The FiiO X3 Thread UPDATE: Project Back On! Read the First Post for Information.

[stozzer123]

Really seems enthusiasm for the x3 has taken has taken a turn.

 

[qusp]

Quote:

Really seems enthusiasm for the x3 has taken has taken a turn.

well I think thats overstating it, its been a long time since this troubled project was announced and many of us waited quite a while to end with nothing, since then quite a lot of products have been released and the landscape has changed considerably. we are simply discussing possible spinoff products that dont have the same thick competition. to push ahead without reassessing the market would be unwise

 

[DigitalFreak]

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Well to be fair apple rather did "play it safe" from a certain point of view. Their very controlling nature is how they are playing safe. Whether it be from the million patents and standards associated with their products, the law-suites they have brought forward, and their methods of control through their software. But they definitely are innovative as well.

I disagree, Apple didn't play it safe and if memory serves me right they were only months away from closing the doors when they decided to radically redesign their computer line. That got them profitable again and the the iPod was also a gamble. Yes others had MP3 players out on the market but it was Apple that was able to take current technology and actually put it together with a UI that wasn't clunky. Then came the iPhone and the iPod touch, Ballmer from Microsoft openly laughed at Apple when they released the first iPhone. A few years later Ballmer is no longer laughing and if anything he made himself look like a buffoon, which he is.
 
If the X3 is just going to be another middle of the road sounding MP3 player then make the UI simple and clean gimme SD card support allow DAC/amp bypass and make the form factor slim and I'll be passably content. From the old pics I've seen the MP3 player has a bit of thickness to it so I would hope it's not middle of the road sounding and it's guts has enough good hardware behind it to make it sound beyond middle of the road and sound great. If it's going to sound mediocre at best and have a sizable thickness to it then that tells me the hardware implementation is also mediocre at best and probably utilizes overly cheap parts which to me means the project is already a dismal failure.

 

[Anaxilus]

Yup, people forget how bad Apple had it for decades.  The ipod/phone changed everything.

 

[bowei006]

@doublea

Clieos haa mentioned that by far, most of their sales comes from the mainstream market.

 

[doublea71]

Quote:

@doublea
Clieos haa mentioned that by far, most of their sales comes from the mainstream market.

What mainstream products do they sell? What mainstream shops can their products be found in? Since when did mainstream consumers start buying portable headphone amps? Have you EVER seen somebody wearing Beats (clearly a mainstream product) plugged into a headphone amp? The mainstream has no idea headphone amps even exist. If this is what they truly believe, then Fiio has no idea who is buying their products.

 

[Achmedisdead]

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What mainstream products do they sell? What mainstream shops can their products be found in? Since when did mainstream consumers start buying portable headphone amps? Have you EVER seen somebody wearing Beats (clearly a mainstream product) plugged into a headphone amp? The mainstream has no idea headphone amps even exist. If this is what they truly believe, then Fiio has no idea who is buying their products.

 
I'm inclined to agree with this. People I know that have seen me with a headphone amp have said, "what the hell is that thing?" and when I told them, then said, "well, why would you need one?" 
And I have yet to see a headphone amp in any brick and mortar store here in the USA. I know there are hifi-oriented stores here and there that would offer them, but they are few and far between. I've had to purchase all of the ones I've had online.

 

[ClieOS]

From what I know, FiiO ships close to 10K units of amps in a good month, so even if we were to only count the last two years, conservatively, that should be almost 200K units of amps shipped. Out of those, the majority is the lowest end of their line-up, the E6 (and E5 before it). In contrast, many top-of-the-line to semi high-end portable amps are sold under 1K units per year, most are well under that figure. One could have argued that these are mostly because FiiO is much cheaper in comparison, which of course is a very valid reason. Maybe a few of those who buy an E6 might end up buying a RSA, Headamp, iBasso, whatever top-brand out there, but the truth is most will just stop there, either be happy or give up completely. It is only logical to assume that way. . While one might call those as audiophile, I'll call them "average consumer who wanted a taste of better SQ". These are the people who know they will not spend over a certain point for audio stuff, because they are really not that into it. Regardless of how we want to refer to these group of user, audiophile or not, we all know this is really just playing with semantic.. The audiophile we are (or at least I am) talking here is the kind of people who are obsessed with audio gears and willing to spend big money on them even for small improvement, but not the kind who are only wanting to have a little taste of it. We could just as well call them 'Group A', but it doesn't change the nature of their spending pattern.

