Final Audio Design Impressions and Discussion Thread
Nov 3, 2018 at 10:52 AM Post #8,041 of 11,629
Semantics about the dumb iPhone dongle asside, the iPhone X drives the e4000 just fine in my experience so far.

I can't comment on other phones, but you can do the math if you know your phone's output and how loud you like to listen. Or a site like http://www.digizoid.com/power.php can do the math for you. Final says the e4000s are 15ohm and 97db sensitivity.
 
Nov 3, 2018 at 4:35 PM Post #8,042 of 11,629
Semantics about the dumb iPhone dongle asside, the iPhone X drives the e4000 just fine in my experience so far.

I can't comment on other phones, but you can do the math if you know your phone's output and how loud you like to listen. Or a site like http://www.digizoid.com/power.php can do the math for you. Final says the e4000s are 15ohm and 97db sensitivity.
Loudness and properly driven are two different things.
 
Nov 3, 2018 at 5:03 PM Post #8,043 of 11,629
Nov 9, 2018 at 2:54 AM Post #8,044 of 11,629
Are there any impressions out there of the Make2/3? Specifically in relation to the E5000, with whom they share a somewhat similar dynamic driver? Would love to pick up a pair of the latter as a casual, around-the-town driver, but the sound leak is absolutely prohibitive. Hoping that the form factor of the Make reigns this problem in (if indeed they are similar.)
 
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Nov 9, 2018 at 4:00 AM Post #8,045 of 11,629
Are there any impressions out there of the Make2/3? Specifically in relation to the E5000, with whom they share a somewhat similar dynamic driver? Would love to pick up a pair of the latter as a casual, around-the-town driver, but the sound leak is absolutely prohibitive. Hoping that the form factor of the Make reigns this problem in (if indeed they are similar.)
The only reviews out there are in Japanese since they have only been released domestically, and through Makuake, the japanese Kickstarter. The reviews I've found focus more on the tune-ability rather than stock sound from what I've seen. From what I remember reading from Japanese twitter comments, the make 3 is warm and bassy, make 2 is slightly V shaped, and the make 1 is neutral/brighter than the first 2. I have a feeling the most popular model is the make 2.


Based on frequency responses seen here: http://snext-final.com/en/products/makeseries/ , It looks like the Make 3 and 2 are fairly similar with the 2 being a little more neutral in the midrange, and having more 10khz and higher treble energy. I imagine the fact the Make 2 has a BA driver along with the DD makes the difference.


I own the e5000 and bought the Make 2 from someone who funded the original makuake(japanese kickstarter). I should be receiving it tomorrow.
 
Nov 9, 2018 at 4:42 AM Post #8,046 of 11,629
The only reviews out there are in Japanese since they have only been released domestically, and through Makuake, the japanese Kickstarter. The reviews I've found focus more on the tune-ability rather than stock sound from what I've seen. From what I remember reading from Japanese twitter comments, the make 3 is warm and bassy, make 2 is slightly V shaped, and the make 1 is neutral/brighter than the first 2. I have a feeling the most popular model is the make 2.


Based on frequency responses seen here: http://snext-final.com/en/products/makeseries/ , It looks like the Make 3 and 2 are fairly similar with the 2 being a little more neutral in the midrange, and having more 10khz and higher treble energy. I imagine the fact the Make 2 has a BA driver along with the DD makes the difference.


I own the e5000 and bought the Make 2 from someone who funded the original makuake(japanese kickstarter). I should be receiving it tomorrow.

Thank you for your reply and bringing me up to speed with the impressions in Japan! And oh what a most excellent timing! Just a day away! Yes, yes, do let me know how they stack up, whenever you have the time, whenever you've listened enough to be sure; the ins and outs of the signature yes, but as you know being an owner of the e5000, the pertinent question is in the presentation: are they even half as emotionally and romantically tuned, and do they have even half the versatility? Much obliged!
 
