Ultimate Ears Triple Fi 10 Thread
Jun 16, 2011 at 10:11 PM Post #3,811 of 9,690
Thanks, i already read up on that one!
This one is definetly on my list. (Now consisting of one. And one other eventual.)
Just gotta check Chris_Himself's prices and some info!
 
Quote:
Well, if you wanted to know a little more about them, here's a nice review:
 
http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/556123/review-and-impressions-thread-beat-audio-cronus-and-supreme-rose-cables-for-custom-iems
 
If I were ever to get custom cables, I'd probably get these.  They're reasonably priced and don't make any questionable claims about audio quality.  I like the way the company doesn't even openly advertise the materials they're made out of - they feel it'll cloud peoples' judgement on the sound of the cables.



 
 
Jun 17, 2011 at 3:20 AM Post #3,812 of 9,690
Nice wood work on the cross!
biggrin.gif

 
Jun 17, 2011 at 9:40 AM Post #3,813 of 9,690
Now i was contacted by Chris and i am completely sold on him. I'd totally recommend him. (without even personally experience his cables)
Seen a few opinions on them, seen his knowledge and he wrote quite an interesting PM with info. 
He knows what he's talking about, and he has good materials. 

I recommend you to speak to him!


 
Quote:
Well, if you wanted to know a little more about them, here's a nice review:
 
http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/556123/review-and-impressions-thread-beat-audio-cronus-and-supreme-rose-cables-for-custom-iems
 
If I were ever to get custom cables, I'd probably get these.  They're reasonably priced and don't make any questionable claims about audio quality.  I like the way the company doesn't even openly advertise the materials they're made out of - they feel it'll cloud peoples' judgement on the sound of the cables.



 
 
Jun 17, 2011 at 9:44 AM Post #3,814 of 9,690


Quote:
Now i was contacted by Chris and i am completely sold on him. I'd totally recommend him. (without even personally experience his cables)
Seen a few opinions on them, seen his knowledge and he wrote quite an interesting PM with info. 
He knows what he's talking about, and he has good materials. 

I recommend you to speak to him!


 


 



Hm, I'll have to talk to him then.  I was thinking of randomly recabling my crappy old Bose triports just for fun, to get a feel for doing such things...I wanted a premade cable for that, except made from rather cheap materials.  Wonder if he'd be able to give me a hand with that...don't want to spend much though, seeing as how the headphones themselves aren't exactly worth much at all.  The cable that comes with it is worthless...it failed after less than a year and I've reterminated it twice since then.  Just wanted to replace it with a nicer cable for fun.
 
Guess this is a little off-topic though.
 
Jun 17, 2011 at 9:56 AM Post #3,815 of 9,690
65 bucks shipped (i don't know whether he saw that i'm from sweden and took the international shipping into account or not) 
is the lowest he had, as said to me. But that was a high quality cable too. But i don't feel comfortable speaking about it as i don't really have any idea what i'm talking about. 

Yes, i agree that the triports aren't really worth spending on, but they may be as long as you can re-use the cable later on. Which shouldn't be any problem at all! 

Although personally i'm not comfortable using a soldering-iron.
 
Quote:
Hm, I'll have to talk to him then.  I was thinking of randomly recabling my crappy old Bose triports just for fun, to get a feel for doing such things...I wanted a premade cable for that, except made from rather cheap materials.  Wonder if he'd be able to give me a hand with that...don't want to spend much though, seeing as how the headphones themselves aren't exactly worth much at all.  The cable that comes with it is worthless...it failed after less than a year and I've reterminated it twice since then.  Just wanted to replace it with a nicer cable for fun.
 
Guess this is a little off-topic though.



 
 
Jun 17, 2011 at 11:48 AM Post #3,816 of 9,690


Quote:
Well, if you wanted to know a little more about them, here's a nice review:
 
http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/556123/review-and-impressions-thread-beat-audio-cronus-and-supreme-rose-cables-for-custom-iems
 
If I were ever to get custom cables, I'd probably get these.  They're reasonably priced and don't make any questionable claims about audio quality.  I like the way the company doesn't even openly advertise the materials they're made out of - they feel it'll cloud peoples' judgement on the sound of the cables.

