[kiteki]

In high end custom IEM's they use the Ety ER-4 or the Knowles TWFK to cut the midrange and drop the bass.
 

 
 
 
On that note, the TWFK costs $69 alone if you order it, i.e. just the driver......... I just bought a UE 700 for $90!!
 
 

 

[a_recording]

Quote:

 
 
On that note, the TWFK costs $69 alone if you order it, i.e. just the driver......... I just bought a UE 700 for $90!!
 
 

hehe from Fast Eddie?
 

 

[kiteki]

From fast eddie!
 

 

[Heret1c]

Quote:

 
A single dynamic driver is vastly superior to any single BA driver in existence.
 
 
 
Thumbs up if you agree =]

Really cant agree with this as its a grossly exaggerated generalization. There are certainly dynamics which sound worse than even the lowest qualty BA drivers and vice versa. Plus, some may just prefer the BA sound in comparison to a dynamic, provided they are of the relative same quality.
 
 

 

[Heret1c]

Quote:

 
I know I'm about to open a can of worms, but could you elaborate on why a BA can't sound as airy as a vented dynamic, such as the JVC? According to the glossary, airiness is a phone's ability to reproduce high-frequency reflections and to extend in the 15-20kHz range. Wouldn't "trapping the sound inside the housing" actually improve airiness? BAs are also known to handle speed and treble better than dynamics. Provided that the reflection of higher frequencies does not create interference inside the enclosure, I don't see why BAs couldn't perform as well, if not better, than dynamics, in this regard.
 
I figure that both technologies are simply means to reach a goal, particularly as of late, with dynamics tuned to sound like BAs and vice versa, moving armatures, cellulose drivers, and phones like the Merlin that combine several types. It seems sort of futile to classify sounds as being more like a DD or BA when we can't even tell what either sounds like anymore.

Just my 0.02 but perhaps what he meants was the sense of space? if so, I would have to agree somewhat that vented dynamics IEMs or open back dynamic headphones would excel at this vs a BA-based IEM. Of course, it also true that despite being vented, a dynamic driver IEM could sound just as smallor large as another BA IEM.
 
 
Edit: Forget what i just said up here. Read down a few more pages and realised I was totally off. Sigh.

 

[Heret1c]

Quote:

 
I think terms such as speed, decay, resolution, micro-details, timbre, instrument separation, extension and soundstage are often misused, abused and often simply 'regurgitated'.  

Agreed, I'll be the first to admit i dont fully understand these terms yet, despite reading the glossaries. And after spending some time reading reviews / impressions, etc its quite bovious their defined slightly different by each person and that only makes it harder (for me at least) to fully understand it.
 
 

 

[Heret1c]

Quote:

See, there is no 'right' technology.  Only 'right' sound (for your ears).  To address an earlier post BA's are actually older (1919) and more antiquated than dynamics.
 
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Headphones

Quote:

Overall I agree that each transducer technologies have their pluses and minuses and that design and implementation are what matters the most. So here's my message to less experienced HeadFiers, don't fall for fanboys of either camp and keep your ears and mind open.

Never truer words spoken IMO. Also, very interesting re the age ot he BA transducer. I ignorantly thought it was a discovery no more than 50yrs in age.
 
 
Quote:

 
I'm still waiting for an IEM that has a dynamic driver for the bass and an armature for the highs, how hard can it be?

The UE Super.fi 5 EB may very well have been the first to do this, AFAIK. But to me, it didnt sound all that impressive at all. Perhaps they needed to have spent more time perfecting the design / implementation? Wonder if the boys at UE are planning to do?
 

 

[kiteki]

 
Quote:

Really cant agree with this as its a grossly exaggerated generalization. There are certainly dynamics which sound worse than even the lowest qualty BA drivers and vice versa. Plus, some may just prefer the BA sound in comparison to a dynamic, provided they are of the relative same quality.
 
 

Um...... if you read my post more carefully you'll notice I'm simply alluding to the fact that BA's tend to reach high levels in unison, but a single BA driver by itself has a hard time competing against the top-tier dynamic drivers and I think this fact is revealing of their true nature, the only counter-argument are the single BA driver offerings from Final Audio, but as I have heard the Heaven SB which is tiered on a similiar plane as the Heaven A1 and the SS I'm cynical to the fact that the SS will sound that much better than the SB but I can't really say that for sure until I hear the SS which will probably never happen, at least not locally!
 