Nov 9, 2018 at 3:38 PM Post #8,047 of 11,629
The only reviews out there are in Japanese since they have only been released domestically, and through Makuake, the japanese Kickstarter. The reviews I've found focus more on the tune-ability rather than stock sound from what I've seen. From what I remember reading from Japanese twitter comments, the make 3 is warm and bassy, make 2 is slightly V shaped, and the make 1 is neutral/brighter than the first 2. I have a feeling the most popular model is the make 2.


Based on frequency responses seen here: http://snext-final.com/en/products/makeseries/ , It looks like the Make 3 and 2 are fairly similar with the 2 being a little more neutral in the midrange, and having more 10khz and higher treble energy. I imagine the fact the Make 2 has a BA driver along with the DD makes the difference.


I own the e5000 and bought the Make 2 from someone who funded the original makuake(japanese kickstarter). I should be receiving it tomorrow.

Im very much looking forward to hearing your impressions. How much are make headphones going for?
 
Nov 9, 2018 at 4:10 PM Post #8,048 of 11,629
Im very much looking forward to hearing your impressions. How much are make headphones going for?
According to their crowdfunding page, the retail prices are: Make 1: 59,800円(~$525), Make 2: 32,800円(~$288), Make 3: 16,800円($147.64)
 
Nov 13, 2018 at 7:48 AM Post #8,049 of 11,629
The only reviews out there are in Japanese since they have only been released domestically, and through Makuake, the japanese Kickstarter. The reviews I've found focus more on the tune-ability rather than stock sound from what I've seen. From what I remember reading from Japanese twitter comments, the make 3 is warm and bassy, make 2 is slightly V shaped, and the make 1 is neutral/brighter than the first 2. I have a feeling the most popular model is the make 2.


Based on frequency responses seen here: http://snext-final.com/en/products/makeseries/ , It looks like the Make 3 and 2 are fairly similar with the 2 being a little more neutral in the midrange, and having more 10khz and higher treble energy. I imagine the fact the Make 2 has a BA driver along with the DD makes the difference.


I own the e5000 and bought the Make 2 from someone who funded the original makuake(japanese kickstarter). I should be receiving it tomorrow.

Sorry for pestering, but did you manage to get the make2?
 
Nov 13, 2018 at 8:33 AM Post #8,050 of 11,629
I wouldnt mind a Make 2 myself!
 
Nov 13, 2018 at 9:00 AM Post #8,051 of 11,629
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Nov 14, 2018 at 3:39 AM Post #8,052 of 11,629
Sorry for the delay! Exams and studying got in the way of sitting down and just focusing on the Make 2s. I'm posting it here since this definitely belongs here (its an impression of a Final Audio Design product) and this topic gets more traffic.
14zHHa2.jpg



They came with the same cable as the e4000, same case, same earhooks, and same tips. While the cable isn't nearly as nice as the one included in the e5000, it has its perks. Its a lot less microphonics, a lot less flashy (if you don't want to show off in public), and a lot easier to manage and roll up while using them outside. I also get some extra piece of mind not worrying about ruining a $200+ cable.

YvgcvJk.jpg

I apologize for the awful picture; I couldn't figure out how to take a nice earshot. As advertised, it fits extremely well with minimal discomfort. Its the most ergonomic "over ear" IEM I've worn and I feel it would be difficult to beat without leaning toward custom IEMs.
692_ext_16_en_17.jpg

Side by side with the KZ Andromedas (ZS6) which hurts my ears pretty quickly and has a much more finicky fit. Granted, the Make 2 is almost 10x more expensive.
4Tw3ypr.jpg



Finally, what everyone probably actually cares about, how it sounds. I don't really like giving to give a review/impressions without listening for a couple of weeks because of inherent bias such as the honeymoon period and new toy syndrome, but will try my best to give you guys a general idea.

My biggest concern when I purchased these was that they would be too similar to the e5000 to justify owning them. I'm happy to say they are pretty different. The e5000 is what I'd describe as warm bass+mids with a smooth but extended treble. Immediately tell the make 2 is more "dynamic". In short, I'd describe it as having nice sub energy, lots of vocal presence/upper midrange and exciting treble.