 
 
Sorry, but I think that's a ridiculous way to view things. You don't go into a computer shop and just buy a pc without knowing what goes into it. The fact that it works ok after you take it home is irrelevant. As a consumer, the more we know about what we are buying, the better, as it allows us to make an informed choice. Too many of us hand over our money easily, and recommend others do the same not knowing enough about a product. A large part of a cables cost is it's materials, and it should factor into what you pay. In double blind tests, coat hangers, cat5 cables have been used and people loved the sound. Whilst you may be completely happy with the sound quality, it is still a con if they charge you hundreds of dollars for it. You may argue that if someone doesn't know and they are happy with it, and were happy to pay whatever price they did, it's ok, I would counter that by saying, that is taking advantage of the ignorant. It is identical to a scam, where the victim doesn't and never finds out and is frankly an immoral way to behave. I'm not saying however that the guys you linked to are like that, personally, I have no experience with them. I'm merely arguing against the logic that we as consumers should accept that less info is better somehow.
 
Sorry, rant over!
 
Anyway, I came here to share my "very expensive" experience with you guys. I have the Athena V1.2, as far as I'm aware, this is Effect.2010 (ebay name) or Effect-Audio Studio most "advanced" silver cable. Made of 8 cores, 4 each side. I took it apart to check:
 
 

 
 
Yes, that's right, I just destroyed $120 (inc delivery) of value right there.
 
Construction is average to decent. For something this expensive for a cable, I would expect exceptional attention to detail as these are made by a person rather than a factory. The ear guides are pretty poor to be honest and I didn't even want them as I wear mine hanging down rather than over ear, so already off to a poor start there. I don't know why Effect added them, as they don't exist on default on the ebay listing pics and nor with the previous buyer in this thread. The cable is fairly thin and flexible but because they are also tightly braided, the wire's natural bend isn't straightened out by its own weight, because it is so thin and light but is not too big a deal aesthetically. One thing this does affect, along with the plastic sleeve around is cause significant microphonics, which is a big deal. Listen at medium to quiet volumes? You will hear your every move.
 
 
The plugs are coloured white and black, with absolutely zero instructions. Turns out black is right and white is left. Also there is no markings on the plugs themselves to tell you how to orientate them. Effect seems to think it doesn't matter once left and right are sorted out, which way you insert the pin. Which does ring some alarm bells, as this guy makes these cables for specifically advertised for UEs. Let me tell you, of course it matters which way it goes in. Why else would UE insist you put their cables in with the L/R letters facing inwards (towards the bore). Without any differentiation on the plugs themselves, it's left up to you to figure it out. Funnily enough, with the way the cable guides had been moulded, and the wire straightened out, the cable guides were done completely wrong for the correct pin alignment. So to wear it without twisting the cable i would need 2 ears facing the same direction. If you can't visualise, it's demonstrated in this pic:
 

 
Unlike UE cables, with memory wire, the cable guides cannot be adjusted at all to correct this, so I would have to have have worn them with one side twisted, which given the very thin and light wire used would make one side hang awkwardly. Anyway, if you've never heard it, try putting one of your cables on one ear the other way, (if stock UE cable, with one ear using the letters facing outward, you can locate the letter on one side of the plug if you look carefully). You'll notice immediately, the soundstage is all messed up as the stereo imaging is all wrong. This should be pretty obvious to anyone who has ever replaced the cables on their TF10s. But I persevered, I was in the comfort of my own house, so no one could see me wearing this cable with over ear cable guides in the hanging from ear method, I just wanted to hear the sound now, given I spent so long trying to get the damn thing in the correct pin arrangement.
 
