[jermng]

Quote:

I have a silly question.  If cable makes such a difference, wouldn't it also make a difference on the microphones and equipment that is used to record the music?  If it did make a difference, wouldn't the sound engineers buy and use it?  I've never seen a market for super expensive cables in the comercial side of audio.  In reality, if we want to replicate how a live performance sounds, wouldnt we most accurately replicate it using cable similar to what would be used to cable up a live performance speakers....

I happen to be a sound engineer and record label owner. Having worked with some of the finest studios here, all I can say is, you might know your own equipment and what you hear, but you obviously don't have enough knowledge or experience with the recording industry & studios to make a statement like that. 
 
I'm not about to jump into the whole cables argument - I don't think it will ever end - but just for the record, studios (those I've worked with anyway) do regard cables highly in the signal chain. It probably doesn't make as big a difference as using the right preamp or mic, but it definitely influences the sound. 
 

 

[goodvibes]

Quote:

I have a silly question.  If cable makes such a difference, wouldn't it also make a difference on the microphones and equipment that is used to record the music?  If it did make a difference, wouldn't the sound engineers buy and use it?  I've never seen a market for super expensive cables in the comercial side of audio.  In reality, if we want to replicate how a live performance sounds, wouldnt we most accurately replicate it using cable similar to what would be used to cable up a live performance speakers....

It does and most engineers do have favs but others just use whatever out of convenience of a location (which may have previously been selected) or beliefs as there's cables don't matter guys in every facet of audio but they're a minority in better kit. While that's the case, the cables on that end have a different function and are at a much different point in the chain. The mics are generally 48v phantom (cable) powered condensers and the cable is driving a voltage load after a balanced output line amp into a balanced mic amp input and not driving a rather low impedance current load like an IEM. Trust me when I say that the mic cable is far from the weak link in the chain when you consider all the recording gear, D2As, mixers, processing and playback kit but that doesn't mean a cable won't still make a worthwhile difference or that there isn't a market. Monster, Canare and others do well and studio guys tend to find stock they like and build to suit. I know guys that will only use a particular shielded 4 core and nuetrik connector for personal use and are more purist in their technique and others that aren't as concerned, assume good quality at a studio and make it sound the way they want after the fact but they still tend to select there own cables for on location work. Regardless of what happened at that end, it shouldn't minimize what happens at this one unless it's a particular crappy recording. If you ever heard a good 24/96 or analog master compared to it's CD equivilent, you'd think 16/44 was the biggest kink in the stream.
 
I've said earlier that I'm not a fan of silver tinned cables but was corrected in that the TWAG is pure silver of fine strands. Haven't heard one but it could be quite good and it will definitely sound different than the stock unit. It's actually pretty cheap if that description is correct but whether it's worthwhile or cost effective will be up to an individual. I think balanced has it's uses but is rather meaningless at the headphone end. Every amp sounds different and more care often goes into a balanced unit so it can be better but balanced needs 2 amps of equal quality compared to a single of non balanced and for them also to be exact mirrors of each other which is a lot harder than it sounds. what plays the driver(s) is the difference signal of the 2. The advantages are in common mode noise rejection in low level signals and long runs of cable but not so much in driving IEMs. If balanced sounds better it's simply because a particular amp is preferred, the natural star grounding of the cable configuration and/or the better sounding connector used. If you prefer it, you're not wrong but it may not be because it's balanced. There can be some noise advantage to a balanced power supply configuration in conjunction with a balanced amp but a true balanced supply is rarely used and a properly done regulated supply should be plenty good for the job.
  

 

[Trysaeder]

Quote:

It does and most engineers do have favs but others just use whatever out of convenience of a location (which may have previously been selected) or beliefs as there's cables don't matter guys in every facet of audio but they're a minority in better kit. 

So you'll have zero problem with providing some solid examples then?
 

 

[jermng]

Can this please not lead into another cable debate? Seriously .... Seems like every time someone says anything about cables on any headphone or equipment thread, it quickly rolls downhill into a heated cable discussion. 
 
