[rutter]

Just to be sure, have you upgraded to 1.0.9 firmware yet? What are your impressions with current DX220 so far?

I updated immediately. One thing I noticed people claiming is that dap updates in general can improve sound quality (apparently Sony has done this a few times) but the DX220 is supposed to be ahead of the DX200 from the start. I have good quality iems, have tried good quality music, which really narrows things down and certain things need answers. In reality I have bigger doubts over both the iems and the music due to generally how well regarded these iBasso DX2**s are and the particular complaints I have. Getting some new tips for my iems, then the iems will go and be replaced. At the same time I'm trying to understand if I'm the only one hearing the DX220 not change as might be expected. Nothing is above consideration. My initial impression seemed to be an outlier too but since then a couple of people have noted that initially the DX220 is not very good.

@rutter You are welcome to your opinions about any bit of audio kit, its your opinion though, why not write a review and express these within it.

Writing reviews is putting the cart ahead of the horse. I'm not trying to have the definitive word from the start, I'm trying to explore. Really, ideally, I would've never spent a lot of time on this forum as I would've gotten my money's worth months ago. But this "hobby" requires interaction, to put it politely.

1. It will put new buyers off purchasing something that to their ears may we be the "best thing ever", a kind of audio perfection, if that's possible on Head-Fi.
2. People that already own an item and think its great may start to doubt there own ears and opinion.

This is a forum, not an advertisement or an echo chamber.

Rutter, please don't convince everybody that the DX220 is "bad beans".

If I'm an outlier why would people take me so seriously?

 

[warriorpoet]

@rutter

The problem is the human mind is very subjective and plays tricks on us. An example, the coffee in the machines here at work started tasting awful and I was convinced it had been switched to a cheaper brand, it just got worse and worse until I saw the machine being filled with the beans and they were the same as they always were. Suddenly the coffee was back to normal again.

Rutter, please don't convince everybody that the DX220 is "bad beans".

Good beans really are better though

 

[jmills8]

@rutter You are welcome to your opinions about any bit of audio kit, its your opinion though, why not write a review and express these within it.

If somebody is constantly writing bad things about something two main things may happen.

1. It will put new buyers off purchasing something that to their ears may well be the "best thing ever", a kind of audio perfection, if that's possible on Head-Fi.
2. People that already own an item and think its great may start to doubt their own ears and opinion.

The problem is the human mind is very subjective and plays tricks on us. An example, the coffee in the machines here at work started tasting awful and I was convinced it had been switched to a cheaper brand, it just got worse and worse until I saw the machine being filled with the beans and they were the same as they always were. Suddenly the coffee was back to normal again.

Rutter, please don't convince everybody that the DX220 is "bad beans".

Well thought out and deep. The opposite can also happen. A new puppy or a fan boy gets the early unit and starts raving about his new toy causing people to buy it and end up not liking it.

 

[435279]

Well thought out and deep. The opposite can also happen. A new puppy or a fan boy gets the early unit and starts raving about his new toy causing people to buy it and end up not liking it.

I hadn't quite expanded my thought process that far. But absolutely true, yes.

 

[rutter]

Here are the doubts I'm having currently with the DX220 + amp8. One, in particular the width of the soundstage has not expanded from the start. Two, at multiple points I was impressed by how the sound was coming across as big and bold, full bodied and direct, sort of enveloping. Recently as I've gone over say 120 hours I've perceived the sound to be mellowing. Three, I question imaging and sound clarity. It's ok, but I expected much better. I basically didn't get the positive progression through burn-in. Currently sitting at a little above 150 hours.

 

[Researcher]

Is everyone at or past the 150-hour mark happy with the DX220, especially those using amp8? What other daps have you tried and what do you think the DX220 is doing well? Mine with a new amp8 as well lost its "grandiosity", it's more mellow, the soundstage is not bigger than it was at first, I think the ZX300 may have done imaging better, and perceived clarity is just ok. I'm not blown away like others claim to be and I've experienced some regression as well as stagnation with burn-in.

For all here, Please take kindly this post. Not mean to fight the lovers or known reviewers here. But, i wish you had kept yourself not to buy this before watching HBB. I believe many paid writers or company workers perform well-marketing through all threads. personally waiting for a review video by HBB, who is really a trustable reviewer.

 

[apirat]

This or Fiio X7 Mark II, opinions?

 

[rutter]

For all here, Please take kindly this post. Not mean to fight the lovers or known reviewers here. But, i wish you had kept yourself not to buy this before watching HBB. I believe many paid writers or company workers perform well-marketing through all threads. personally waiting for a review video by HBB, who is really a trustable reviewer.

HBB? What did this HBB think of the DX200 and amp 8? Both reviewers and forum posters seemed to be quite positive. Very good sound and great value.