 
In terms of sound quality, I A/Bed them with UE clear cables (which is my standard one I use with my TF10s).
 

 

I listened alternatively to each wire on every song I played, a real pain as removing the effect cables was hard, hard enough that I thought I was going to pull out the female part/socket from the headphones themselves (which happened to a friend's set). And left my fingers raw, but this won't affect the average user as they aren't going to swap cables 10 times repeatedly.
 
Music was played through an ipod to silver LOD to amp and then to the TF10s. There is a noticeable difference in sq between the two cables. I'm going to avoid hyperbole like night and day, as it is rarely that. It's a noticeable difference in the treble, as you would expect generally with upgrading from copper to silver, better conductor, lower resistance, higher frequencies seem to benefit. Although, the gauge of the wire used is so thin, due to the 8 core construction, it might inhibit this factor of silver, as thicker wire has lower resistance. The treble was slightly clearer and more pronounced, but unfortunately had no effect on the sibilance/sharpness you sometimes get with some songs.
 
Mids, were ok, no better really or worse than my UE cables. Bass surprisingly also no difference, which was a tad disappointing. When I bought my cables, I contacted Effect, and they assured me that the 8 core wire was the best for bass (funny how it was also the most expensive), which is why I went for the premium cable. If this is the best bass it could get, I'd hate to know what the 4 core sounded like.
 
They offer a new Apollo cable which will set you back even more at $130 delivered, which is supposed to be better bass than the Athena. It's made of "rare" silver plated copper (their words not mine), silver plated copper is a pretty standard audio wire and cheaper than silver, but maybe they've done something special to theirs, who knows.
 
So, for my $120 you get a cable which seems to accentuate the treble, which TF10 already has a bit too much of in my view and no noticeable improvement in the mids which is what most are after with aftermarket cables. I'd say these cables are worth around half that price, if not less. Null Audio pushed the market upwards with what was one the first premium offerings in the aftermarket cable market for TF10s. It seems Singapore has become attuned to this as many cable makers have sprung up. There's no doubt that with the price point and the target market, Effect seems to want to emulate to some extent Null's success, but I don't know if this equivalent pricing level is warranted, although Effect have been very communicative and always replied within the day. Something I know Null is infamous for not doing very well. Null is next, I shall be perhaps embarking on another expensive/fruitless purchase, but my own curiosity is hard to sate.
 
One good thing to come out of this is, I've started listening to the TF10s again, they do have a very fun sound. The mids really aren't that bad at all! A completely different view to the songs I've been used to hearing on the SM3s.
 
P.S.
 
Anyone want this cable?? It may be salvageable with a bit of knowhow, I don't know. PM me, otherwise, the trash will be receiving an expensive deposit.
 
Jun 17, 2011 at 6:49 PM Post #3,818 of 9,690
The TF10s and the TF10 Pros are the same product, only rebranded. I'm not sure about this, but I believe that the models being sold as "Pro"s are older, and therefore are packaged with stiffer cables.
 
Also, the cable supplier is selling silver-plated copper for MORE than silver wire? Either the silver wire is low-grade or you're getting swindled, in my opinion.
 
Jun 17, 2011 at 9:21 PM Post #3,820 of 9,690


Quote:
 
Sorry, but I think that's a ridiculous way to view things. You don't go into a computer shop and just buy a pc without knowing what goes into it. The fact that it works ok after you take it home is irrelevant. As a consumer, the more we know about what we are buying, the better, as it allows us to make an informed choice. Too many of us hand over our money easily, and recommend others do the same not knowing enough about a product. A large part of a cables cost is it's materials, and it should factor into what you pay. In double blind tests, coat hangers, cat5 cables have been used and people loved the sound. Whilst you may be completely happy with the sound quality, it is still a con if they charge you hundreds of dollars for it. You may argue that if someone doesn't know and they are happy with it, and were happy to pay whatever price they did, it's ok, I would counter that by saying, that is taking advantage of the ignorant. It is identical to a scam, where the victim doesn't and never finds out and is frankly an immoral way to behave. I'm not saying however that the guys you linked to are like that, personally, I have no experience with them. I'm merely arguing against the logic that we as consumers should accept that less info is better somehow.
 



