[sadhanaputra]

I tried searching the forum for threads like this, but surprisingly I couldn't find any... Maybe the wording was wrong.

Anyway.

The saga began when I bought a pair of PL50s (used). Opened the box, plugged them in to my Clip+, and immediately concluded that I didn't like their sound signature. Too warm. (Vocals just sounded too.. echo-ey? flange-y? Don't know how to put it exactly, sorry..)

So anyway. I decided to play with the EQ to find out what it is about the signature that I don't like. So I switched to "Custom" EQ on my Clip+. It didn't do anything at first, until I turned up the treble ONE notch.

Et voilá!

It made all the difference in the world.
The first thing that stroke me was that the volume was lower. And the vocals got more 'normal' and laid back. Just 'colder', somehow, and more flat.

It's not the kind of difference that one notch on the treble would achieve. I tried reducing the treble and making the EQ [seem] flat again, and back came the "Normal" sound signature (warm, flangey, echoey). Turned up the BASS, and the same effect was achieved.

Colder, less echo, less flange, more... flat...
(A little bit less detailed, though, but perhaps it's just because of the mids getting more laid back..)

I searched the web trying to confirm my findings, but all I could found was the issue about the decreasing volume, but no mention about the change in sound sig.

I tested using Hippo Shroom and VB, and got the same result.

After 10 minutes using the "one-notch-short-of-flat-Custom-EQ", switching the EQ back to Normal would make the sound insufferable to me. Too warm!

Anybody has the same experience, or at least could shed some light on the situation?
Thanks

PS: It sucks knowing that EQ drains my battery..

 

[mobbaddict]

It's really hard to compare the normal EQ with your custom one, except if you increase the volume by about 5 db on your custom one (+5 everywhere) and switch from one to another. I did try this comparison and to me they sounded the same.

 

[sadhanaputra]

I tried what you suggested, mobbaddict, and I actually found that they were indeed indistinguishable.. That's weird..

In "one-notch-short-of-flat-custom" EQ, I tried to increase the volume, even up to uncomfortable levels (i.e. louder than the normal), but I could've sworn I couldn't reach the echo-ey-ness of the normal EQ..

Do increasing the volume and increasing the EQ uniformly give different effects? They shouldn't..
Or do my ears play trick on me?

 

[Punnisher]

The EQ on the clip is broken. There are threads about it somewhere.

I would not use it.

 

[sadhanaputra]

Hey! I have an avatar now.. Cute.. @Punnisher: broken how, exactly? You mean, like, the way it drains battery?

 

[xnor]

 
multitone measurement with the eq settings you described, normalized
 
Measuring the same with a sweep instead indeed looks like something's broken

 

[JaZZ]

Quote:

...The saga began when I bought a pair of PL50s (used). Opened the box, plugged them in to my Clip+, and immediately concluded that I didn't like their sound signature. Too warm. (Vocals just sounded too.. echo-ey? flange-y? Don't know how to put it exactly, sorry..) So anyway. I decided to play with the EQ to find out what it is about the signature that I don't like. So I switched to "Custom" EQ on my Clip+. It didn't do anything at first, until I turned up the treble ONE notch. Et voilá! It made all the difference in the world.
The first thing that stroke me was that the volume was lower. And the vocals got more 'normal' and laid back. Just 'colder', somehow, and more flat.
 

It's not long ago that I got myself a new Cip+. It sounded fine from the start, but I soon noticed that the EQ wasn't set to «normal», but (I believe) to «full bass». Changing to normal sounded almost a bit disappointing, but just until I imatched the volume. Of course increasing certain frequency bands also increases the perceived volume.
 
Quote:

 
multitone measurement with the eq settings you described. Measuring the same with a sweep instead indeed looks like something's broken

Why this? What exactly is «multitone measurement»? Pink noise or something like that? Would you mind posting other EQ bands, too?
 
BTW, the Clip's equalizer sounds really usable to me. And this although I'm spoiled by the iAudio 7's semi-parametric equalizer.
.

 

[sadhanaputra]

That was awesome, xnor.. I just 'thumbs-up-'ed you..
I can't really see the sweep graph, though, only the multitone..
 
So the treble does increase 1dB.. I guess my ears HAVE been deceiving me.. 

 
Thanks for the help, everyone This is a great place! I'm looking forward to one day giving something back

 

[Punnisher]

I guess "broken" is a matter of opinion.
 
Edit: Well I didn't know this thread was about the clip+. Sorry! So take this with a grain of salt.
 
If you go to the custom EQ screen and change one bar, the whole frequency range changes. When changed, it enters custom EQ mode which is vastly different sounding than OFF.
 
In my opinion, if you bump up the treble one notch, it should do just that. Increase the treble. Instead it enters a different mode where the whole frequency range shifts.

 

[setmenu]

JaZZ
Have you tried Rockbox yet? The eq with that is sweeet!

 

[JaZZ]

Quote:

JaZZ
Have you tried Rockbox yet? The eq with that is sweeet!

Hi Mark
 
No, not yet. I think I will wait for a stable version. And for now I'm waiting for a SanDisk 32-GB microSDHC card. Should be available early June.
.
 

 

[xnor]

Quote:

Quote:
 
Why this? What exactly is «multitone measurement»? Pink noise or something like that? Would you mind posting other EQ bands, too?.

It more or less mimics pink noise, yes, but it's easier to generate and analyze, especially for precise measurements (like this, hehe). 

I can post other EQ bands too of course, but first I need some sleep.
 
And I forgot to mention that the graph above is normalized. The EQ attenuates the signal by about 4.5 dB. (=> headroom to prevent clipping I guess)
I'll also test what happens if all sliders are turned up or down.
 
Quote:

If you go to the custom EQ screen and change one bar, the whole frequency range changes. When changed, it enters custom EQ mode which is vastly different sounding than OFF.
 
In my opinion, if you bump up the treble one notch, it should do just that. Increase the treble. Instead it enters a different mode where the whole frequency range shifts.

I don't think so, see above. Might explain the effect you've "heard".
 

 

[JaZZ]

I think now I know hat you mean. «Normal» is indeed louder than a flat «custom» EQ. On the other hand, it sounds fairly neutral. Could it be that this setting incorporates a special bit headroom for high band increases to avoid clipping?
.
Quote:

I tried what you suggested, mobbaddict, and I actually found that they were indeed indistinguishable.. That's weird..

In "one-notch-short-of-flat-custom" EQ, I tried to increase the volume, even up to uncomfortable levels (i.e. louder than the normal), but I could've sworn I couldn't reach the echo-ey-ness of the normal EQ..

Do increasing the volume and increasing the EQ uniformly give different effects? They shouldn't..
Or do my ears play trick on me?

 

[JaZZ]

Damned, you already explained it before me!  

.

 

[setmenu]

Quote:

Hi Mark
 
No, not yet. I think I will wait for a stable version. And for now I'm waiting for a SanDisk 32-GB microSDHC card. Should be available early June.
.
 

Yep, it's not overly stable at the mo, but you can always boot to the original firmware when you want reliability, hehe.
It seems much more stable on the the clip V2 , I actually prefer the sound of the V2 it's the clip i use with my amp/ety setup.
The plus does duty as my minimalist player at the mo, and I have another V2 I use with stock firmware as control for comparisons.
But i love the microsd card capability of the plus,got an 8gig at the mo, 32gig are quite a few$$$$ presently.
 
.