 

[WindowsX]

I updated immediately. One thing I noticed people claiming is that dap updates in general can improve sound quality (apparently Sony has done this a few times) but the DX220 is supposed to be ahead of the DX200 from the start. I have good quality iems, have tried good quality music, which really narrows things down and certain things need answers. In reality I have bigger doubts over both the iems and the music due to generally how well regarded these iBasso DX2**s are and the particular complaints I have. Getting some new tips for my iems, then the iems will go and be replaced. At the same time I'm trying to understand if I'm the only one hearing the DX220 not change as might be expected. Nothing is above consideration. My initial impression seemed to be an outlier too but since then a couple of people have noted that initially the DX220 is not very good.

As DX200 owner, I share some of your opinions here. DX220 is like minor change of DX200 product line. It runs on same processor, same dual ES9028Pro DAC with some improvements but ultimately they're both the same tier product. AMP1 mk2 may tuned to sound closer to popular AMP8 performance and probably sound better than AMP1 in DX200.

Also, it's DAP with sound signature that some may like or dislike. Maybe some will prefer AK sound signature, some will prefer Sony, some Cayin. I'm not really on any side since I'm coming from summit tier of stereo systems where $30k DAC still sound far from holy grail. I also modded tons of flagship over $3k DAP based on my experience with $30k DAC I heard and own. Maybe I'm the only one here who has this kind of opinion but DX220 is good for its offering price.

Regards,
Keetakawee

 

[gc335]

And as soon as I place my order through ibasso, the DX220 is now on amazon.

Ugh, figures. Oh well.

Edit: Shipping from China seems faster. I ordered from iBasso on Monday morning and I should have my 220 on Thursday.

 

[fzman]

Here are the doubts I'm having currently with the DX220 + amp8. One, in particular the width of the soundstage has not expanded from the start. Two, at multiple points I was impressed by how the sound was coming across as big and bold, full bodied and direct, sort of enveloping. Recently as I've gone over say 120 hours I've perceived the sound to be mellowing. Three, I question imaging and sound clarity. It's ok, but I expected much better. I basically didn't get the positive progression through burn-in. Currently sitting at a little above 150 hours.

I've chosen this post to reply to, just as a place to jump in the discussion. Rutter, what is it that you truly want from your gear? (Legit question, not trolling, not trying to 'dis' you.) From reading your posts, in general, it sems like you have a specific idea in mind as to how recordings 'should sound', and I am not sure whether they actually sound that way or not. You mention expansive soundstage in the post I quoted--most recordings don;t have a soundstage at all, let alone an expansive one-if you hear a system that provides one for EVERY recording, it is doing something creative, not reproducing what is actually on the recordings. I think most people claim they are seeking hi-fi, but are really seeking their personal nirvana of my-fi. (I don't think this is a bad thing, but I think some people conflate hi-fi with my-fi).

I think that you (and me, and most others, as well,) sometimes take it out on the gear under discussion, when it does not provide the proper flavor of my-fi, or if one has skewed or unrealsitic expectations as to what gear can actually do. I'm pretty sure, by way of hyperbolic example, that there is no dap or iem that will magically reveal that every recording ever made has a secret Jimi Hendrix guitar solo embedded in it, heretofore, unheard via inferior gear.

I believe in burn-in and break-in, and have often found some ups and downs-seems normal to me. I also think that portable gear faces additional obstacles to great sound, as they take some time to even warm up enough to be in their 'happy place'. I think that can affect A-B comparisons, as B may be more warmed up than A, depending on the methodology.

I also think that there are going to be trade-offs with portable gear, no matter what. Physical size constrains power, battery life, number of card slots, amount of coircuitry, etc. Features like speed, awsome screen, super-fast UI, all kinds of wireless connectivity, affect price and probably sonic quality as well - (putting an rf/microwave antenna next to critical audio circuitry can't help sonics any.....) So, you chooose your trade-offs and live with them (or go all Richard Branson/Jeff Bezos/Elon Musk and devote billions in research to overcome these physical, technological and financial barriers).

Lastly, always try to read past the fan-boy and the 'emperor has no clothes' folks on Head-Fi. Most of us are really decent people, struggling to find their bliss. There is always the ignore feature.

 

[Light - Man]

Guys, can anyone tell us why this new flagship DAP does not have the flagship ES9038 DAC chip?

Also surely one DAC chip would suffice for a portable device, so is it done for marketing purposes?

I have the ES9038 DAC chip in my cheap but excellent portable DAC/Amp (which also has Bluetooth HD and which also sounds remarkable).

Will the hype train ever end?!