I'd have to disagree - they're not trying to deceive anyone.  For one, the construction of the cables has no bearing on the durability so that is of no concern.  And honestly, a lot of people do buy computers without looking at what's inside it.  They just look at the brand name and the price then use it a bit in the store, and if it works fine for them they buy it.  I'm not that kind of person though.

But regardless of how they advertise their cables openly, the company will tell you what they're made of if you simply ask.  They just don't advertise this on their webpage since they feel it's irrelevant.  At any rate, I wouldn't buy a cable just to improve the sound quality, just for durability and because it looks cool.  If the cable offers this, then I honestly don't care if they used repackaged CAT5 cable in it, just so long as it isn't ridiculously priced.
 
Jun 17, 2011 at 9:47 PM Post #3,821 of 9,690
Sorry, I have to apologise dabomb, I was not criticising any manufacturer here, if that's the way it came across, that was unintended. It was mostly for "I like the way the company doesn't even openly advertise the materials they're made out of - they feel it'll cloud peoples' judgement on the sound of the cables."
 
As you've answered, you don't actually behave like this yourself, as you said you're not one of those people that just buy without knowledge. My argument is that you won't even know something is "ridiculously" overpriced or not if you don't even care about what something is made from. This isn't about the manufacturer not advertising it, but rather, more about the consumer accepting it without asking any questions and I was just a bit nonplussed, that you seemed to argue that somehow knowing what you've paid for will "cloud" your judgement of said product. Clearly, you don't do this yourself, so lets put it to one side.
 
Also, I'll assume that "the construction of the cables has no bearing on the durability so that is of no concern." was a typo :wink: . As the construction of the cables has everything to do with it's durability.
 
Jun 17, 2011 at 9:52 PM Post #3,822 of 9,690


Quote:
Sorry, I have to apologise dabomb, I was not criticising any manufacturer here, if that's the way it came across, that was unintended. It was mostly for "I like the way the company doesn't even openly advertise the materials they're made out of - they feel it'll cloud peoples' judgement on the sound of the cables."
 
As you've answered, you don't actually behave like this yourself, as you said you're not one of those people that just buy without knowledge. My argument is that you won't even know something is "ridiculously" overpriced or not if you don't even care about what something is made from. This isn't about the manufacturer not advertising it, but rather, more about the consumer accepting it without asking any questions and I was just a bit nonplussed, that you seemed to argue that somehow knowing what you've paid for will "cloud" your judgement of said product. Clearly, you don't do this yourself, so lets put it to one side.
 
Also, I'll assume that "the construction of the cables has no bearing on the durability so that is of no concern." was a typo :wink: . As the construction of the cables has everything to do with it's durability.



Yeah, sorry, what I really meant was that the actual material the actual cables themselves are made of won't matter as far as durability goes - as in, tin-plated copper, super pure OFC copper, silver or unobtanium.  Of course, the actual construction of the whole cable assembly does matter, and that's all that really matters in this case.
 
Jun 17, 2011 at 10:02 PM Post #3,823 of 9,690
On the whole agreed! Although depending on the casting process, and the crystallisation of which ever metal, be it OCC/ UP-OCC / Cryo, will affect the way the metal responds to repeated flexing / bending/ malleability but for most cases, I will agree durability is generally not too much affected by the type of material you're after. If durability remains your primary concern rather than say, sound quality.
 