I kinda started this particular one, so let's leave it at -  I bought the Twag, I'm gonna try it - if I like it, I'll keep it. If I don't like it, I'll sell it. 
 
 
 
P.S. This is not directed anyone in particular - I'm just tired of having to go through numerous OT posts on cables when I just wanna read or discuss the earphones/headphones in the topic ... 

 

[goodvibes]

I have a Hi End audio shop and my partner is an award winning recording engineer and teaches a masters in recording. Customers at this end of the business don't question that there are cable differences, they argue which horse for their course. I personally would prefer them not exist but it's bloody obvious given a good source and kit. If you're not hearing it, don't blame your ears or PM me when in Chitown and have a listen for yourself. Believe what you like but that's the landscape. I'm done.
 
Congrats to you guys. It's very nice to hear that your leaps of faith are paying off.

 Jermng, please try to get a seal with those triples if that's do-able.

 

[Guidostrunk]

I hear ya( no pun intended)

 

[jeremyh]

how is the um3x compared to the westone es5? finaly went to demo a um3x at a shop. the um3x was darker compared to my tf10, but it sounded better, i could hear things i normally wouldnt catch on my tf10. but also since the siginiture is really dark, some of the tf10 details are not present at all in the um3x.
 
with that said,how is the um3x compared to es5 ? thanks!
 
am currently stuck between the es5 and JH 13

 

[Wildcard30]

Look a little further back in this thread and there are some comparisons.

 

[foveus]

I was dead set on getting the JH16 Pros up until the release of the ES5. I LOVE bass impact and assumed (without hearing them) that the 16's were the perfect custom for me. But, frankly, after reading about all the seal problems, refits and comfort issues I started to second guess customs, and the JH line in particular. After-all, my TF-10's are quite good with my iBasso D10 amp/dac .. do I really need an upgrade. But the never ending quest for 'better' has got me thinking about customs again. That being said, the soft / expanding inner tip of the ES5 is VERY compelling to me as an alternative to the harder tips of the JH line. For those of of you who have tried both, are the ES5's more comfortable, are they easier to wear for longer periods, are they easier to get right (fit-wise) the first time compared to JH? Assuming the sound is comparable (which by reading this forum it seems the bass is comparable to the JH16's) is the comfort and fit of the ES5 that much better than JH? To me this would be a major selling point for Westone and yet it hasn't been much of a focus within this thread.

 

[daveDerek]

Quote:

I was dead set on getting the JH16 Pros up until the release of the ES5. I LOVE bass impact and assumed (without hearing them) that the 16's were the perfect custom for me. But, frankly, after reading about all the seal problems, refits and comfort issues I started to second guess customs, and the JH line in particular. After-all, my TF-10's are quite good with my iBasso D10 amp/dac .. do I really need an upgrade. But the never ending quest for 'better' has got me thinking about customs again. That being said, the soft / expanding inner tip of the ES5 is VERY compelling to me as an alternative to the harder tips of the JH line. For those of of you who have tried both, are the ES5's more comfortable, are they easier to wear for longer periods, are they easier to get right (fit-wise) the first time compared to JH? Assuming the sound is comparable (which by reading this forum it seems the bass is comparable to the JH16's) is the comfort and fit of the ES5 that much better than JH? To me this would be a major selling point for Westone and yet it hasn't been much of a focus within this thread.

the issue of getting a good fit has far more to do with having good impressions taken than the manufacturer. check the esx3 thread and you'll also find folks complaining about fit issues. choose your audiologist carefully! use this thread (and follow the instructions in the first post) http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/440466/the-audiologists-impressions-thread-pun-most-definitely-intended, or go to different iem makers web sites and check for their recommended audiologists. then post your experiences in the aforementioned thread.
 
i'm not sure where you're getting your take on the jh16 vs the es5 from but my listening to the universal versions and from what i've read i think you're quite mistaken!  the es5s don't have the bass bump or bass impact that the 16s have. they are more neutral. so far folks seem to be satisfied with the quality and quantity of bass from their es5s but it's certainly different than how the 16s are tuned! they are both excellent iems, but are different, especially down low.
 
some folks prefer the softer tip, especially if they leave their iems in for very long periods of time or go to sleep with them. but jha owners with a decent fit don't generally complain. otoh there are some people who can't stand to have things stuck deep in their ears, in which case they probably won't like either.

