKVIII is the WA22 at $1900. The WA22 is transformer coupled, but it is the right power range and the right alignment (balanced) to be compared directly with the LD products.
 
No OTL design is optimum for low impedance headphones such as Grado, Denon, AudioTechnica, etc. OTL is designed specifically to run headphones with 120ohm impedance or higher, most targetting 300ohm for their best performance.

 

[Cal]

edit: answered my own question

 

[Audiogalore]

 
Quote:

I owned the MK VI, and kept it for over a year.  It is an amazing amplifier, worth every penny.  I would certainly recommend it as my #1 favorite amp in the $600 price range. 
 
I typically suggest the WA6 over the MK VI only because people who consider $600 amps are typically not in a position to budget for a balanced DAC and headphone retermination as well.  When you do, magic happens

Perfect statement of the Little Dot Mk6 this amp and according to David Sword with Little Dot is still the best amp they make and recommended to be used with a wider range of various lo/hi impedance phones.
 
Yes theoretically OTL as previous mentioned is designed for high impedance but I have phones ranging from 25-600 ohms and my MK6 drives them all with authority and control.
 
If your source is truly balanced the MK6 is a great amp to incorporate in your setup.

 
Quote:

Ok, you gave me a good chuckle, and thank you for taking time to give me good information.  I live in Katy TX, (Houston).  A few months back I was trying to organize a canjam, but business interrupted.  I would still love to attend one, so I will check your referenced site.  Thanks for that. 
 
After sampling some 10 to 12 amps in my house for the Avantgardes I very much realize the importance, and difference, that a well designed and system matched amp can make.  So I do not mean to underplay its importance.  I think my intent is to do just what I did in my home system - start small and grow it.  I find I appreciate the end result more that way, and the journey is fun! 
 
In any event, sorry to all for hijacking this thread.  In an attempt to get back on track, I have another question.  This thread is comparing the Little Dot VI to the Woo6, which is a good comparison price-wise, but would it not be a good idea to compare the new VIII to the Woo 2, since it is also an OTL design?  I realize the cost is a bit different ($880 shipped for LD vs $1050 for Woo 6), but they are "close enough for jazz", right?
 
I also understand the LD VIII (8) is not recommended for Grado or headphones under 120 ohm.  Thoughts on the comparison and limitation of the LD regarding low impedance?  Yes, there is that difference in power, but I have used enough SET and solid state amplifiers to realize that power specs are all but meaningless.
 

The Woo 2 is a outstanding amp but is not balanced, priced 300-400 higher, also I can not respond if it can drive the range of 25-600 ohms!
 
Quote:

Texas, huh? I had a feeling. You should join us in Dallas in late January for our meet if you can make the drive (I'll be driving from the other direction, Oklahoma City). We haven't scheduled it yet, but it's usually one of the 2 last Saturdays of the month. I'd love to meet you and show you the gear everyone's brought.
 
Regarding the VIII vs Woo 2, the difference is single ended and balanced. The LD uses solid state rectifiers, whereas the Woo uses tube rectifiers. There are still enough differences that you can't really compare them if you were trying to align the technologies. As Audiogalore stated earlier in the thread, the best comparison to the MKVI or MKVIII is the WA22 at $1900. The WA22 is transformer coupled, but it is the right power range and the right alignment (balanced) to be compared directly with the LD products.
 
No OTL design is optimum for low impedance headphones such as Grado, Denon, AudioTechnica, etc. OTL is designed specifically to run headphones with 120ohm impedance or higher, most targetting 300ohm for their best performance.

The bottom line as maxvia made mention, 6 vs 8 The MK6 has significantly more power to drive the hardest phone that is amp depended.
 
I have a Grado GS1000i a Grado RS1i both at 32 ohms and a Denon D7000 at 25 ohms that the Little Dot MK6 drives fantastically.
 
Enjoy music!

 

[RockinCannoisseur]

a pretty damn convincing argument, and a good one to boot.

  good work
Quote:

Then why is it every time I've seen someone commenting about the WA6, it's always followed by the statement to the effect of "but you'll want to get the SE because the extra power is a huge upgrade getting to a full 1W." I've seen this repeatedly and is the only time I've seen the WA6 mentioned at all.. always with the attached upgrade warning. How could I not draw the conclusion that the WA6 is under-performing for the money if people who have them are telling people interested in a WA6 that the SE is a huge upgrade? How powerful is the standard unit anyways? Woo doesn't even list it on their site, but they proudly display the 1W output of the SE version. Again, makes me wonder about the standard WA6.
 
The Little Dot outclasses the Woo in every aspect for about the same money. Double the power of the WA6 SE (+$420) (2W @ 300ohm), 4pin and 2x3pin XLR balanced output, balanced and unbalanced input, unbalanced output. The only negative is that it's Chinese instead of American made. In this price range point to point and circuit boards makes no difference. With amps of this quality at these prices I find it hard to recommend any of the 'entry level' Woo amps. Service from both companies is identical, even shipping times are about the same. I don't know about the WA6 (I'm guessing it can), but the MKVI has ample tube rolling options, so even that isn't a negative.
 
Care to debate the topic point for point like I did above? You're going to be in an uphill battle.

shes a bit to hefty for me though i wonder how she compares to the csp2 as that is what im shooting for.
 
ooh and csp2 vs wa6  is of much curiosity???  or maybe little dot has something which is more competitive to the csp2, but it wont look as cool or have 2 input/1 output, plus i highly doubt that little dot has there head outs and switches so conveniently located as on the csp2

 

[daveDerek]

what about if your source is not balanced?
Quote:

If your source is truly balanced the MK6 is a great amp to incorporate in your setup.

 

[Maxvla]

There are unbalanced inputs, but to bring out the best in the amp you should use a balanced source. Essentially if you are using it in unbalanced mode you are only using half the amp.

 

[daveDerek]

will it sound like anything special when sourced unbalanced? and to keep it more on topic how would it compare, under those circumstances, to the WA6 - better, worse, equivalent?

 

[Audiogalore]

Quote:

will it sound like anything special when sourced unbalanced? and to keep it more on topic how would it compare, under those circumstances, to the WA6 - better, worse, equivalent?

Interesting question. My Little Dot MK6 is the older version which does not have the SE inputs. However upgrading to my WA6SE nicely tubed with Sophia 274 rectifier and the sylvania 6EW7 amp drivers I found the little Dot with much more detail and information. No contest! The Little Dot has more of a 3D sound signature, were as the WA-6SE is more flat and 2D.
 
The WA-6SE is a great product if you are not comparing but quite honestly the Little Dot MK6 sounds better when compared.
 
I guess the analogy one would say the Woo is like a soda without the fizzle.
 

 

 

[daveDerek]

Audiogalore, that's interesting. i have to wonder though if it's basically the fact that you're running it balanced that accounts for those differences. what can are you talking about? i'm guessing it's your senn hd650 which is particularly responsive to balanced operation. the senn and the woo are a really nice combo though!

 

[Audiogalore]

 
Quote:

Audiogalore, that's interesting. i have to wonder though if it's basically the fact that you're running it balanced that accounts for those differences. what can are you talking about? i'm guessing it's your senn hd650 which is particularly responsive to balanced operation. the senn and the woo are a really nice combo though!

Actually I found this with all my phones. My phones are all balanced. My T1 are extremely musical with the Little Dot.

 

[TheWuss]

this thread needs more pictures.