 

[icefalkon]

Guys, can anyone tell us why this new flagship DAP does not have the flagship ES9038 DAC chip?

Also surely one DAC chip would suffice for a portable device, so is it done for marketing purposes?

I have the ES9038 DAC chip in my cheap but excellent portable DAC/Amp (which also has Bluetooth HD and which also sounds remarkable).

That was discussed a while ago in this thread.

Will the hype train ever end?!

Probably not.

 

[rutter]

I've chosen this post to reply to, just as a place to jump in the discussion. Rutter, what is it that you truly want from your gear? (Legit question, not trolling, not trying to 'dis' you.) From reading your posts, in general, it sems like you have a specific idea in mind as to how recordings 'should sound', and I am not sure whether they actually sound that way or not. You mention expansive soundstage in the post I quoted--most recordings don;t have a soundstage at all, let alone an expansive one-if you hear a system that provides one for EVERY recording, it is doing something creative, not reproducing what is actually on the recordings. I think most people claim they are seeking hi-fi, but are really seeking their personal nirvana of my-fi. (I don't think this is a bad thing, but I think some people conflate hi-fi with my-fi).

I think that you (and me, and most others, as well,) sometimes take it out on the gear under discussion, when it does not provide the proper flavor of my-fi, or if one has skewed or unrealsitic expectations as to what gear can actually do. I'm pretty sure, by way of hyperbolic example, that there is no dap or iem that will magically reveal that every recording ever made has a secret Jimi Hendrix guitar solo embedded in it, heretofore, unheard via inferior gear.

I believe in burn-in and break-in, and have often found some ups and downs-seems normal to me. I also think that portable gear faces additional obstacles to great sound, as they take some time to even warm up enough to be in their 'happy place'. I think that can affect A-B comparisons, as B may be more warmed up than A, depending on the methodology.

I also think that there are going to be trade-offs with portable gear, no matter what. Physical size constrains power, battery life, number of card slots, amount of coircuitry, etc. Features like speed, awsome screen, super-fast UI, all kinds of wireless connectivity, affect price and probably sonic quality as well - (putting an rf/microwave antenna next to critical audio circuitry can't help sonics any.....) So, you chooose your trade-offs and live with them (or go all Richard Branson/Jeff Bezos/Elon Musk and devote billions in research to overcome these physical, technological and financial barriers).

Lastly, always try to read past the fan-boy and the 'emperor has no clothes' folks on Head-Fi. Most of us are really decent people, struggling to find their bliss. There is always the ignore feature.

I've heard what the HD800S does with every recording. It's not that I want that, but I have enough experience with headphones and iems to know the range of things that are possible with recordings I have access to. Earlier during burn-in there was an encouraging phase, something that just needed to be built on. Not really a wide sound but a dimensional one, full [bodied] and generally forward/direct too. I.e. a substantial sound that you could get engaged and sort of enveloped in. Definition, clarity, and vibrancy come on top. The immediate problem is to me it sounds like things have regressed. At some point past 100 hours the sound mellowed. No improvement in clarity, definition, vibrancy, and separation occurred. Imaging as well as dimensional sound seems to have regressed. The sound is no longer big and bold. To use one word, it's blah or meh. Not words I want associated with $3,000 combined. What really puzzles me is that I heard better before on this device.

In light of prices I don't think any of us are taking anything unreasonable out on the gear. Quite to the contrary. Same applies to realistic expectations. Knock a digit off, have some leeway with the remaining three, then we can talk about realistic expectations. At >=$1000 the only reasonable thing is to have high expectations. I'm 150 hours in, will continue to burn and break in.

 

[jmills8]

I've heard what the HD800S does with every recording. It's not that I want that, but I have enough experience with headphones and iems to know the range of things that are possible with recordings I have access to. Earlier during burn-in there was an encouraging phase, something that just needed to be built on. Not really a wide sound but a dimensional one, full [bodied] and generally forward/direct too. I.e. a substantial sound that you could get engaged and sort of enveloped in. Definition, clarity, and vibrancy come on top. The immediate problem is to me it sounds like things have regressed. At some point past 100 hours the sound mellowed. No improvement in clarity, definition, vibrancy, and separation occurred. Imaging as well as dimensional sound seems to have regressed. The sound is no longer big and bold. To use one word, it's blah or meh. Not words I want associated with $3,000 combined. What really puzzles me is that I heard better before on this device.

In light of prices I don't think any of us are taking anything unreasonable out on the gear. Quite to the contrary. Same applies to realistic expectations. Knock a digit off, have some leeway with the remaining three, then we can talk about realistic expectations. At >=$1000 the only reasonable thing is to have high expectations. I'm 150 hours in, will continue to burn and break in.

Maybe it will never be as good as the first hit.