 

[Kunlun]

Quote:

I was dead set on getting the JH16 Pros up until the release of the ES5. I LOVE bass impact and assumed (without hearing them) that the 16's were the perfect custom for me. But, frankly, after reading about all the seal problems, refits and comfort issues I started to second guess customs, and the JH line in particular. After-all, my TF-10's are quite good with my iBasso D10 amp/dac .. do I really need an upgrade. But the never ending quest for 'better' has got me thinking about customs again. That being said, the soft / expanding inner tip of the ES5 is VERY compelling to me as an alternative to the harder tips of the JH line. For those of of you who have tried both, are the ES5's more comfortable, are they easier to wear for longer periods, are they easier to get right (fit-wise) the first time compared to JH? Assuming the sound is comparable (which by reading this forum it seems the bass is comparable to the JH16's) is the comfort and fit of the ES5 that much better than JH? To me this would be a major selling point for Westone and yet it hasn't been much of a focus within this thread.

If you want comfort and bass, you might do better with the medical grade silicone ACS T1
Here's Shigzeo's review: http://www.touchmyapps.com/2010/04/18/acs-t1-custom-fit-iem-in-review/
He liked them a lot and they seem to have very good bass--plus they continually upgrade their sound and build, so if you get them, they'll be better than what Shigzeo has. That's honestly the whole point of this website. It was designed so ordinary people could one-up Shigzeo, even if we didn't live in a palace in Korea surrounded by robot slaves like he does.
 
 Sensaphonics also has a triple-driver medical grade silicone shell custom that should fit your needs for comfort and sound.
 

 

[cooperpwc]

That's honestly the whole point of this website. It was designed so ordinary people could one-up Shigzeo, even if we didn't live in a palace in Korea surrounded by robot slaves like he does.
 
 

I don't know where you come up with this stuff but it's bloody brilliant.

 

[ericp10]

Yea, from what I have read in these threads, I think my recently acquired 1964 EARS Quad (1964-Q) probably has bass equal to the JH16. The bass is powerful, but not overwhelming, but I have never heard bass this deep clear in any IEM (FX700 included). I thought the best bass was the SM3 in BA, but the Quad easily surpasses it. Yet, the bass doesn't overwhelm the rest of the sound spectrum.

 

[kobune]

Got my pair yesterday. My audiologist gave me a wrong quotation so I ended up paying only $850 for them - a good deal[size=10.5pt]([/size][size=10.5pt]≧ω≦[/size][size=10.5pt])/[/size]
I was quite hesitated about whether to go for purple or blue, but finally decided to stick with this sexy color[size=10.5pt](^^[/size][size=10.5pt]ゞ[/size]
 

 

 

 
Tried them on several favorite songs and they are good but didn't really fascinate me. The vocals nicely inherited Westone legacy and have nothing for me to complain. The biggest defect with previous models, the highs, seemed to get improved, but not as much as I have expected given these 50-page reviews. I still think my old UE10Pro is closer than this one to my definition of "crystal clear".

 

[Kunlun]

Quote:

Got my pair yesterday. My audiologist gave me a wrong quotation so I ended up paying only $850 for them - a good deal[size=10.5pt]([/size][size=10.5pt]≧ω≦[/size][size=10.5pt])/[/size]
I was quite hesitated about whether to go for purple or blue, but finally decided to stick with this sexy color[size=10.5pt](^^[/size][size=10.5pt]ゞ[/size]
 

 

 

 
Tried them on several favorite songs and they are good but didn't really fascinate me. The vocals nicely inherited Westone legacy and have nothing for me to complain. The biggest defect with previous models, the highs, seemed to get improved, but not as much as I have expected given these 50-page reviews. I still think my old UE10Pro is closer than this one to my definition of "crystal clear".

Wow, those are gorgeous.  Thanks for the initial impressions, it's nice to have a balanced take. Let us know more when you've had a chance to hear them for a while.