Jun 18, 2011 at 1:10 AM Post #3,824 of 9,690


Quote:
 
 
Sorry, but I think that's a ridiculous way to view things. You don't go into a computer shop and just buy a pc without knowing what goes into it. The fact that it works ok after you take it home is irrelevant. As a consumer, the more we know about what we are buying, the better, as it allows us to make an informed choice. Too many of us hand over our money easily, and recommend others do the same not knowing enough about a product. A large part of a cables cost is it's materials, and it should factor into what you pay. In double blind tests, coat hangers, cat5 cables have been used and people loved the sound. Whilst you may be completely happy with the sound quality, it is still a con if they charge you hundreds of dollars for it. You may argue that if someone doesn't know and they are happy with it, and were happy to pay whatever price they did, it's ok, I would counter that by saying, that is taking advantage of the ignorant. It is identical to a scam, where the victim doesn't and never finds out and is frankly an immoral way to behave. I'm not saying however that the guys you linked to are like that, personally, I have no experience with them. I'm merely arguing against the logic that we as consumers should accept that less info is better somehow.
 
Sorry, rant over!
 
Anyway, I came here to share my "very expensive" experience with you guys. I have the Athena V1.2, as far as I'm aware, this is Effect.2010 (ebay name) or Effect-Audio Studio most "advanced" silver cable. Made of 8 cores, 4 each side. I took it apart to check:
 
 

 
 
Yes, that's right, I just destroyed $120 (inc delivery) of value right there.
 
Construction is average to decent. For something this expensive for a cable, I would expect exceptional attention to detail as these are made by a person rather than a factory. The ear guides are pretty poor to be honest and I didn't even want them as I wear mine hanging down rather than over ear, so already off to a poor start there. I don't know why Effect added them, as they don't exist on default on the ebay listing pics and nor with the previous buyer in this thread. The cable is fairly thin and flexible but because they are also tightly braided, the wire's natural bend isn't straightened out by its own weight, because it is so thin and light but is not too big a deal aesthetically. One thing this does affect, along with the plastic sleeve around is cause significant microphonics, which is a big deal. Listen at medium to quiet volumes? You will hear your every move.
 
 
The plugs are coloured white and black, with absolutely zero instructions. Turns out black is right and white is left. Also there is no markings on the plugs themselves to tell you how to orientate them. Effect seems to think it doesn't matter once left and right are sorted out, which way you insert the pin. Which does ring some alarm bells, as this guy makes these cables for specifically advertised for UEs. Let me tell you, of course it matters which way it goes in. Why else would UE insist you put their cables in with the L/R letters facing inwards (towards the bore). Without any differentiation on the plugs themselves, it's left up to you to figure it out. Funnily enough, with the way the cable guides had been moulded, and the wire straightened out, the cable guides were done completely wrong for the correct pin alignment. So to wear it without twisting the cable i would need 2 ears facing the same direction. If you can't visualise, it's demonstrated in this pic:
 

 
Unlike UE cables, with memory wire, the cable guides cannot be adjusted at all to correct this, so I would have to have have worn them with one side twisted, which given the very thin and light wire used would make one side hang awkwardly. Anyway, if you've never heard it, try putting one of your cables on one ear the other way, (if stock UE cable, with one ear using the letters facing outward, you can locate the letter on one side of the plug if you look carefully). You'll notice immediately, the soundstage is all messed up as the stereo imaging is all wrong. This should be pretty obvious to anyone who has ever replaced the cables on their TF10s. But I persevered, I was in the comfort of my own house, so no one could see me wearing this cable with over ear cable guides in the hanging from ear method, I just wanted to hear the sound now, given I spent so long trying to get the damn thing in the correct pin arrangement.
 
 
In terms of sound quality, I A/Bed them with UE clear cables (which is my standard one I use with my TF10s).
 

 

I listened alternatively to each wire on every song I played, a real pain as removing the effect cables was hard, hard enough that I thought I was going to pull out the female part/socket from the headphones themselves (which happened to a friend's set). And left my fingers raw, but this won't affect the average user as they aren't going to swap cables 10 times repeatedly.
 
