Sennheiser HD 600 Impressions Thread
Oct 6, 2020 at 9:15 PM Post #20,941 of 23,425
Hmm, the HD600 should have more presence in those regions than the HD6xx..

Yep, all frequency graphs would say they should. This has been a good lesson though for me, that frequency graphs are not everything and there's something about the sum of the parts that is greater than the individual parts.
 
Oct 6, 2020 at 10:01 PM Post #20,942 of 23,425
Even though the tone is better on acoustic instruments (piano, etc.) on the HD-600, when I'm running the HFM HE-500 (mods) and HFM HE-6se (mods) all on my Rag 1, I like the two HFM's better. They just have more body and better dynamics - esp on amplified music.

OTOH when on the BHC, the 600 casts the a spell as Peter Green wrote on "Black Magic Women".
 
Oct 7, 2020 at 8:10 PM Post #20,944 of 23,425
They have umph and impact on my vintage Yamaha SS amp. :)

HD-600 are fast and clean so they get the leading edge impact well. But when headphone fans talk impact they are often talking the HE-6. Compare those to the HD-600 on SS or OTL? The 600's are not even in the same area code. Even the HE-500, HE-6SE, Audeze LCD-2 all easily outpace the HD-600 in impact and umpf.

RTings have the HD-600 starting to go under 0 db at 110 Hz, down 5 db at 60 Hz, and down 10 at 30 Hz. Get a test CD/LP/whatever vs a can or speakers with fairly even bass down to 35 Hz or under, and it's quite apparent that important things are missing in the 600. I'm far from a bass head, but if I want that sort of presentation - I'd rather listen to Quad ESL's (any), Dan Clark (Voce), Stax cans (007, 009, 700), or a Maggie 3.7i, 20, 30 - and I'm talking over 100 Hz, under 100 Hz only the ESL 57 is a rough match for the 600, the others all crush it.

I love the 600, great with vocals, pianos, classical small to large ensembles. Just great, but when I want to hear "cafe' blue" by Patricia Barber, Wilson's remastered King Crimson or Yes recordings, or Stanley Clarke's first solo CD - I do not reach for the 600's - because it doesn't satisfy like my planars.
 
Oct 8, 2020 at 11:26 AM Post #20,945 of 23,425
Yep, all frequency graphs would say they should. This has been a good lesson though for me, that frequency graphs are not everything and there's something about the sum of the parts that is greater than the individual parts.
I know I keep banging on about it, but also don't forget about the possibility of intersample variations. e.g. I bought 2 pairs of HD600 within a couple of weeks of each other from Amazon, I sent the second pair back for a refund because it had harsh and 'shouty' mids. Much later I bought a used pair of HD600 for my dad. This pair has poorer bass extension than my pair but I actually prefer the sound of his pair because it has more "air" in the high treble and therefore sounds a little more open than my HD600.

In the last couple of years I added the HD660S, HD650 and HD58X to my collection, all bought new. According to my measurements, my HD600 is almost identical to the HD650 with respect to bass extension to below 20Hz, but the HD650 has more bass from 20Hz to 300Hz when a perfect seal is made. My HD660S has the weakest bass extension, and my HD58X has the strongest bass extension.

With regards to my HD600 vs HD650, I prefer the 600 because the 650 sounds more muddy/bloated in the mid-bass/upper-bass and slightly thicker and more shouty in the upper-mids. The fact that my HD650 also has less treble than my HD600 further increases my preference for the HD600. I can however make my HD650 sound almost identical to my HD600 with a few simple EQ adjustments. With this EQ applied you'd find it very difficult indeed to distinguish between these two headphones in a blind A/B test.

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Oct 8, 2020 at 8:01 PM Post #20,947 of 23,425
What are these elastic bands?? Are you strapping these to your head?
It is very difficult to get a reliable seal on the miniDSP EARS measurement rig for consistent/repeatable results. (The pinnae are too large and stiff and the flatplate isn't cushioned enough). Placing elastic bands around the ear cups isn't ideal but it improves the consistency of the measurements.
 
Oct 8, 2020 at 10:06 PM Post #20,948 of 23,425
These are really nice headphones. My DT880's crapped out yesterday and I plugged these into my Violectric V220.
I can't recall ever liking these headphones this much.:L3000:
 
Oct 10, 2020 at 3:14 AM Post #20,949 of 23,425
These are really nice headphones. My DT880's crapped out yesterday and I plugged these into my Violectric V220.
I can't recall ever liking these headphones this much.:L3000:
It's a weird thing sometimes, as with all media experiences honestly. It's like how some movies, you watch a second or third time and each time it feels different than the first time; I often see people comment about how they would be lukewarm about a movie the first watch, but for whatever reason they'll watch it a second or even third time and they come out of it saying they enjoyed it more. Likewise, sometimes we listen to some headphones and while we don't consider it amazing, maybe we keep it around. 500 listens later, something feels different and BAM, now you're experiencing it like you didn't think you had before!
 