They advertised the make 2 as having a "similar driver" to the e4000/e5000 and I can definitely hear the similarities. That being said, the E5000 comes out on top in regards to bass. It has more rumble in the sub and body to the midbass. The bass on the make 2 is toned down in comparison but still has the nice dynamic driver bass decay and impact. the make 2 is a hybrid so it BA driver which gives it a lot more energy in the upper frequencies. You miss out on those lush mids of the e5000 which make the make 2 sound more "airy" overall. I haven't tried the e4000, but I imagine that they would sound a lot more similar.



The funny thing is that everything I said above is based on one out of the 847 possible configurations of the Make 2. This IEM was designed to be tuned by the user to fit their preferences. While there is a limit to how much you can actually change the sound, different combinations of filters and foams look like they can really change the frequency response.The "recipe" I used was one that was suggested by the Final Audio japanese twitter:

音導管フィルターA:A-6 (Sound Pipe Filter A)
音導管フィルターB:B-1(Sound Pipe Filter B)
ドライバーホルダー:A-1(Driver Holder)


All the info about the Make 2 and the tuning can be found here: http://snext-final.com/en/products/detail/MAKE2
 
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Nov 14, 2018 at 4:50 AM Post #8,053 of 11,629
My biggest concern when I purchased these was that they would be too similar to the e5000 to justify owning them. I'm happy to say they are pretty different. The e5000 is what I'd describe as warm bass+mids with a smooth but extended treble. Immediately tell the make 2 is more "dynamic". In short, I'd describe it as having nice sub energy, lots of vocal presence/upper midrange and exciting treble. They advertised the make 2 as having a "similar driver" to the e4000/e5000 and I can definitely hear the similarities. That being said, the E5000 comes out on top in regards to bass. It has more rumble in the sub and body to the midbass. The bass on the make 2 is toned down in comparison but still has the nice dynamic driver bass decay and impact. the make 2 is a hybrid so it BA driver which gives it a lot more energy in the upper frequencies. You miss out on those lush mids of the e5000 which make the make 2 sound more "airy" overall. I haven't tried the e4000, but I imagine that they would sound a lot more similar.

Since I just received them as well... and also own the E5000. I agree with your description of the E5000, but I'd say the Make 2 out of the box with no tuning is not too far from E5000 bass but with more control and a tighter presentation. Maybe less mid bass so the sub bass stands out more. The biggest difference in my opinion is the mids which are both more forward in the mix and with better clarity so yes upper mids have been lifted from E5000. Treble is very similar to E5000 only since bass are less prominent they are also more prominent. A very balanced presentation and even without tuning I could see myself liking the Make 2 :)

I would say out of the box, the Make 2 sounds like a refined E5000, with less of a warm tuning but still on the warm side of neutral with very good bass impact and control.

The Make 2 comes by default with Recipe 1 :


tcQcfFctZ5wlWZ1M6Umes5vmPtlwNi.png


8eKdITKjXEiDLUOpEGkEj2sa05FH1Z.png



Fit is really amazingly good (as good as the likes of AK T8ie), no need for Earhooks, although I swapped the Final E tips as the biggest size is too small for the shallow fit. I switched to Symbio W with foam removed and got a perfect seal.

You still need plenty of power to drive them, WM1Z with high gain is fine single ended. I switched for a Hansound Zen 4 wire balanced cable and there is noticeable improvement, balanced doesn't need high gain.
 
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Nov 14, 2018 at 5:03 AM Post #8,055 of 11,629
The Make 2 sound tempting. The E5000 were just a bit too lush and easygoing for me in the end. A more dynamic and impactful variant would be just the job. The prospect of hundreds of tuning options gives me the yips though. The anxiety of choice and all that.

I love them and they're great value for money but I won't keep the E5000 now as I can probably tune the Make 2 to sound like the E5000 anyway :)

The baseline is so good already I can say like for the E5000 it's amazing value for money.
Sure 847 variants is a bit overwhelming but let's take that as a game and I am curious to see how this turns out :)
Sharing config is going to be fun :D
 

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