[Yuan]

different context mate. Iem is a want more than a need. You need a phone though.

What I'm trying to say is that you don't need the totl to do the work everytime, and so you're saying getting a Samsung flagship is the better choice?

 

[Lurk650]

Like.....you can't hear anything?

Lol you can hear but really it's not that good according to some people. Other people enjoy it. It's a rather smooth top end, some claim a little too smooth.

What is your price range? Sensitivity to treble? Preferred sound sig if you have one?

 

[HiFiChris]

  I'm thinking of getting either Fiio EX1 or Vyrus. They are about the same price. I'm looking for something that have balanced to a little warm sound signature. A little better soundstage than my current beater (GR07 MKII) would be good too. Any suggestion?

 
Out of the two, it would be the Vyrus if that's your tonal aim. On the technical level, I would rate the Fidue A65 higher though, but its soundstage is quite small (however very precise and sharply separated).

 

[SuperMAG]

so now everyone doesnt like **** 4in1, Wow, this is ridiculus.

 

[crabdog]

so now everyone doesnt like **** 4in1, Wow, this is ridiculus.

I haven't changed my opinions on it. I still think it's great.

 

[BramblexD]

Ordered the 4in1, KZ ZST and Monk +, hope they won't dissapoint. 

 

[danimoca]

  so now everyone doesnt like **** 4in1, Wow, this is ridiculus.

 
The hype train has derrailed.
 

 

[Sylmar]

  so now everyone doesnt like **** 4in1, Wow, this is ridiculus.

I still have it in the mail and I'm still very much looking forward to it. Of course there is hype but the backlash is just as overreacting often. They probably won't be the best thing ever at this price but pretty enjoyable nonetheless which is all I'm looking for. 

 

[audio123]

so now everyone doesnt like **** 4in1, Wow, this is ridiculus.

lucky i didnt get it.

 

[JustJoseph]

The truth behind this thread

There should be sign warning newcomers to the thread about how the products here are overhyped and to proceed with caution before making purchases.

To sum up this thread:
Subscribers have this impression that Chinese iems (especially diy ones) have a better price to performance ratio compared to iems from established brands, due to these small firms making huge savings on advertising, R&D and other costs that big firms incur. This is partially true, as can be seen in some successful products eg havi, vsonic, dunu etc. As a result, some listeners go on a journey to find the mythical "giant killer", an iem so good it destroys others from big brands.

This bias towards diy products, coupled with the fact that new products are released almost every few days leads to them being hyped. Hype in turn creates even more hype, giving the impression that these iems are godly.

The sub 30usd catergory is flooded with numerous iems. Reviewers sometimes claim that they "beat iems many times their price" and are "external good for the price, you must try". Comments like a 40 usd hybrid going on head to head with 200 is hybrids is not unheard of. From 200 usd onwards, there are many multi driver diy iems (eg 350 for 9 drivers) that are claimed to beat shures, Westone iems and even encroach upon ciem territory. They are supposedly totl iems, offering a sound found in 700usd Western iems.

These diy iems have serious flaws:
-some have poor build qualities. This is made worse by the lack of warranty (some sellers offer a few months warranty tho), which can be painful especially if the iem is expensive eg 300usd. On the other hand, iems from big brands rarely have issues.
-their tuning can be terrible sometimes. Big brands spend larges amounts of monies on tuning so it is very rare that an iem sounds like ****. At worst, you get an iem that sounds meh but still listenable. On the other hand, small companies don't have high quality tuning skills or experience. For example, the original dqsm and zhiyin qt5 sound like ****. They are just unlistenable. I know sound is subjective, but if most people agree an iem sounds like ****, then it is ****. Its not only the number of drivers that matters, but the tuning plays a huge role too. Think about it, are you really going to buy a 7 driver iem tuned by a nobody based off a single persons positive opinions on it? And sometimes the person giving impressions hasn't listened to any totl iems to be able to give proper feedback. The most expensive the product is, the more you should care about tuning. Worse thing is, these products were over hyped at the beginning, and no one dared to admit they were bad as it would be an unpopular opinion at the time. Even reputable head fiers praised them. Those who gave negative impressions were told to do tip rolling and "burn in for 100 hours" which is imo utter ******** as if a product sounds terrible to you at the start, then it is terrible. Burn in or tip rolling isn't going to change the sound considerably for your impression to change by much, it's likely your brain adapting to the new sound signature or being coerced by the hype train to enjoy the iem. Only after many copies were bought did everyone come to a consensus that they are horrible. This shows how bad the hype train can be. I myself caught onto the hype and bought dqsm, ignoring the few negative comments, only to be shocked when I listened to them myself. To this date, dqsm and qt5 still have overwhelming positive feedback and high star ratings on aliexpress. But to be fair, there are instances of well tuned iems like the lz iems and banned d***. Too bad they are a rarity in this thread.

-lack of R&D. Big brands spend tonnes on research and development in their iems for example shure se846 with their sub woofer like bass. As a result, their iems can have unique strengths, making the products differentiated. You have jvc woodies with their insane timbre and bass,sennheiser ie80 with their natural tonality, shure se846 with their unrivaled sub bass, ciems with their speed and coherency created by high technology crossovers and design, sonys with their big ass hybrids and dynamics which sound so huge and unique. Diys don't have the R&D needed to make such sounds. For the sub 100 category, you can argue that the choice of driver itself makes the most difference to the sound, that I agree. But for iems above 300,you are looking for some special quality, eg high quality airy treble or rich bass. I don't think putting 7 drivers together in a simple crossover network is going to cut it. You need research and technology. I feel that these multi drivers Diys will sound quite similar and have no special qualities that the aforementioned iems do. They offer nothing special. Those who say their good really need to listen to some totl iems objectively. Those successful Chinese iems all have something special about them. Dunu 2kj with their bass, flc 8 with their tuning options.