Oct 10, 2020 at 8:45 AM Post #20,950 of 23,425
It's a weird thing sometimes, as with all media experiences honestly. It's like how some movies, you watch a second or third time and each time it feels different than the first time; I often see people comment about how they would be lukewarm about a movie the first watch, but for whatever reason they'll watch it a second or even third time and they come out of it saying they enjoyed it more. Likewise, sometimes we listen to some headphones and while we don't consider it amazing, maybe we keep it around. 500 listens later, something feels different and BAM, now you're experiencing it like you didn't think you had before!

That is why I keep a large selection of headphones. When you haven't used a set in a month or more and put them on, it is like getting a new set.

Also, sometimes 'phones that you were luke warm about sound better or at least different.

Today, for the first time, I hooked up my Schiit Loki to my Violectric V220 and Liquid Platinum. I am curious what a bit of bass kick will do to the 600's. Be interesting with the 660's too.
To be clear, I already like the bass from these amps. But if you have toys, you have to play. :ksc75smile:
 
Oct 10, 2020 at 9:40 AM Post #20,951 of 23,425
Hey fellow New Zealander! Yea agreed, I was expecting the HD600 to be rather lifeless and neutral in the bass, but it's certainly there and entertaining. I think the Asgard3 is failry musical AMP/DAC and give sit a lot of power, so might be that too.
I bought a pair of HD600s two days ago. I expected a more neutral sound signature. I found it to be great with my upgraded bottle head crack, especially with classical music vs my HD650s. After the first 4 hours, I was loving the HD600s. The improved treble and tight, but sufficient base is great for critical listening. Then, I listened again the next day and I once again love the warm sound signature of my HD650s. I think having both of these cans is the best situation. It’s like having Northern Italian and Southern Italian food. Both are good and in any given day you may prefer one over the other.
 
Oct 10, 2020 at 12:38 PM Post #20,952 of 23,425
I've only been at this hobby for a few months and I am really getting an education on sound. Not only technical terms, but what I actually like vs. don't like. When you first hear great audio for the first time, Your ears perk up because it isn't used to hearing something so great. But, just because that sound is better than anything else you've heard before, it doesn't mean that is your favorite version of that sound. This is what I am learning. I just thought that music quality was just a linear scale. It's either very bad or it's good on a scale from 1-10. That's not true. You can have one rendition of the sound on one system that you really like. Then, you can have a very different sounding version of that same song and you can like it just as much. This is something I did not understand until now. This makes this hobby very very interesting and expensive.

I am learning that if I do an A/B comparison, one headphone may win in almost every category. But then, you just relax and listen non critically and you can like the other more. This is what I am learning about the HD650 and HD600 headphones. When I listened critically, I concluded that in most of the important dimensions that the HD600s were better. But then, when I just wanted to rest my mind and listen for pleasure, I found that I loved the HD650 the most. The warm sound really embraces me in a good way. I thought in critical listening that the HD600s were better for classical music. I could hear everything better and every individual element of sound was better with the HD600s. But, when I just wanted to listen for enjoyment, I actually liked the HD650 better even for most classical. I really did not expect that. This is only a few days in. I may change my mind again tomorrow. Wow. I love this hobby.
 
Oct 10, 2020 at 7:27 PM Post #20,954 of 23,425
I know I keep banging on about it, but also don't forget about the possibility of intersample variations. e.g. I bought 2 pairs of HD600 within a couple of weeks of each other from Amazon, I sent the second pair back for a refund because it had harsh and 'shouty' mids. Much later I bought a used pair of HD600 for my dad. This pair has poorer bass extension than my pair but I actually prefer the sound of his pair because it has more "air" in the high treble and therefore sounds a little more open than my HD600.

In the last couple of years I added the HD660S, HD650 and HD58X to my collection, all bought new. According to my measurements, my HD600 is almost identical to the HD650 with respect to bass extension to below 20Hz, but the HD650 has more bass from 20Hz to 300Hz when a perfect seal is made. My HD660S has the weakest bass extension, and my HD58X has the strongest bass extension.

With regards to my HD600 vs HD650, I prefer the 600 because the 650 sounds more muddy/bloated in the mid-bass/upper-bass and slightly thicker and more shouty in the upper-mids. The fact that my HD650 also has less treble than my HD600 further increases my preference for the HD600. I can however make my HD650 sound almost identical to my HD600 with a few simple EQ adjustments. With this EQ applied you'd find it very difficult indeed to distinguish between these two headphones in a blind A/B test.

50436560493_ed81c7bfd3_o.jpg


50437426437_14c4c58309_o.jpg


50437252346_2cfe4ce9b7_o.jpg

Well someone probably pointed this out, but there is no way a properly functioning HD-600 is ~+15 db at 4.5 kHz. Never seen such a graph published before. It looks pretty accurate under 2 KHz and over 8 kHz is fairly reasonable too. The fact that both cans track the same curves pretty much seal the deal. They are fine and your measuring rig has an issue.
 
Oct 10, 2020 at 7:56 PM Post #20,955 of 23,425
Well someone probably pointed this out, but there is no way a properly functioning HD-600 is ~+15 db at 4.5 kHz. Never seen such a graph published before. It looks pretty accurate under 2 KHz and over 8 kHz is fairly reasonable too. The fact that both cans track the same curves pretty much seal the deal. They are fine and your measuring rig has an issue.

Yep that's not right at all.
 

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