If you're going to interject with the ER-4P well yes I agree that driver sounds really good but it really requires a couple BA buddies to take care of the lower hertzez and that's when you start getting good sound quality in customs that cost around $500.
 

 
 
 
 

 

[kiteki]

and by the way, let me deviate with a highly subjective and colourful statement for a moment:
 
 
I'm listening to the EX600 right now and it crushes the ER-4P all over the place, it's like listening to full-size blaring floor speakers versus 10cm tall logitechs, it's like Usain Bolt competing against Jennifer Lopez in a 100m sprint, it's like technicolor ice-cream versus plain vanilla, it's like passionfruit vodka versus fermented tap water in Sierra Leone. 

 

[Heret1c]

Quote:

 

Um...... if you read my post more carefully you'll notice I'm simply alluding to the fact that BA's tend to reach high levels in unison, but a single BA driver by itself has a hard time competing against the top-tier dynamic drivers and I think this fact is revealing of their true nature, the only counter-argument are the single BA driver offerings from Final Audio, but as I have heard the Heaven SB which is tiered on a similiar plane as the Heaven A1 and the SS I'm cynical to the fact that the SS will sound that much better than the SB but I can't really say that for sure until I hear the SS which will probably never happen, at least not locally!
 
If you're going to interject with the ER-4P well yes I agree that driver sounds really good but it really requires a couple BA buddies to take care of the lower hertzez and that's when you start getting good sound quality in customs that cost around $500.
 
 

Well, if you articulate it like that, then it makes sense. But your earlier statement was a single-sentenced generalization. Which is why i simply could not agree with it. But my third sentence in that reply also holds that if the BA driver and dynamic driver are at the same relative quality / tier / whatever you want to call it, the winner would ultimately be based on which sound sig you prefer, IMO.
 
 


Quote:

and by the way, let me deviate with a highly subjective and colourful statement for a moment:
 
 
I'm listening to the EX600 right now and it crushes the ER-4P all over the place, it's like listening to full-size blaring floor speakers versus 10cm tall logitechs, it's like Usain Bolt competing against Jennifer Lopez in a 100m sprint, it's like technicolor ice-cream versus plain vanilla, it's like passionfruit vodka versus fermented tap water in Sierra Leone. 

Umm...ok....
 
 

 

[kiteki]

That's OK I just thought it should be obvious I wasn't comparing a crap dynamic with a good BA and that information should be superfluous.
 
 
By the way why did the guy that started this tread ban himself?
 
He seemed like a nice guy all I can imagine is his father told him he was spending way too much time on head-fi.

 

[Heret1c]

^ Im nitpicking here but you said : " A single dynamic driver is vastly superior to any single BA driver in existence."
 
So NO. It wasn't obvious, at least not to me.
 
I would also like to add that just because a BA needs a second / third driver to handle the "lower hertzs" doesn't necessarily means it lacks in quality simply because it doesn't have that 'oomph' in the bass. More likely it lacks quantity mostly.

 

[Heret1c]

^ Im nitpicking here but you said : " A single dynamic driver is vastly superior to any single BA driver in existence."
 
So NO. It wasn't obvious, at least not to me.
 
I would also like to add that just because a BA needs a second / third driver to handle the "lower hertzs" doesn't necessarily means it lacks in quality simply because it doesn't have that 'oomph' in the bass. More likely it lacks quantity mostly.

 

[kiteki]

Hm good point, it lacks quantity, but has quality in a limited range!
 
 
 
You know, it's interesting that Final Audio insist on only using a single driver in their IEM's, I truly wonder what the mysterious engineers at Final Audio think of the JH16.
 
 
Edit: To return to objectivity for a moment... the Ety ER-4S did have a tiny little bit more air than the EX600. :/

 

[Pianist]

Well, I found the bass on ER4 to be one of the most impressive low ends I heard in headphones. Yes, the bass on the Etys is rather quiet, but I think that with a strong source and some EQ'ing, it can be adjusted to sound very nice, present and powerful. It doesn't have much impact, but it is incredibly tight, razor sharp and it goes very, very low. I don't think the majority of headphones out there can do the the sub bass quite like the Etys. It's incredibly well defined, really detailed and just super accurate IMO. Only the best headphones can compete with ER4 in bass quality IMO.