Imo, of you're interested in buying iems based on recommendations here, this is what you should do
-try not to get influenced by overhyping. Don't 100 percent trust reputable head fiers as some have hyped up **** products before only to denounce them later. Only trust them if they have given trusted opinions in the past.
-don't not buy into reviews which claim the iems can "rival others many times their price". If it sounds too good to be true, it likely is. I've seen someone claim the lz a2 had equal level of details, even more in the sub bass levels compared to sennheiser ie 800, and nobody questioned it. This is just one example.
-don't be influenced too much by impressions which compare a diy to another diy (which you have never heard before and would likely judge based on some overhyped impressions). Some claim A is better than B, B is better than C and the list goes on when you don't even know how good A really is. Instead lean towards impressions that actually compare these iems to reputable brand iems,especially for the expensive ones.

 

[SuperMAG]

lol you summed it up nicely, still hoping the 4in1 is not one of those scenarios and is actually almost as good as its hyped.

 

[Saoshyant]

I think I've read like two or three people that were unhappy with the 4in1.  I've certainly read more people that have liked it so far.  It's still in the early phases and more people will chime in with thoughts.  To say the hype train has derailed to me is jumping the gun.  Yes, there are some out there that have a bad tendency with new toys to get overly excited, which makes people think it'll be the greatest thing ever, then expectation ruins an objective first opinion...  even the people that currently are saying they don't like it very well might be the 4in1's biggest champions in a few weeks.

 

[Folly]

After over a month I'm still enjoying my 4in1 and again I will say that they are a no brainer for the price.

 

[nhlean96]

Yeah, I prefer the 4in1 over my RE400. Will receive my XE800 soon, I think the XE800 is the safer choice for a budget IEM

 

[Holypal]

There should be sign warning newcomers to the thread about how the products here are overhyped and to proceed with caution before making purchases.

To sum up this thread:
Subscribers have this impression that Chinese iems (especially diy ones) have a better price to performance ratio compared to iems from established brands, due to these small firms making huge savings on advertising, R&D and other costs that big firms incur. This is partially true, as can be seen in some successful products eg havi, vsonic, dunu etc. As a result, some listeners go on a journey to find the mythical "giant killer", an iem so good it destroys others from big brands.

This bias towards diy products, coupled with the fact that new products are released almost every few days leads to them being hyped. Hype in turn creates even more hype, giving the impression that these iems are godly.

The sub 30usd catergory is flooded with numerous iems. Reviewers sometimes claim that they "beat iems many times their price" and are "external good for the price, you must try". Comments like a 40 usd hybrid going on head to head with 200 is hybrids is not unheard of. From 200 usd onwards, there are many multi driver diy iems (eg 350 for 9 drivers) that are claimed to beat shures, Westone iems and even encroach upon ciem territory. They are supposedly totl iems, offering a sound found in 700usd Western iems.

These diy iems have serious flaws:
-some have poor build qualities. This is made worse by the lack of warranty (some sellers offer a few months warranty tho), which can be painful especially if the iem is expensive eg 300usd. On the other hand, iems from big brands rarely have issues.
-their tuning can be terrible sometimes. Big brands spend larges amounts of monies on tuning so it is very rare that an iem sounds like ****. At worst, you get an iem that sounds meh but still listenable. On the other hand, small companies don't have high quality tuning skills or experience. For example, the original dqsm and zhiyin qt5 sound like ****. They are just unlistenable. I know sound is subjective, but if most people agree an iem sounds like ****, then it is ****. Its not only the number of drivers that matters, but the tuning plays a huge role too. Think about it, are you really going to buy a 7 driver iem tuned by a nobody based off a single persons positive opinions on it? And sometimes the person giving impressions hasn't listened to any totl iems to be able to give proper feedback. The most expensive the product is, the more you should care about tuning. Worse thing is, these products were over hyped at the beginning, and no one dared to admit they were bad as it would be an unpopular opinion at the time. Even reputable forum figures praised them. Only after many copies were bought did everyone come to a consensus that they are horrible. This shows how bad the hype train can be. I myself caught onto the hype and bought dqsm, ignoring the few negative comments, only to be shocked when I listened to them myself. To this date, dqsm and qt5 still have overwhelming positive feedback and high star ratings on aliexpress. But to be fair, there are instances of well tuned iems like the lz iems and banned d***. Too bad they are a rarity in this thread.

-lack of R&D. Big brands spend tonnes on research and development in their iems for example shure se846 with their sub woofer like bass. As a result, their iems can have unique strengths, making the products differentiated. You have jvc woodies with their insane timbre and bass, shure se846 with their unrivaled sub bass, ciems with their speed and coherency created by high technology crossovers and design, sonys with their big ass hybrids and dynamics which sound so huge and unique. Diys don't have the R&D needed to make such sounds. For the sub 100 category, you can argue that the choice of driver itself makes the most difference to the sound, that I agree. But for iems above 300,you are looking for some special quality, eg high quality airy treble or rich bass. I don't think putting 7 drivers together in a simple crossover network is going to cut it. I feel that these multi drivers Diys will sound quite similar and have no special qualities that the aforementioned iems do. They offer nothing special. Those successful Chinese iems all have something special about them. Dunu 2kj with their bass, flc 8 with their tuning options.

 
I couldn't agree more. The DIY market is a big mess. Anyone who wants to spend more than 200$ for an unknown N-driver DIY iem should be very careful. The established brands in China are Vsonic, DUNU, Fidue, Soundmagic. Even they have quality issues.
 
Some iems have good reputation in China, like flc8s, iBasso it03, Oriolus black and Oriolus grey.