 

[bowei006]

Quote:

From what I know, FiiO ships close to 10K units of amps in a good month, so even if we were to only count the last two years, conservatively, that should be almost 200K units of amps shipped. Out of those, the majority is the lowest end of their line-up, the E6 (and E5 before it). In contrast, many top-of-the-line to semi high-end portable amps are sold under 1K units per year, most are well under that figure. One could have argued that these are mostly because FiiO is much cheaper in comparison, which of course is a very valid reason. Maybe a few of those who buy an E6 might end up buying a RSA, Headamp, iBasso, whatever top-brand out there, but the truth is most will just stop there, either be happy or give up completely. It is only logical to assume that way. . While one might call those as audiophile, I'll call them "average consumer who wanted a taste of better SQ". These are the people who know they will not spend over a certain point for audio stuff, because they are really not that into it. Regardless of how we want to refer to these group of user, audiophile or not, we all know this is really just playing with semantic.. The audiophile we are (or at least I am) talking here is the kind of people who are obsessed with audio gears and willing to spend big money on them even for small improvement, but not the kind who are only wanting to have a little taste of it. We could just as well call them 'Group A', but it doesn't change the nature of their spending pattern.

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What mainstream products do they sell? What mainstream shops can their products be found in? Since when did mainstream consumers start buying portable headphone amps? Have you EVER seen somebody wearing Beats (clearly a mainstream product) plugged into a headphone amp? The mainstream has no idea headphone amps even exist. If this is what they truly believe, then Fiio has no idea who is buying their products.

As CLIEOS points out there are many mainstream people in Asia that know what an amp is. Go to a store that has them and bam, you buy one or look online for headphone amplifiers and FiiO BAM shows up.
 
FiiO's higher end mont blanc and kun lun and Alpen target audiophiles but their other ones while they do target audiophiles are also consumer series in a sense

 

[shotgunshane]

Most of those average consumers also have an iPhone, Samsung or HTC smart phone with their music. Why would they buy a dedicated dap with digital line outs and one that mounts to an E9 desktop amp? I don't see anyway around a Fiio flagship amp, like the e12, and dedicated dap catering to anyone other than an audio enthusiast; especially one that may sound better than the e17. If they are just looking for a taste of supposed better sound, then it sounds like they are trying the e6, not a dedicated dap. I'm really confused with the circular logic.

 

[ClieOS]

Most of those average consumers also have an iPhone, Samsung or HTC smart phone with their music. Why would they buy a dedicated dap with digital line outs and one that mounts to an E9 desktop amp? I don't see anyway around a Fiio flagship amp, like the e12, and dedicated dap catering to anyone other than an audio enthusiast; especially one that may sound better than the e17. If they are just looking for a taste of supposed better sound, then it sounds like they are trying the e6, not a dedicated dap. I'm really confused with the circular logic.

I said it before, "those who don't want to go mainstream yet can't afford the high-end stuff'. They probably really want a CLAS or HP-P1 but can't justify the $600+ price tag. So they stick back to their smartphone for music and soon discover they don't have enough battery to play games anymore. Perhaps something better than Clip+ yet doesn't put a hole in the bank account? Complicated, I guess Maybe you are right, X3 could be the first big flop for FiiO. But it is kind of too late to change the direction right now and FiiO seem to think they are taking the safer route.

 

[shotgunshane]

Then those people aren't average consumers. They're budget oriented audio/gadget enthusiasts/hobbiests. I'm sure Fiio will do just fine; there seem to be enough people that will buy anything they put out. Meantime I can't get a digital line out without buying a freaking brick in 2012. It's beyond aggrevaiting.

 

[stozzer123]

Quote:

What mainstream products do they sell? What mainstream shops can their products be found in? Since when did mainstream consumers start buying portable headphone amps? Have you EVER seen somebody wearing Beats (clearly a mainstream product) plugged into a headphone amp? The mainstream has no idea headphone amps even exist. If this is what they truly believe, then Fiio has no idea who is buying their products.

 
You only have to step foot in low yat in malaysia, mbk in thailand or a few areas of tokyo where you will see fiio stocked on mainstream shelves right next to mainstream daps and headphones (even in apple stores), maybe its not the case in the west but the markets there and if clieos numbers are correct (which i believe are) then thats a good amount of amps to be shifting. 

 

[qusp]

maybe a raspberry pi or one of the lower power similar units is the way forward, hmm if I had the time i'd start a group on it.

 

[jgray91]

Quote:

 
You only have to step foot in low yat in malaysia, mbk in thailand or a few areas of tokyo where you will see fiio stocked on mainstream shelves right next to mainstream daps and headphones (even in apple stores), maybe its not the case in the west but the markets there and if clieos numbers are correct (which i believe are) then thats a good amount of amps to be shifting. 

This I have never seen. Where is this shop(s) in low yat?