Music was played through an ipod to silver LOD to amp and then to the TF10s. There is a noticeable difference in sq between the two cables. I'm going to avoid hyperbole like night and day, as it is rarely that. It's a noticeable difference in the treble, as you would expect generally with upgrading from copper to silver, better conductor, lower resistance, higher frequencies seem to benefit. Although, the gauge of the wire used is so thin, due to the 8 core construction, it might inhibit this factor of silver, as thicker wire has lower resistance. The treble was slightly clearer and more pronounced, but unfortunately had no effect on the sibilance/sharpness you sometimes get with some songs.
 
Mids, were ok, no better really or worse than my UE cables. Bass surprisingly also no difference, which was a tad disappointing. When I bought my cables, I contacted Effect, and they assured me that the 8 core wire was the best for bass (funny how it was also the most expensive), which is why I went for the premium cable. If this is the best bass it could get, I'd hate to know what the 4 core sounded like.
 
They offer a new Apollo cable which will set you back even more at $130 delivered, which is supposed to be better bass than the Athena. It's made of "rare" silver plated copper (their words not mine), silver plated copper is a pretty standard audio wire and cheaper than silver, but maybe they've done something special to theirs, who knows.
 
So, for my $120 you get a cable which seems to accentuate the treble, which TF10 already has a bit too much of in my view and no noticeable improvement in the mids which is what most are after with aftermarket cables. I'd say these cables are worth around half that price, if not less. Null Audio pushed the market upwards with what was one the first premium offerings in the aftermarket cable market for TF10s. It seems Singapore has become attuned to this as many cable makers have sprung up. There's no doubt that with the price point and the target market, Effect seems to want to emulate to some extent Null's success, but I don't know if this equivalent pricing level is warranted, although Effect have been very communicative and always replied within the day. Something I know Null is infamous for not doing very well. Null is next, I shall be perhaps embarking on another expensive/fruitless purchase, but my own curiosity is hard to sate.
 
One good thing to come out of this is, I've started listening to the TF10s again, they do have a very fun sound. The mids really aren't that bad at all! A completely different view to the songs I've been used to hearing on the SM3s.
 
P.S.
 
Anyone want this cable?? It may be salvageable with a bit of knowhow, I don't know. PM me, otherwise, the trash will be receiving an expensive deposit.


That cable seems better made than my Lune cable for TF10.  The left and right wires that are twisted are not protected by clear flexible sleeving and in time will unravel itself. The red and blue right/left indicator dots are nothing more than smeared paint and doesn't even look like a circle.  And my biggest disappointment about the build quality is the neck choker.  Paid the same amount of money as your effect audio cable and all they could put is a clear rubber tubing
mad.gif
angry_face.gif

 
 
 
Jun 18, 2011 at 9:32 AM Post #3,825 of 9,690


Quote:
That cable seems better made than my Lune cable for TF10.  The left and right wires that are twisted are not protected by clear flexible sleeving and in time will unravel itself. The red and blue right/left indicator dots are nothing more than smeared paint and doesn't even look like a circle.  And my biggest disappointment about the build quality is the neck choker.  Paid the same amount of money as your effect audio cable and all they could put is a clear rubber tubing
mad.gif
angry_face.gif

 
 


That's not great to hear. Although the fact that Null understand that you NEED left and right indicators shows a bit more understanding than Effect do. The neck chocker on my Cable is also a bit of tubing. The Lune these days comes in teflon sleeving and nylon is an option. But really, I think we can both agree neither cable should demand the kind of premium they do in terms of materials.
 
How does your Lune sound at least? I was more disappointed with the SQ on the Athena than anything else, the build is decent/fair (expected more for my money, but it doesn't look like it's going to break immediately).
 
 
Also, I think the UE cables are pretty decent, maybe criticised more than they should. I don't know if anyone else has had the "clear" variety. But you can see that each strand is braided, but itself is also made of multiple cores braided in miniature. This is what it looks like going into each ear, the weakness may be the Y split, where the wire doesn't flow all the way to the jack but are actually 2 segments soldered together at the Y split.
 

 
 

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